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Old January 10, 2011, 10:26 AM   #1
dbooksta
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Best lube for plastic-plastic contact points

I'm working on my AUG trigger pack, which consists of a plastic sear with numerous sticky contact points against a trigger box made of the same plastic. What would be the most durable means of lubricating those plastic-plastic contact points?

I'm not experienced with plastic bearing surfaces, so I don't know what lube will "stick" and perform over repeated use. Looking around my shop I have on hand at least the following:
  • Militec gun grease
  • PTFE spray
  • Graphite (colloidal)
  • hBN powder
  • Smooth-Kote (which I think is a moly solution)
  • BP-2000 (which I think is moly-disulfide powder)
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Old January 10, 2011, 11:16 AM   #2
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Use Quicken® NanoLubrication (the Original NanoLube™). www.diamondlube.com

Ask Rock River Outfitters in IL how it works on polymer surfaces, or Don at Suburban Sporting Goods in Melrose Park IL.

Chris
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Old January 10, 2011, 01:46 PM   #3
mapsjanhere
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I would use only inorganic powder like graphite if you need lube, unless you know exactly what polymers you're dealing with. There are a few polymers that are grease resistant (like the stuff used in plastic gear boxes), but many will swell up upon exposure to hydrocarbon based lubricants, if only after months.
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Old January 10, 2011, 02:45 PM   #4
NanoLube
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1: Apply our NanoLube to surfaces to be treated
2: Cycle parts 100 times or more
3: remove the oil

The synthetic oil I use is the finest available - but then again so is the NanoMaterial we produce and add to the oil. Friction embeds the particles which provide the lubrication - whereby once treated, the oil can be removed.

Chris
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Old January 10, 2011, 08:40 PM   #5
Dfariswheel
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Since the idea of the plastic on plastic trigger is that these engineering grade plastics are entirely self lubricating, I'd question whether a lube might be more of a problem than no lube.

Also keep in mind that some lubricants can attack plastic over time.
My opinion: Steyr specifically designed the trigger to be self-lubricating and no lube is needed or advisable.
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:43 PM   #6
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Post 1 said the plastic was NOT self lubricated but sticky.

As for oils causing problems over time, fine - but read #3 of post 4 as the nanomaterial once embedded, provides self lubricated surfaces after the oil is removed. I am not suggesting anyone buy it - but it is the answer.
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:48 PM   #7
dbooksta
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I know there are compatibility problems with lubes and plastics -- hence the question.

AUGs certainly function reliably without any lubrication in the trigger pack, but the resulting trigger pull is notoriously heavy, sticky, and just awful. Since I've picked it apart to the point where I can see exactly where the sear is sticking I want to do something.

Edit: Not to say I won't try NanoLube either, though it's hard to get useful information for this application off its website....
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Old January 11, 2011, 08:25 PM   #8
Dfariswheel
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The trigger pull on the AUG is a function of the plastic-on-plastic design, not a matter of lubrication.
The AUG was designed to be an ultra-modern assault weapon, and a good trigger was not part of the design concept.
I rather doubt any lube will help, and again, what lubes I'd recommend for a metal trigger unit may not play well with plastic.

If you insist, I'd look at a true synthetic grease.
I can recommend Super Lube grease, which is a Teflon bearing synthetic.
You can buy small tubes to try it from Midway:

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=719267
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Old January 11, 2011, 08:36 PM   #9
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All plastics have oil. A component of the raw material.

Delrin (used on many, many items like roller blade wheels) also has oil and shouldn't need lube.

If you are making parts and feel you need lubricity, look online, you can buy sheets or rods of delrin with teflon impregnated at various percentages. I have experimented with this at work and lost track after 3 million cycles without wear.
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Old January 12, 2011, 02:20 PM   #10
brickeyee
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Quote:
All plastics have oil. A component of the raw material.

Delrin (used on many, many items like roller blade wheels) also has oil and shouldn't need lube.
Made from oil does not mean it contains oil.

While crude oil supplies the basic feed stock for many plastics, the resulting materials have almost nothing in common with oil and do not actually contain any oil that could aid in lubrication.

Even Delrin can benefit from some surface lubrication depending on application.

High surface loads can require lubrication if reasonable forces are needed to move the surfaces past each other.

And like every other materiel, surface finish matters.

