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Old February 24, 2013, 09:18 PM   #26
gundog5
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i have owened GSPs for 30 years and here is my .02. There are two distinct breed variations of the breed. The dark heavy boned (DHB) and the mostly white lighter boned (WLB). I have owened both. The DHBs would hunt at a modest trot all day every day normally from 30-60 yards in front of you. The WLBs were bred for field trials and they would cover large tracks of land. All were/are excellent hunters. The DHBs are easier to train as they are less hiper but the WLB once trained are just flat out beautiful to watch and are also great hunters. They both make great pets as well but the DHPs are mush less inclined to distroy things when left alone, as a matter of fact, I have never had a DHP chew up anything in the house but sadly I can't say the same for the WLBs. In addition, the DHBs are fierce defenders of the home.

p.s. also, never ever let your dog roam, he/she will never be the same, and teach your new hunting partner the best you can and spend the money on a GOOD trainer, you will never regreat it.

Last edited by gundog5; February 24, 2013 at 09:25 PM.
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Old February 25, 2013, 08:13 AM   #27
Saltydog235
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What about WHB dogs? Or DLB dogs, how do they fit in? I've had and have both of those variations as well. Fact of the matter is I've had a GSP in about every variation, coat color and bone size they come in. Every one of them has been an individual with their own personality. Every one of them is trainable and eager to please. Every one of them has been biddable and smart and an excellent family dog. And every one of them has loved to hunt provided I took the time to introduce them to it and work with them some on it. Bone structure has absolutely nothing to do with the make-up or docility of the dog. I had a female who was the best do I ever had and was big boned and heavily ticked absolutely destroy an entire Lay-Z-Boy recliner, ate it to the frame because I left her home alone.
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Old February 25, 2013, 01:21 PM   #28
gundog5
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Saltydog235, wasn't trying to get into a urination contest and was not trying to imply one type of shorthair was better or worse then the other. But was pointing out my personal experence and research on the breed. Are there big bone white, small bone darks, yep, but, my experence tells me that if I want a GSP that will hunt in front of the gun I will search out a good breeder of heavier boned GSPs. On the other hand, if I am looking for a wide ranging full of energy hunter, I will search out a breeder who specializes in the lighter boned (often white) GSPs. Are there execptions YES, did i mean otherwise, no.

Last edited by Brian Pfleuger; February 27, 2013 at 06:10 PM.
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Old February 26, 2013, 11:48 AM   #29
Saltydog235
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I wasn't intending for it to be a urination match either. My implication was that of all the GSP's I have had over the years, every single one of them has been an individual with strengths and weaknesses. I've had big boned dogs that worked fast and wanted to range out if given their head and I've had small boned dogs that would work close enough for a geriatric with a walker to hunt behind. One of my best was a little male from field trial stock that after running the dumb off of (he got so jacked up about hunting he went crazy until he ran off some energy) but would then settle in and work the perfect ranges for walking hunters. I had a big boned male that you just about had to electrocute or he'd range too far away, dern dog almost caught a deer one day but a good shock collar cured him of that. Had one that would only pick up a dead bird by the head and prance around on his tip toes to show it off.

GSP's of all shapes and sizes will do what you want them to do once you train them to do that. It has nothing to do with the size or bone structure of the dog.

Last edited by Brian Pfleuger; February 27, 2013 at 06:10 PM.
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Old February 26, 2013, 03:30 PM   #30
CurlyQ.Howard
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One more thing about my GSP: he was the easiest dog to train (and I had no previous experience) as he would respond to voice, whistle, or hand signals. He was a 70 pound big boned GSP - not a pretty 50 pounder, but other than that, I could not have asked for a better dog.
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Old February 26, 2013, 04:02 PM   #31
wooly booger
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I love German Shorthairs but have little experience bird hunting over them. I have bird hunted all over KY, IN, IL, and TN over English Pointers and Setters and Brittanies. I have heard good and bad about GSP's characteristics and think one would be interesting. I know a few people in MT that had them as pets as as long as they got plenty of exercise they were great.

