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Old March 29, 2009, 08:10 PM   #1
stephen426
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Texas is Considering Allowing Concealed Carry on College Campuses

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29944438/

This looks like a step in the right direction, but the article is definately not pro-gun. Its hard to believe that a "survivor" of the Virginia Tech shooting would say that he doesn't feel that armed students would not have lowered the casualties. I'd hate to be a sitting duck, just waiting for my turn to be shot. I hope this bill passes and spreads to other states.
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Old March 29, 2009, 08:41 PM   #2
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After Virginia Tech my university (UW-Madison) did a "review" of their security policies. They came out with an adorable looking little pamphlet on what we unarmed students should do in the event of a VT incident. For the most part it was generic stuff like stay calm, call the cops, don't attract attention...

But their report also rattled on about prevention. Don't get me wrong, I think prevention is way better than having to make a call to 911, but this "plan" was supposed to be about what to do after somebody has already started killing people. It basically said bend over and kiss your bum goodbye, but in politically correct terminology.

I'm glad to see that TX is taking a step in the right direction. The more "normal" it becomes the better chances we have of showing people that ccw on campus isn't a scary panic-causing event.
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Old March 29, 2009, 09:00 PM   #3
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I think a place of higher learning is a great chance for the kiddies to show how grown up they think they are.

Utah allows CCW and there haven't been any student shoot outs.

The mature ones will get the permits while the immature will burn permit, gun and ammo money on booze, drugs and going out to eat (and lap dances...I just couldn't resist).

Even college is a self correcting system. The libtard professors will advocate gun carriers when they realize that CCW'ers are a fine line against getting killed. They just have to be shocked into reality.

What we really need (and I do not really mean it...though I kinda do) is for a CCW'er to save some profs life and either be praised or demonized. Either way, guns will be considered as a very good tool for for saving lives....

YES, I have attended college and thank god I escaped with the ability to think for myself. I did not carry, though I felt very naked. Today, I am not so sure I would be willing to be such a good boy.
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Old March 29, 2009, 11:36 PM   #4
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Having graduated from a Texas university, I am all for it. I still have friends there (Sam Houston), and with the prison population that escapes from time to time (you can see death row from campus) I know I certainly wished for the ability. My last semester there, there were a couple of shootings on campus and several instances of violent crime.
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Old March 29, 2009, 11:59 PM   #5
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One thing that rubs me wrong is when people say "kids" when referring to your average college student. Yeah, most are pretty young (and a very few who are indeed under 18), but most are adults capable of making their own decisions. But we also have to consider that there are also some older people who take classes. Then there's the university staff and faculty who are usually much older.
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Old March 30, 2009, 09:50 AM   #6
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Not to be a contrarian but 18-22 year olds are just on the cusp of completing neural development in the areas which inhibit foolish risky actions and promote common sense.

How this feeds into the concealed carry argument is an empirical question.
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Old March 30, 2009, 10:21 AM   #7
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You know, it really amazes me when I see things like this.... and not why you would think.


Everybody bashes NY state as being "liberal" and "anti-gun" but when I look at the laws I don't see it.
We have life-time permits.
Almost all areas of the state issue concealed carry.
There are VERY FEW restrictions on where and when we can carry.
Schools and Universities can issue written permission for carry.
We have what amounts to the "Castle Doctrine".

... and then everybody thinks places like Texas are "pro-gun". Weird, ain't it.
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Old March 30, 2009, 10:34 AM   #8
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I live in Texas,too, and just saw this proposal this week-end in our local paper (amazing in itself since they won't even run an ad to sell a gun). At this point I'm not exactly sure how I feel about arming this segment of the population. If it happens, I would hope that the ones who are responsible enough to go through the concealed-carry classes would also be responsible enough to know when to make use of their license as it was intended. I sort of have doubts that it will pass, one reason being that the woman who introduced and was instrumental in getting passed concealed-carry in the first place is no longer a legislator, and I haven't yet gotten a feel as to what the climate is in the Texas legislature for any promotion of concealed-carry. The pressure not to bring a gun into their individual classrooms by the liberal professors would probably negate much of the effectiveness of this law should it pass. I think it will be an interesting next few months in Texas.
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Old March 30, 2009, 11:25 AM   #9
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TX has a very strong business lobby - they regarded forcing carry privileges anywhere as deterimental to their financial interests for liability. Thus, they would oppose school carry and/or guns in the parking lot.

They are 'conservatives' in the sense that they try to conserve their money. They care little about any civil rights that stand in the way of the profits or risk them.