Delrin has been used to make locking fasteners by putting a plug into a male threads so that it rubs on the mating female thread (and is actually deformed upon first threading together).
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Old January 12, 2011, 06:28 PM   #11
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Old January 13, 2011, 12:52 AM   #12
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no extra words

Tetragun Grease.
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Old January 13, 2011, 05:49 AM   #13
jughead2
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plastic

there is a partial cure for the aug trigger. i bought one for 25 bucks and it improved the trigger. a simple metal clip that clips on and gives a plastic on metal surface. i will see if i can find the invoice and post the company here. Neu-Trigger@sbcglobal.net found it

Last edited by jughead2; January 13, 2011 at 05:58 AM. Reason: add to it
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Old January 13, 2011, 06:02 AM   #14
JasonG
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I use Smoth-kote and BP2000 on all my plastic parts.

try just the Smoth-kote first. Sometimes both are too slipperry.
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Old January 13, 2011, 10:30 AM   #15
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I would guess that any plastic used by Steyr in trigger parts will have to be essentially immune to bore cleaners and gun oils or they'd have a lot of stuff returning to them. The sticky quality is possibly due to contact deformation under pressure which could add some mechanical interlocking to normal static friction, depending on the shape of the parts. The metal surface should help with that, though simply having one material in a sliding pair harder than and of a dissimilar material to the other usually reduces friction.

The Nanolube idea is new to me and sounds interesting, but I have no experience with it.
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Old January 13, 2011, 11:28 AM   #16
.22lr
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The manual does not seem to mention lubricating the trigger group.

Instead of asking the internet, and people who are selling their OWN wonder product, calling Steyr Arms at (205) 467-6544 or contacting them online.

Is it possible that the "stickiness” is residue of cleaning fluids or other contaminate? Your best bet is probably to contact the manufacturer. I hope this helps.

VR

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Old January 13, 2011, 12:40 PM   #17
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Calling the manufacturer for cleaning instructions is a good idea. If you complain about the functioning, they might even let you send them the trigger group to check over and make sure it meets factory specs and is working normally. Sometimes factories will do that kind of thing free.

But if you conclude you need to do something that improves on their design, like the metal surface addition, any gun manufacturer will be lawyered up and say no. They will say no to lubes they didn't recommend. They will even say no to work by the most reputable custom gunsmith in the country. I can't blame them. I wouldn't want to be held liable for how someone else's device or workmanship functioned, either.
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Old January 13, 2011, 03:49 PM   #18
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Absolutely ask the manufacturer. The nano lube sounds very interesting and if I didn't have about 20 little bottles of miracle lube already, I would probably try some.

Have you considered giving it a good cleaning and then applying (and wiping off) a little Johnson's Paste wax to keep it clean?
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Old January 13, 2011, 04:15 PM   #19
dbooksta
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Unclenick, as always, was right on: I called both Steyr and MSAR tech departments and neither would entertain much talk of any modifications or undocumented lubrication.

I hadn't considered waxing though -- I'll add that to my list of potentials
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Old December 21, 2011, 10:04 AM   #20
NanoLube
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Rock River Outfitters in Illinois can attest to using Quicken®CLP weapons lubricant or NanoLube™ on polymer and polymer/steel combinations. The NanoMaterial coats the friction surfaces and after a couple hundred cycles - the oil is wiped off. Gun Test Magazine rated our product Grade A, and if you would like a PDF of the report, just email me at chris@diamondlube.com

I bought a PT145Pro which has a polymer and steel upper, and it was sticky as normal. Within 10 cycles of the slide most of the stickiness was gone however totally smooth action was achieved within 50 cycles. Most stunning, with the upper locked open it took two thumbs to drop the release and load the round. One drop of our CLP on the spot where slide release touched the upper, and 50 cycles later - I can now drop the release with my PINKY. That one drop alone is worth $25, however there are 300 drops in the bottle. It only costs 8 cents per drop for a slick diamond coating and you cycle the parts to work the material in.

Chris

Last edited by NanoLube; December 21, 2011 at 10:28 AM. Reason: addition at the end
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Old December 21, 2011, 11:08 AM   #21
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[ I can see exactly where the sear is sticking - I want to do something.]

I'm not going to beat a dead horse, only remind you: "Curiousity killed the cat" . .

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Old December 21, 2011, 11:17 AM   #22
brickeyee
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Quote:
The NanoMaterial coats the friction surfaces and after a couple hundred cycles - the oil is wiped off.
And you are absolutely positive that the oil will not cause any long term damage issues for the plastics involved?

Do you have test data?
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