I will say that any dog will destroy furniture, shoes, curtains, etc. if they are not kept busy or left alone. My buddy had a Lab that ate his coffee table as well as the rear screen door of his house. I saw where a pair of Jack Russel Terriers literally ate a couch one day.
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Old February 26, 2013, 08:13 PM   #32
buck460XVR
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Quote:
i have owened GSPs for 30 years and here is my .02. There are two distinct breed variations of the breed. The dark heavy boned (DHB) and the mostly white lighter boned (WLB). I have owened both. The DHBs would hunt at a modest trot all day every day normally from 30-60 yards in front of you. The WLBs were bred for field trials and they would cover large tracks of land.
I haven't owned GSPs for 30 years, but had several from the Mid-Sixties until Ziggy died in 1983. Since then I have owned GWPs. While you may feel there are two distinct variations of the breed, I assume both variations, like Drahthaars and GWPs are genetically indistinguishable. My experience with the two variations you speak of are totally different than yours. Back in the sixties and seventies, the long legged, big boned, deep chested individuals with the large square head were generally registered FDSB and were the field trialers. Back then there was no NAVHDA for the Continental Breeds. If you wanted to compete and get titles you had to run your Shorthairs with the setters. Since Shorthairs primarily use ground scent with their heads to the ground when looking for birds as compared to the heads up high Setters that use airborn scent, they were slower and thus a disadvantage for timed trials. Breeders thought that by breeding long winded, long legged individuals, that not only would they be faster on the move, but they thought by getting the head up farther from the ground the dogs may switch to airborn. They also bred them for large box shaped noses for more olfactory cells and more air intake. The dogs never did bring their heads up, and the breeders ended up with large dogs that could work all day at a Shorthair pace. While they still were slower than the setters, they would out work them in the field on a all day hunt, cause they would tire. The smaller, more petite individuals were basically bred for show and AKC registered. They were smaller and finer boned so they fit in kennels and traveled well. They did not need the long legs nor did they need the huge box shaped heads for smell in the show arena, but the lack of them was a distinct disadvantage in the field. To this day, I hate the look of a pointed nose on some Shorthairs. I never did see a color preference to either as some my large boned hunters were mostly white with very little ticking, while others were heavily ticked. In the early seventies, test and trials for "versatile" type hunting dogs came to be in America(had been for years in Germany and Canada) and the GSPs, GWPs and other Continental breeds had a competition of their own. As evidence of how new the Continental Breeds are to the U.S., in the 1972 remake of "The Biscuit Eater" the film makers used a GWP as the "Feral" dog turned bird dog.......because it looked like a mutt and not many folks even knew the breed existed.
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Old February 26, 2013, 09:02 PM   #33
Saltydog235
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That was a good read Buck, learned some things I didn't know in detail. Thanks for posting that.
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Old February 28, 2013, 05:44 PM   #34
markj
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I kinda like the shorthairs. Cant beat em in the field or at home. Mine hunt harder than most and at night curl up at my feet.
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Old February 28, 2013, 05:54 PM   #35
gundog5
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Buck, you are right, we have had totally different experences with the breed. I bred GHPs for a number of years strictly for hunting behind the foot hunter. I have had 4 heavy boned dark males and when bred to larger heave boned bitches the pups were great hunters for the walking hunter. Tried several very expensive bitches from field trial stock ( as identified on their pedigree) all were smaller and lighter in bone. The pups were also excellent hunters but needed to run them a mile or two before hunting as they would bump a bunch of birds until they got their heads into it. Even then you really had to get moving to get a shot in range before the bird snuck off. As for your comments about show stock being the smaller lighter GSPs, I also had Flat Coated retrivers which I hunted and showed. GSPs were a large group and they came in all shapes and sizes. I recommend to someone looking for a hunting companion and house pet to check around and look at breeded who specilizes in GSPs for the hunter who plans on hunting on foot and stay away from the field trial breaders unless you want a high energy dog.
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Old March 2, 2013, 09:51 AM   #36
buck460XVR
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Buck, you are right, we have had totally different experences with the breed.

Goes to show that bird dogs, like people, are all different, with different personality traits, intelligence and natural abilities, even when they come from the same parents. While selective breeding can lessen the chance of undesirable characteristics and improve the odds of that the dog will be a good example of the breed, it does not guarantee the dog will be outstanding. Even with the best breeding a dog, like a child, needs discipline, guidance and training.
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