The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Tactics and Training

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old January 24, 2012, 08:37 AM   #76
batmann
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 14, 2004
Location: Greenwood, IN
Posts: 689
Against my better judgement I will jump into this with both feet. The OP asked which way to go, caliber or capacity. My HD gun is a Glock 22 with a Streamlight TLR-3. IMHO, the weapon you choose should be one you are the most familiar with and can shoot well. Bells and whistles are great on the range, but when the moment comes, that is not the time to remember, do I grab my .45 or my 9MM------
In the middle of a crisis is not the time to grab a handgun you need to remember which one you have and fumble with a safety that may or not be there. Keep it simple and settle one ONE. Take that one and practice until the handling is second nature.
If you mount a weapon light, like I have, shoot it with the light. It does change the balance some, but once you understand the reason for the light, it too will become second nature.
Mindset and tactics are far more important than capacity or even caliber.
batmann is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 02:41 PM   #77
ScotchMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 3, 2011
Posts: 1,359
No one likes to think about the legal aftermath of these things. Let me summarize a few of my beliefs:

-If you go sweeping your house, you are in a weaker legal position than if you get behind cover in the bedroom and call 911. If you have kids to secure, have a plan where you all meet in the same place, then get behind cover and call 911. Let the police do the sweeping and shooting, you shooting is a last resort.
-Shotguns are less legally taboo than handguns. Anyone can buy a shotgun without a permit. I'd rather defend shotgun use than handgun use (but would certainly use whatever was a better tactical choice, regardless of legal outcomes). This is just an opinion, I feel like a DA would be less likely to take a questionable lethal force case if a long arm was used vs. a politically scary handgun.
-Firing one shot is better than firing many. Fire until the threat is neutralized, but techniques such as "two to the chest and one to the head" suggest intent to kill and not intent to neutralize the threat. For all you know, the threat would have been neutralized but not dead after one, or two shots.
-Use a flashlight. There's no reason not to (you can mount it on your handgun OR shotgun, or use it independently of a handgun). It is negligent to not identify your target before opening fire.
-Calling 911 should be your TOP priority unless your life is in immediate danger. The first person to call 911 wins a huge battle; you don't want the intruder who you just shot to be the one calling 911 on YOU. If you call 911 before you shoot anyone, you demonstrate that you did not want to use lethal force and did everything you could to avoid doing so (the police weren't here yet). Be sure to identify yourself so when the police come in guns hot they know which guy with a gun is the good guy.

Kathy Jackson (pax) said in her book (and I'm paraphrasing), the only real victory here is if you escape with your entire life intact, and that is not achieved if you spend it in prison or even a large part of it in court.
__________________
Everyday Loadout

NRA Instructor
NRA Member
ScotchMan is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 03:21 PM   #78
manta49
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 15, 2011
Location: N Ireland. UK.
Posts: 1,308
I have a cz 75 19 rd cap and a para-ordnance 14-45. So either would do. But i would go for hi capacity every time. A lot on the forum in debates about carrying in con 1 say that the second it takes to put a round in the chamber could cost you your life. So they would have to agree that the second or a lot more in most cases, it takes to load another mag could cost your life.

Last edited by manta49; January 24, 2012 at 04:29 PM.
manta49 is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 03:25 PM   #79
jimbob86
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 4, 2007
Location: All the way to NEBRASKA
Posts: 6,984
Capacity or Caliber

Both.

Belt fed HMG.



Too Much?

Saiga 12?
__________________
TheGolden Rule of Tool Use: "If you don't know what you are doing, DON'T."

http://nefirearm.com/
jimbob86 is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 03:38 PM   #80
Boncrayon
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 24, 2008
Posts: 504
Another bump in the night question: Ammo Capacity Vs Caliber

Tactical light to blind and the first two laser shots of 9mm Horady Critical Defence or above. 'Nuf Said. 17 rounds is for a street fight. I thought you said home defense.
Boncrayon is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 03:40 PM   #81
Boncrayon
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 24, 2008
Posts: 504
Another bump in the night question: Ammo Capacity Vs Caliber

the 911 and six extra rounds in enough, considering adrelgin and follow through. Think a 6 second window of time.
Boncrayon is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 04:45 PM   #82
manta49
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 15, 2011
Location: N Ireland. UK.
Posts: 1,308
It also depends on the threat. One guy or four, one guy possibly then 1911 with eight rounds might be enough. But the fact is you don't how many and what they will be armed with. Take here for example if terrorists are coming to your house for your guns or for you they came well armed ak 47 ect and in numbers.

