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Old May 6, 2013, 05:24 AM   #1
billtheshrink
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peroxide and vinegar

A friend of mine from the range said he uses equal parts of white vinegar and peroxide to clean his weapons. I tried it and cut cleaning time in half for me . ANOTHER friend said NO, that these are acidic and will eat away and the bore. I said to coat it all with oil when done.

ANY THOUGHTS?

Last edited by billtheshrink; May 6, 2013 at 06:37 AM.
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Old May 6, 2013, 06:54 AM   #2
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Not good ones.
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Old May 6, 2013, 07:02 AM   #3
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With all the stuff out there that's made to clean guns, why fiddle around with something that might or might not damage your gun?
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Old May 6, 2013, 07:32 AM   #4
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B/P shooters use vinegar to remove bluing for an authentic "frontier" look when defarbing for re enactments! I wonder what peroxide does after the vinegar has removed the blue?
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Old May 6, 2013, 08:04 AM   #5
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Was he shooting corrosive ammo?
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Old May 6, 2013, 08:46 AM   #6
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I just don't get it - in all the years I've been cleaning my guns, I simply use hoppes solvent, or sometimes break-free clp when I'm doing a quick clean while shooting.

My hoppes solvent seems to last forever and is therefore a very cheap product to use. It works great, and doesn't harm anything. Why are folks always mixing up these weird concoctions to try to clean their guns? It's not like trying to clean a chimney stack with 30 years of built-up creosote.
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Old May 6, 2013, 09:06 AM   #7
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That mixture of peroxide and vinegar is often used to clean the lead out of .22 suppressors. It's called "the dip" and I've heard it works very well. I personally haven't tried it, but supposedly it will destroy aluminum.

Here's the reason I haven't tried it: Normally, lead can only be absorbed through ingesting it, so it's relatively easy to avoid lead poisoning with a few precautions. However, when you use the dip to remove lead it produces lead acetate, which allows the the lead to be absorbed directly into your skin.

I would highly recommend you not clean your guns this way. It's extremely toxic and may damage your guns.
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Old May 6, 2013, 09:51 AM   #8
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I heard of people doing that to barrels of guns like Glocks, XDs, and M&Ps. Just to get it to be polished instead of having a finish on it. It strips the finish right off if it's in there long enough.


IMO that's like cleaning your car with brake fluid.
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Old May 6, 2013, 01:16 PM   #9
ClydeFrog
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Better mousetraps...

I've heard of nearly everything from motor oil to Vagisil, yes, Vagisil to clean-oil firearms, .
Top gun care products are not complex or hard to find.
Gun owners & shooters seem to always need to obtain a secret sauce or new high tech CLP.
Good cleaning & gun care products include: Gunzilla, Ballistol, LPX, Slip2000, Weaponshield, Birchwood-Casey Synthetic Gun Cleaner, Hoppes #9, Eezox.

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Old May 6, 2013, 02:04 PM   #10
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The only "Odd Cleaner" I ever use is old-fashioned "White Toothpaste" for those bores I have that are especially rough and tend to build up copper and lead.

It does work well in small amounts.
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Old May 6, 2013, 05:13 PM   #11
g.willikers
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That combination will definitely dissolve lead.
I tried in on airgun pellets, just to see.
After about 12 hours, the pellets had turned to mush.
It might be useful in restoring a really mistreated, leaded up barrel.
With precautions.
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Old May 6, 2013, 07:33 PM   #12
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Quote:
peroxide and vinegar
A friend of mine from the range said he uses equal parts of white vinegar and peroxide to clean his weapons. I tried it and cut cleaning time in half for me . ANOTHER friend said NO, that these are acidic and will eat away and the bore. I said to coat it all with oil when done.

ANY THOUGHTS?
What kind of guns is he cleaning and how bad do they need cleaning. Rinse well after use, I see no problem using it on a swab but I wouldn't dunk my gun in it. Cleaning cases especially if you used black powder in them is good as long as you only soak a few minutes and rinse well afterwards. I don't think it will leach out the zinc like ammonia does. Better yet use it for cleaning mold up from showers. around any water fittings under the sink etc.
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Old May 7, 2013, 12:41 AM   #13
Merad
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Vinegar is acetic acid. If you miss any then it will definitely attack the steel of the gun. Not sure about peroxide. I can't see why you'd want to risk it.
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Old May 7, 2013, 07:58 AM   #14
Mike Irwin
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There have been numerous reports over the years of people suffering SEVERE bore damage from using this combination.

I wouldn't.


And, as someone else noted, you're creating a highly toxic compound, lead acetate. Disposing of this in the garbage or down the drain is illegal in most areas.
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Old May 7, 2013, 08:20 AM   #15
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Like any other product, vinegar and peroxide has it's own set of rules and cautions.

I'm not going to say that it's the best, nor am I going to carry a flag for it's use. I am going to offer facts, since I can't stand to see things bantered around wily nilly with no basis in reality. Each person should weigh the pros and cons themselves.

Vinegar and Peroxide works. it attacks lead very quickly and can be used to clean a heavily leaded bore, and also can be very useful for getting that fine "lead smear" or lead fog from a barrel.

1. Yes, it is an acid, and yes it can eat away at the bores. How to handle this.
- First, Use only on Stainless steel. there are problems using it with blued steel.
- Second, don't leave the stuff in there for hours and hours. The reaction takes only a very few minutes to do the majority of the work, then dump it out.

