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Old January 27, 2012, 06:10 PM   #1
wirebyr
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Radom P35

1st ... hello all
2nd ... have a trade offer for a Radom p35, but I'm not sure what it is ... my research conflicts with the markings ... any help is appreciated ...
pics attached ... of special interest is the eagle marking .... doesnt look like a waffen or polish eagle ... help
P35 (1).JPG

P35 (2).JPG
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Old January 27, 2012, 11:25 PM   #2
James K
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Better pictures and more info would help. That mark is supposed to be an eagle/swastika proof mark though a non-standard one. York's book shows that style of eagle on bnz pistols of the second K series. In spite of some good research, there is an awful lot still unknown about those pistols.

Jim
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Old January 28, 2012, 08:47 AM   #3
wirebyr
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Thanks for the reply
my pics are high res, but i had to shrink them down so they could be posted ... more info? ... not sure what you want ... the serial numbers are 4 digits, with no alpha character ... slide, frame and barrel all match ... i was thinking a type III or a mix of type III / IV ???
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Old January 29, 2012, 12:59 AM   #4
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That is certainly odd since AFAIK the letter prefix was continued right up to the end of production at Znaim. The only other four digit no letter guns were the early Polish production, and the first production under the Germans when they started numbering over. The first Z series went to the second A series with no "letterless" numbers between.

But yours has the Znaim wood groved grips, no slot, no takedown lever, probably the large screws without bushings, called Type IIIa by some writers if the bnz pistols are Type IV. (The typing is not consistent and not rigid since changes were phased in and flowed into another with no absolute cutoffs.)

One thing that would help would be a good picture of the serial number. If you want, put a piece of gummed paper over the last number.

By some standards, those are the latest, crudest and least desireable of the Radoms, but some collectors will pay high dollar for the late guns, especially the bnz guns as they are uncommon.

Jim
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Old January 29, 2012, 06:51 PM   #5
Kman1974
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Question on P35

Hi.. I hate to jump in on someone else's thread, but seeing how it involves the P35 and people are answering lately I was hoping I was not breaking protocol.. Anyway.. I acquired a Radom a few years ago and had not looked at it all that much til now, I tried to do some research back then, but it seemed there was not a lot out there or I looked in the wrong places.. ... The s/n is S13xx it has brown possibley wooden grips, so from reading the pages I have found the last few days it might be a Grade 4.. sigh.. But my question is the slide does not lock back even with the magazine inserted.. I was wondering if there was a common reason for that or did someone file down the notch on the slide farting around and now it won't stay.. Any ideas...??

Thanks..
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Old January 30, 2012, 10:17 AM   #6
Dino.
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Quote:
But my question is the slide does not lock back even with the magazine inserted.
Can you manually lock it back with the slide release?
Might just be a bad mag.
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Old January 30, 2012, 10:18 AM   #7
Dino.
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Quote:
That is certainly odd since AFAIK the letter prefix was continued right up to the end of production at Znaim. The only other four digit no letter guns were the early Polish production, and the first production under the Germans when they started numbering over. The first Z series went to the second A series with no "letterless" numbers between.

But yours has the Znaim wood groved grips, no slot, no takedown lever, probably the large screws without bushings, called Type IIIa by some writers if the bnz pistols are Type IV. (The typing is not consistent and not rigid since changes were phased in and flowed into another with no absolute cutoffs.)

One thing that would help would be a good picture of the serial number. If you want, put a piece of gummed paper over the last number.

By some standards, those are the latest, crudest and least desireable of the Radoms, but some collectors will pay high dollar for the late guns, especially the bnz guns as they are uncommon.

Jim
I agree with this based on all the research I did on my own Radom.
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Old January 30, 2012, 02:36 PM   #8
Kman1974
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No Dino.. it does not lock back manually.. it's like the notch on the slide is not square enough, if you know what I mean.. I have not taken it apart yet, mabye it needs a good cleaning.. I am relatively sure the previous owner did not know how to take it apart... The magazine also is fairly dinged up on the lower half, but after reading some other posts I have a feeling mags are very far and few between...
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Old January 30, 2012, 03:19 PM   #9
Dino.
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Kman,
From what I remember, there were two variations on the way the notches were cut on these slides.

Here's a pic of mine, if that helps.



I'm only guessing that it may be your mag because I've had similar experiences with my 1911 and found the mag to be the culprit.
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Old January 30, 2012, 10:27 PM   #10
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Since the spring tension on the Radom slide stop is provided through the recoil spring guide, it is possible that the slide stop has been worn (or more likely messed with) so the surface on the slide stop pin has been misshapen and is not allowing the magazine follower to push the slide stop up. The problem could also be in the magazine follower, either damaged or not coming up properly.

There is no inherent problem in the Radom that would cause the slide lockback to fail.

Jim
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Old January 31, 2012, 09:52 PM   #11
Kman1974
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Let me work on getting a picture of my slide and slide stop...
Thanks for your responses so far..
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Old February 1, 2012, 01:31 AM   #12
OcelotZ3
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My type 4 Radom has a slide lock issue too.

If hand-racking the slide, it locks back with a mag in.

If the mag is ejected, it will unlock the slide.

If no mag is in and the slide manually locked back, it will self-unlock after a half second or so.

When shooting, it won't lock back on empty 70% of the time as apparently the recoil is severe enough that it overcomes the follower spring.

I came to the conclusion that the slide catch slot wasn't cut square enough (like kman).
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Old February 1, 2012, 07:34 AM   #13
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For internet pictures I set my camera using the function settings to the lowest resolution 640X480 then no downsizing needed. Have a 1943 Radom with takedown lever, 2 magazines and BNZ 1943 marked holster.