They play the theoretical 'conservative' property rights issue in a totally hypocritical fashion.
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Old March 30, 2009, 11:26 AM   #10
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Good for Texas !!!! I hope it happens...That being said, " It sounds too good to be true " By the time our liberal anti-gun press gets through with it, Oprah, and her Prez. will put a stop to it somehow,,someway.
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Old March 30, 2009, 05:05 PM   #11
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Even college is a self correcting system. The libtard professors will advocate gun carriers when they realize that CCW'ers are a fine line against getting killed. They just have to be shocked into reality.
THAT is precisely why the anti gun crowd fights against campus carry. Colleges are the center of opinion forming and that's why the left has insisted on dominating them for the last 4 decades or so. They use it to spread the BS of anti 2A mentality, which is the only reason the anti gun movement has had any societal impact whatsoever. If we take away universities as a breeding ground, the anti gun movement will wither and die---which is why we MUST pass campus carry. We must win the war by taking away their numbers; they will not stop any other way.
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Old March 30, 2009, 05:11 PM   #12
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Get your PhDs and become professors!

Yes - that's the way to go!!

Unfortunately, that's a long process and job market stinks but most do anyway. Anybody interested in an academic career - PM me for a real take on it.
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Old March 30, 2009, 05:24 PM   #13
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At this point I'm not exactly sure how I feel about arming this segment of the population.
They are already armed. They must disarm to attend classes legally (or in accordance with school policy, in many states).
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Old March 30, 2009, 05:47 PM   #14
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Not to be a contrarian but 18-22 year olds are just on the cusp of completing neural development in the areas which inhibit foolish risky actions and promote common sense.
There are irresponsible and dumb college students. But there are also some pretty dumb blue/white collar middle aged and older people. The state deems (at least in some states) that you are granted the right to carry at 21. Weather or not you are responsible or decide to take on this responsibility is an individual choice, and not one I feel the state should be making for anybody.
As our understanding of growth and development advances I'm sure that some of the things we currently think are absolute truths will be proven wrong/incomplete.
Quote:
At this point I'm not exactly sure how I feel about arming this segment of the population.
We already are armed (at least I am). Although I can not carry in WI I am armed in my home and on private property. Also, there are quite a few baby boomers on campus. Should I decide to go back to school when I am older (career change, continuing ed., or because it's fun) I don't want to be unarmed simply because I would be older than the average age of the student body.
Then you also have the generally older population of staff and faculty. Professors are usually middle aged and up. What about the janitorial staff who is on campus during the middle of the night?
Quote:
The pressure not to bring a gun into their individual classrooms by the liberal professors would probably negate much of the effectiveness of this law should it pass.
For me I've learned to tune out when a prof starts spewing his political beliefs. It's not that I disagree with him having them or voicing them. I just don't think the classroom is the proper venue to do so. It's concealed carry for a reason.
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Old March 30, 2009, 05:58 PM   #15
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The pressure not to bring a gun into their individual classrooms by the liberal professors would probably negate much of the effectiveness of this law should it pass.
They can't do any such thing. They are instead heavily pressuring the law not to pass because they are leftist authoritarian slimeballs.
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Old March 30, 2009, 08:10 PM   #16
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You also have to be 21 to get your ccw here. By the time you are 21, you have matured somewhat, atleast I did. By the time you spend at leat $250 on your permit, plus gun and ammo cost and practice, I think most people would be a little more responsible when it comes to packin heat.
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Old March 30, 2009, 08:16 PM   #17
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Packing heat = adding insulation to an attic or stacking charcoal bricks/lumps in a grill.
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Old March 30, 2009, 08:27 PM   #18
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they are running this story on www.kvue.com as well,there is a comment section added to the story,sign up and and your own comment.Here is one of the comments that i found very disturbing.

What are the statistics on how many could really protect oneself? We see more people being killed every day. Gun sellers I mean Gun Association is so active. How many people did they save? Human is animal of emotion. When it flares up he or she wants a weapon. Gun serves that purpose and provides killing. You overtake some one. You are shot. Thanks to Gun sellers I mean gun association. You argue. You are dead.Am I right in saying 60000 people are killed by Guns? What are the statistics from Canada, Japan and Europe? Can gun lovers provide true statistics. By the way there are gun deaths in Ca home today. The killer probably kept it for protection but ended up killing whole family of 6. Any comments? No body is sane all the time. Every one gets crazy when angry. He uses gun to kill at that time.
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Old March 30, 2009, 09:21 PM   #19
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My favorite quote from the anti in the article:

Quote:
"You either play dead or you are dead."
What an argument for disarming and disallowing self-defense. Those are two great choices.
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Old March 31, 2009, 02:08 AM   #20
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Possum policy and politics all rolled up into the guise of higher education and "empowerment".