2. Residue: Lead acecate is not the end all evil that it's been made out to be. It's used in all kinds of dyes and is still used in certain paints.
It's problematic, but there are some cases where it's the only thing that gets the job done.
- It is toxic to eat, just like the lead paint in old homes that you're not supposed to eat either. Don't drink it, don't pour it down the drain.
- the danger comes from it being in solution. your skin will absorb it in this form. that IS bad for you. Wear gloves. Keep it off your skin.

3. Disposal. Lead acetate can be disposed of properly through the normal household hazardous waste channels.

3a. caveat - you don't need 5 gallons of the stuff to clean a bore. you need about 1/4 cup. dump the used solution in a 1/2 cup of CLR or battery acid to render it mostly inert (if you live in a rural area with limited facilities).

If you really want to take care of it well, boil off the water and vinegar - the lead acetate will come out of solution. then mix it in with some leftover latex paint and let that dry. this will encapsulate it and prevent it from going back into solution.

Most of the gun cleaning chemicals out there are just a hazardous to people as lead acetate. they each have their own set of rules to be used safely. Dumping patches soaked in super bore cleaner preventative #xxx in the garbage is just as toxic in it's own way.

Last edited by anothernewb; May 7, 2013 at 08:32 AM.
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Old May 7, 2013, 09:00 AM   #16
Hunter Customs
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anothernewb,
Great post with good information.

I know of competition shooters that used the mixture to remove the Lead from their compensators, it will do that.
Some also learned what it will do to the bluing on their gun.

Best Regards
Bob Hunter
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Old May 7, 2013, 10:03 AM   #17
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Quote:
vinegar and peroxide has it's own set of rules and cautions
Yup, it's called a Material Safety Data Sheet. Below is only one example for acetic acid and peroxide (peracetic acid). There are several others.

http://msds.fmc.com/msds/100000010696-msds_us-e.pdf
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Old May 7, 2013, 10:10 AM   #18
Gaerek
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Quote:
1. Yes, it is an acid, and yes it can eat away at the bores. How to handle this.
- First, Use only on Stainless steel. there are problems using it with blued steel.
- Second, don't leave the stuff in there for hours and hours. The reaction takes only a very few minutes to do the majority of the work, then dump it out.

2. Residue: Lead acecate is not the end all evil that it's been made out to be. It's used in all kinds of dyes and is still used in certain paints.
It's problematic, but there are some cases where it's the only thing that gets the job done.
- It is toxic to eat, just like the lead paint in old homes that you're not supposed to eat either. Don't drink it, don't pour it down the drain.
- the danger comes from it being in solution. your skin will absorb it in this form. that IS bad for you. Wear gloves. Keep it off your skin.

3. Disposal. Lead acetate can be disposed of properly through the normal household hazardous waste channels.

3a. caveat - you don't need 5 gallons of the stuff to clean a bore. you need about 1/4 cup. dump the used solution in a 1/2 cup of CLR or battery acid to render it mostly inert (if you live in a rural area with limited facilities).

If you really want to take care of it well, boil off the water and vinegar - the lead acetate will come out of solution. then mix it in with some leftover latex paint and let that dry. this will encapsulate it and prevent it from going back into solution.
...or just use Hoppes #9?

That's a lot of work to use something for a problem that can be solved by other products.
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Old May 7, 2013, 10:27 AM   #19
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There are a lot of scare stories about hydrogen peroxide (H2O2). I did some tests for another forum and debunked them all. A few minutes, or even longer, exposure to it on gun metals does nothing except clean. Store bought h2o2 is weak compared to industrial strength stuff. I use it to clean black powder residue. Works great.
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Old May 7, 2013, 10:37 AM   #20
Mike Irwin
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"There are a lot of scare stories about hydrogen peroxide (H2O2)."

Ok, so that's half the question.

What did you do with the vinegar? Put it on your salad?
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Old May 7, 2013, 03:23 PM   #21
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What did you do with the vinegar? Put it on your salad?
Yes. With olive oil.
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Old May 7, 2013, 06:39 PM   #22
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I read something similar to this concerning older GIs using hot soapy water to clean thier M-1 Garands.

why would any one do such a thing?
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Old May 7, 2013, 08:17 PM   #23
Constantine
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Quote:
I read something similar to this concerning older GIs using hot soapy water to clean thier M-1 Garands.
I've heard something similar. But this is more modern. Polymer guns in dish washers.
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Old May 7, 2013, 08:29 PM   #24
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True story....

Something I posted before in gun forums is a item I read in a LE only textbook I got as a MP in the early 1990s.
A police officer in a small town put his issue 4" barrel revolver in a washing machine!!!!

The Calibre Press book even had photos of the event. It just shows not everyone is on the same page about gun care .

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Old May 7, 2013, 08:43 PM   #25
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Quote:
I read something similar to this concerning older GIs using hot soapy water to clean thier M-1 Garands.

why would any one do such a thing?
Hot, soapy water is the ages old cleaner for black powder residue, and the perchlorate salts from corrosive primers.

THe residue has to be fresh for it to work best.

Hot soapy water dissolves the salts and lets them be flushed away. Hot water evaporates quickly (the hotter the faster) so it doesn't harm the steel.

Hot soapy water is often available when supplies of specific cleaners are not, and is much better than not cleaning at all.

The correct process to follow is clean with hot soapy water, rinse, dry (where needed) then clean again with regular cleaning solvents, the usual way. Oil (or your chosen lube) afterwards.
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