Added a picture of a now deceased vet bring back Radom from the Battle of the Bulge

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Old February 1, 2012, 10:06 AM   #14
Dino.
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Quote:
My type 4 Radom has a slide lock issue too.

If hand-racking the slide, it locks back with a mag in.

If the mag is ejected, it will unlock the slide.

If no mag is in and the slide manually locked back, it will self-unlock after a half second or so.

When shooting, it won't lock back on empty 70% of the time as apparently the recoil is severe enough that it overcomes the follower spring.

I came to the conclusion that the slide catch slot wasn't cut square enough (like kman).
You could be right ...
I've read somewhere that the "type 4" Radoms were produced towards the end of the war when the Germans tried to speed up production by omitting things like the take down latch and that the overall quality was pretty crude.
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Old February 1, 2012, 10:30 AM   #15
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How to lock back your Radom Slide

Guys: I have read all your "posts" on having problems locking back your
pistols (radom) slide. On the late produced Radoms the slide is locked back by lifting up on the hammer drop lever while holding the slide back, thus the
slide will lock on a notch cut on the hammer. To drop the slide, just depress
the hammer drop lever. I hope this helps. I have owned a lot of radoms in my
life (I'm 67 years old) they are a great firearm!! I have heard that toward the
end of production (Jan thru April 45) some radoms were produced without
even the hammer drop lever, I have never seen one, though I would like
to as it must be impossible to hold back the slide. By the way the only real
"weakness" in the radom is on the end of the recoil rod. I have bought more
than a few of them thru the years where they were either broken off or wore
off.
Regards
Dakotaern
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Old February 1, 2012, 12:08 PM   #16
Dino.
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Quote:
Guys: I have read all your "posts" on having problems locking back your pistols (radom) slide. On the late produced Radoms the slide is locked back by lifting up on the hammer drop lever while holding the slide back, thus the slide will lock on a notch cut on the hammer. To drop the slide, just depress the hammer drop lever. I hope this helps. I have owned a lot of radoms in my life (I'm 67 years old) they are a great firearm!! I have heard that toward the end of production (Jan thru April 45) some radoms were produced without even the hammer drop lever, I have never seen one, though I would like to as it must be impossible to hold back the slide. By the way the only real "weakness" in the radom is on the end of the recoil rod. I have bought more than a few of them thru the years where they were either broken off or wore off.
Regards
Dakotaern

Dakotaem,
I can't even envision the "hammer drop" lever being able to lock back the slide.
To the best of my knowledge, towards the end of production, they began producing them without the take down latch, not the hammer drop lever. FWIW, the slide stop on my Radom functions very similar to my 1911.
This is what locks back the slide on mine.

I agree with your comments regarding the recoil spring/rod assembly.
I purchased a spare for mine, and then learned that there were actually two different types produced. One with a captured spring and an internal spring rod, and the other a more conventional looking captured spring assembly without the internal spring rod.

Apparently there were many variations of these pistols manufactured during the war. I love mine ... though I don't shoot it all that often, it's proven to be very reliable and pretty accurate!




Radom / 1911 Comparison

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Old February 1, 2012, 04:57 PM   #17
James K
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Two different meanings of "lock back". Dakotaern is talking about locking the slide back for takedown, while the others are talking about the slide locking open (or not as the case may be) on an empty magazine.

In the first meaning, dakotaern is correct. In the late pistols without the takedown lever (looks like the 1911 safety), the slide is held back for disassembly by turning the hammer drop lever down so its tail fits into a notch at the top of the hammer.

But failure of the slide stop to hold the slide back on an empty magazine is a different situation; the Radom operates much like the 1911, and is subject to the same problems, although much exacerbated by poor quality control under wartime conditions, not to mention deliberate sabotage at Radom. The Poles, for some silly reason, sometimes forgot to harden the parts properly, and things didn't get much better when production was finally transferred to Czechoslovakia. (During German occupation, Radom produced all the parts except barrels, which were made at Steyr/Znaim for security reasons.)

Edited to add: I have read about, but never seen, a Radom with no hammer drop lever. Neither Berger nor York mention such a variation. Still, FWIW, disassembly is possible without locking the slide back, simply by grasping te pistol with the thumb under the tang and the fingers wrapped around the top of the slide. The fingers pull the slide back to the proper takedown position and the left hand pulls the recoil spring guide forward, letting the slide stop fall free.

Jim
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Last edited by James K; February 1, 2012 at 05:09 PM.
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Old February 4, 2012, 01:32 PM   #18
Kman1974
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Hey guys.. thanks for all of your replies and those nice pics of your P35's.. I THINK I found the problem with my slide not locking back.. I was the one with the initial posting for that..
I did take it apart for the very first time and what it looks like is on the slide at the notch where it should be nice and squared off somehow there is a dimple that makes it a tad rounded... Looks to be man-made, for what reason who knows.. For the life of me I can't get a picture of it.. It is just too small and precise.. So for now it would work to shoot it just won't lock back.. I could ask my friend who is a machinist to carefully grind it down to take that dimple out and make it square again.. The slide s/n does match the frame, so I would not want to ditch it.. That being said is there an avenue to buy parts or are they too hard to come by....
Again thanks again for all your posts on this issue.. Kent
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Old February 22, 2012, 01:36 PM   #19
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Radom P35 References

Can any recommend any books or other references on the history of these pistols ? It would be much appreciated.
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Old February 22, 2012, 03:18 PM   #20
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The Radom VIS book by York seems to be as good as any although I personally do not have it.

http://www.amazon.com/VIS-Radom-Phot...9941858&sr=8-3
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