Awesome...frickin' libtards.
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Old March 31, 2009, 06:59 AM   #21
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Quote:
You know, it really amazes me when I see things like this.... and not why you would think.


Everybody bashes NY state as being "liberal" and "anti-gun" but when I look at the laws I don't see it.
We have life-time permits.
Almost all areas of the state issue concealed carry.
There are VERY FEW restrictions on where and when we can carry.
Schools and Universities can issue written permission for carry.
We have what amounts to the "Castle Doctrine".

... and then everybody thinks places like Texas are "pro-gun". Weird, ain't it.
Well, peet, that is fine and all, but this thread has nothing to do with NY. FYI, Texas schools can issue written permission as well. It doesn't have to be written either.
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Old March 31, 2009, 12:55 PM   #22
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The blatant ageism that often rears its ugly head regarding this issue never ceases to amaze me. The assumption that the majority of college students are nothing more than a bunch of irresponsible, drunken frat boys is nothing more than a stereotype and not even a particularly accurate one at that. At the college I attend, the majority of the students are both polite and professional (tuition is an awfully expensive way to party). The notion that I (who have legally carried since I was 18 and never been in trouble more serious than a traffic ticket) suddenly become too irresponsible to exercise my rights the moment I step on campus would be laughable if it were not so offensive. Then again, what do I know, I'm only 22 so I suppose perhaps I'm still too young and stupid to have an opinion (or rights).
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Old March 31, 2009, 01:35 PM   #23
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It will be a good thing for both Texas and beyond if this passes. Assuming this passes, it will just provide a wider range of schools that can be pointed to as examples of how allowing CCW on campus doesn't have any significant detrimental effects.

How many colleges and universities are in Texas, serving how many students? How many in urban areas, how many in rural? What is the range of campus sizes? Pretty sure all of these run the spectrum.

Yes, this could be very nice indeed for those of us in states where CCW on campus isn't a pipe dream. No, you won't get the laws in California or Massachusetts changed, but this could make it easier to get the laws in Montana changed.

Quote:
The blatant ageism that often rears its ugly head regarding this issue never ceases to amaze me. The assumption that the majority of college students are nothing more than a bunch of irresponsible, drunken frat boys is nothing more than a stereotype and not even a particularly accurate one at that. At the college I attend, the majority of the students are both polite and professional (tuition is an awfully expensive way to party). The notion that I (who have legally carried since I was 18 and never been in trouble more serious than a traffic ticket) suddenly become too irresponsible to exercise my rights the moment I step on campus would be laughable if it were not so offensive. Then again, what do I know, I'm only 22 so I suppose perhaps I'm still too young and stupid to have an opinion (or rights).
It's even more amusing because it falls apart in the face of even the slightest bit of argument. We're talking about permitholders here, not the general student body. People who are theoretically responsible enough to carry on the west side of 19th avenue, but suddenly become too immature to handle it on the east side of the street? Who can carry in a shopping mall or movie theater full of their fellow students, children, and bystanders but not in a classroom? Concealed means concealed (at least in many states), so what's the issue?

If the average 21-year-old college student is too immature to carry, then the average 21-year-old is too immature to carry and the age needs to be raised. A 40-year-old permitholder doesn't suddenly become less mature because they decided to go back for a degree, either.
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Old March 31, 2009, 05:49 PM   #24
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Quote from Yellowfin: They can't do any such thing. They are instead heavily pressuring the law not to pass because they are leftist authoritarian slimeballs.

Yellowfin, I agree with the latter part of your summation, but I would disagree somewhat with the first part. Legally they might not be able to cause you to not carry in class, but you might find your essays being graded on a whole new scale in their class. They ( the liberal left) have already usurped freedom of speech in their classrooms to the point that disagreeing too much could be detrimental to your academic health. Professors with tenure seem to believe they can do about anything they want in the classroom and not be called on the carpet for it. I believe the pressure would be there, if not overtly, then covertly.
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Old March 31, 2009, 05:57 PM   #25
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Legally they might not be able to cause you to not carry in class, but you might find your essays being graded on a whole new scale in their class.
This is why I would concealed carry in class. Somebody wouldn't be able to grade me down if for carrying if they don't know I'm carrying in the first place.
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