So what would i rather have a 9mm cz with 19 rds or a 1911 with 8 rds i think the answer is obvious.
manta49 is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 04:50 PM   #83
jimbob86
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 4, 2007
Location: All the way to NEBRASKA
Posts: 6,984
If multiple people show up at your house armed with assault rifles,looking to do you harm, and you answer with a pistol, you are up crap creek without a paddle.
__________________
TheGolden Rule of Tool Use: "If you don't know what you are doing, DON'T."

http://nefirearm.com/
jimbob86 is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 05:14 PM   #84
Glenn E. Meyer
Staff
 
Join Date: November 17, 2000
Posts: 15,792
Not if Bruce Willis is in your canoe!

Anything new being said. Is the OP happy with the answers?

Just curious.
__________________
NRA, TSRA, IDPA, NTI, Polite Soc.
http://www.teddytactical.com/archive...05_Feature.htm
Being an Academic Shooter
http://www.teddytactical.com/archive...11_Feature.htm
Being an Active Shooter
Glenn E. Meyer is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 05:20 PM   #85
manta49
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 15, 2011
Location: N Ireland. UK.
Posts: 1,308
Today, 04:50 PM #83
jimbob86
Senior Member


Join Date: October 4, 2007
Location: All the way to NEBRASKA
Posts: 3,275 If multiple people show up at your house armed with assault rifles,looking to do you harm, and you answer with a pistol, you are up crap creek without a paddle.


Obviously i would rather have a GPMG pointed at the door but you have to make do with what you have.

My point you don't know how Many are coming to your door. So i think its a no -brainer that you want as much ammo in your pistol as possible. You don't want to be changing a mag during a fire fight if possible.
manta49 is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 05:31 PM   #86
jimbob86
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 4, 2007
Location: All the way to NEBRASKA
Posts: 6,984
Quote:
So i think its a no -brainer that you want as much ammo in your pistol as possible.
Faced with multiple people with AK's I think it's a no-brainer you'd want a long gun as opposed to a pistol..... a pump shotgun and buckshot at a minimum.

If I knew there were multiple folks armed with assault rifles coming to my house, I'd want running shoes, above all else.......
__________________
TheGolden Rule of Tool Use: "If you don't know what you are doing, DON'T."

http://nefirearm.com/
jimbob86 is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 06:34 PM   #87
jimbob86
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 4, 2007
Location: All the way to NEBRASKA
Posts: 6,984
What I am saying is that If all I had was a pistol, I'd be complaining.

12 guage. Got that.
__________________
TheGolden Rule of Tool Use: "If you don't know what you are doing, DON'T."

http://nefirearm.com/
jimbob86 is offline  
Old January 24, 2012, 07:21 PM   #88
Nitesites
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 28, 2011
Posts: 600
I hope this won't come across as impetuous but I have to ask why those who reason that extra ammo is unnecessary. And I can't see how one's choice of caliber would have anything to do with this choice either. Are you not considering the possibility of a failed mag? The possibility of missing? The idea of multiple assailants? Why wouldn't you want have an extra mag or two of your personal flavor as insurance against the unknown?

And I really dislike it when I read of statistics used as reasoning in such conversations. Statistics are for beans and for dead people. I say that because that is usually the only time statistics hold any value. Statistics, they don't get shot, stabbed, raped or slaughtered. Victims do though. And then those victims die and become more statistics.
Nitesites is offline  
Old January 25, 2012, 03:44 AM   #89
omkhan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 20, 2008
Location: Karachi, Pakistan
Posts: 117
Around 8 years ago, a friend of mine was surprised by the presence of 3 robbers inside his house's outer perimeter at around 8 pm or so. All he had was a .22 short 8 shot revolver. He fired on them from window and emptied it, reloaded once by going inside the washroom but did not have to fir again as the robbers fled like hell while returning fire aimlessly. No 1 got hit.

Called his friend in LE and the police arrived in 10 mins or so. Of course they were long gone but it turned out that there were actually 7 robbers who fled from the scene.

The thing is if they were determined enough to get him, he would have been toasted as he did not have the capacity nor the caliber but in most home invasions the result may be the same as this one if the owner reacts on time.
omkhan is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:20 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.09477 seconds with 7 queries