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Old October 22, 2012, 08:31 AM   #1
Kansas Shooter
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AR SBR Reliablility

Im wanting to build my first SBR in the near future and was wanted to make sure I am not going to end up with an ammo-picky, high maintenance item. I don't mind running quality shells and do in my other rifles. A friend has a registered M-4 and M-16 (the M-16 has a 12 1/2" bbl). Neither of them run through a full magazine on burst or full auto without problems. He is quick to blame the short gas tube and seems to be a fan of piston-driven guns, although I don't believe he owns one. I've never seen his weapons taken down to see how clean they were, so I can't comment on his maintenance.

I'm wanting to maybe put together a MK 18 Mod 0/CQBR. I don't know if I care if it has a 10 or 10.3" bbl. http://img13.imageshack.us/i/mk18s.jpg/
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Old December 6, 2012, 11:45 AM   #2
tepin
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I built out a PSA lower with Geissele Super Semi-Automatic trigger with Noveske 10.5" Upper (factory assembled). Runs flawless, pulling the trigger as fast as I can - never jammed. I run UMC / PMC etc... ammo, ball and poly-tip. Probably put 1K rounds through it so far. I love the Noveske uppers.
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Old December 6, 2012, 04:21 PM   #3
Kansas Shooter
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That's what I was hoping to hear. I don't know what might be wrong with my friend's SBR M16's and M4. I haven't fired one of his without having a cycling problem and he attributed it to a short gas tube. I didn't take the weapons down to see how they are maintained, though.

Thanks for the post; I have a friend who has a SBR with a Noveske upper. I've never shot it, but he really likes it. I only see good things about the company in posts around the internet.

Marty
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Old December 22, 2012, 06:51 AM   #4
NavyEngineer
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I have a Colt 6933 factory SBR with an 11.5 inch barrel. I keep it clean and well lubricated, and haven't had any malfunctions yet with approximately 1500 rounds through it. The muzzle blast is noticeably greater than with the 14.5inch upper on it, however.
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Old December 22, 2012, 02:57 PM   #5
Beretta686
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I've heard all sorts of whining about SBR AR-15 unreliability but I've had flawless functioning out of my 2 no-name 10.5 inch uppers I bought from FTF Industries. I rarely clean them as they're range toys, I run the crappiest cheapest ammo through them (everything but Tula) and I've never had a single malfunction through at least a thousand of rounds on each.

Your milage may vary, but I'm totally satisfied with my 10.5 inchers and if the Zompocalypse happens, I'd fell rather secure with them. Though as others have noted, the muzzle blast is impressive to say the least and I'd consider a Noveske KX3 as one of mine has.
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Old December 22, 2012, 03:53 PM   #6
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No reliability issues, buy with confidence.
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Old December 27, 2012, 04:18 PM   #7
Kansas Shooter
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Thanks everyone for the insight; I'm not as afraid of reliablity issues now. After all the gun ban retoric after the tragedy in CT, I can't decide if I want to get moving on an SBR or begin a suppressor purchase to share between my 5.56 guns.
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Old December 27, 2012, 05:58 PM   #8
Beretta686
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I'd drop the $200 on getting the tax stamp, as the flash-to-bang time on that is pretty long (I haven't done a NFA transfer in about 4-years but I hear they're taking forever nowadays).

Once you get the Form 1 back, you can do what you want with it and then get uppers later, but that way you're not waiting around as much.
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Old December 28, 2012, 09:18 PM   #9
tepin
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Do your build as a pistol first so you can blast away while you wait for your stamp. When the stamp comes, slide the stock onto the tube and you are good to go. This is what I have done.
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Old December 29, 2012, 09:43 AM   #10
Kansas Shooter
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Quote:
Do your build as a pistol first so you can blast away while you wait for your stamp. When the stamp comes, slide the stock onto the tube and you are good to go. This is what I have done.
I've seen some guys talking about doing this...it would deffinitely make the wait easier for the stamp!

One other NFA question I had, and I guess I can hijack my own thread; I understand that Class III guns need to have the owner's name/trust/corp. engraved on the registered item. Does this hold true of suppressors too? I'd like to get a KAC NT4 in the near future, and I can't tell from the the heat shield where I would have my engraving. Then again, none of the pictures I've seen of privately owned cans show anything like that.

Thanks again everyone for the advice.
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Old December 29, 2012, 11:19 AM   #11
Willie Lowman
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They have to have the name of the person/company that registered them as a NFA item

Engraving your name is done one NFA items that you reistered on form 1.

If you buy a that suppressor on form 4 it will have KAC's name and address engraved on it.
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Old December 29, 2012, 07:25 PM   #12
Beretta686
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Quote:
Engraving your name is done one NFA items that you reistered on form 1.
You're certainly supposed to do that, but I've done both an SBS and an SBR on a Form 1 and never bothered to have my info engraved on there and have had them inspected at gunshows by the police and never had a problem.

I'm finally getting mine done and I'd recommend you do it too, don't think that failing to do so will immediately land you in the slammer.
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Old December 30, 2012, 02:22 PM   #13
jmorris
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Quote:

I'm finally getting mine done and I'd recommend you do it too, don't think that failing to do so will immediately land you in the slammer.

Bad advice, play by the rules or don't play.

+ 1 on building a pistol that runs and put a stock on it when you get your paperwork back.
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Old December 30, 2012, 05:19 PM   #14
Kansas Shooter
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Quote:
They have to have the name of the person/company that registered them as a NFA item

Engraving your name is done one NFA items that you reistered on form 1.

If you buy a that suppressor on form 4 it will have KAC's name and address engraved on it.
So, would receivers that are deemed to be Class III be the only NFA items that require engraving per a Form 1? I suppose a destructive device may too (I have no interest in those, though).
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Old December 30, 2012, 11:32 PM   #15
tepin
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When doing Form 1, you claim to be the manufacturer of the device and need to engrave just as any other manufacturer. When doing Form 4 you are not the manufacturer but are having an existing NFA item transferred to you.

Many folks that want a SBR have two paths. Become the manufacturer and convert a virgin AR15 lower to an NFA registered SBR OR purchase the SBR and complete Form 4. No engraving is needed on Form 4 because someone else made and registered the SBR.
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Old December 31, 2012, 01:20 PM   #16
Kansas Shooter
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Quote:
When doing Form 1, you claim to be the manufacturer of the device and need to engrave just as any other manufacturer. When doing Form 4 you are not the manufacturer but are having an existing NFA item transferred to you.

Many folks that want a SBR have two paths. Become the manufacturer and convert a virgin AR15 lower to an NFA registered SBR OR purchase the SBR and complete Form 4. No engraving is needed on Form 4 because someone else made and registered the SBR.
I understand now, thanks for clearing it up. I have been considering building my SBR, so that might help me decide which way to go.
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Old December 31, 2012, 06:32 PM   #17
tepin
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Yep. If you build as a pistol or buy an AR pistol, you can use it until your Form 1 comes back. If you buy the SBR, the gun sits at the FFL until your form clears.
Good luck!
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Old January 2, 2013, 08:27 AM   #18
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Tepin's absolutely correct

I've done (4) SBRs. They all started life as stripped lowers built as pistols and ran for reliability first. Then, when I get my Stamp, I remove the Pistol Buffer tube, send it for engraving. I use Orion Arms http://www.orion-arms.com/ and they only require that you remove the tube/Buffer/spring to have the front of the Mag. Well. Otherwise, Orion requires thatb you provide a stripped receiver for engraving on any of the other surfaces. I get my Engraved lower back, install a Rifle style Tube and I'm done.
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