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Old November 18, 2011, 07:58 AM   #26
Don P
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More than a few people have told me that the rail that can be installed in place of the rear sight will loosen up and wiggle when one is wanting to use a long eye relief scope and the straight bolt.
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Old November 18, 2011, 11:49 AM   #27
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Ya, I'm going to be taking my time finding a mount for it, but I definately don't want a permanant mount to mess the gun up by drilling and tapping. The 1944 Long Branch Enfield I bought was sporterized by someone prior to me having it. They did a pretty decent job, but I have some drill holes in my receiver. I almost didn't buy it just because of that, but everything else was done good. It has a Marble Arms front sight with a 1/16 bead, with the ramp. It also still has the factory flip up/flip down, micro click, 300 yard to 1300 yard, factory rear sight. It has a 22" barrel(cut off)and the overall length of it is at 41 1/2". It also has the(factory?)2 stage trigger, which is real comfortable to use. It is all matching serial numbers, including the bottom of the magazine too. The dates on these pictures are not correct. I forgot to change the date on the camera after I put new batteries in it.

It's nice, but I have no idea why someone decided to sporterize it when it has completely matching serial numbers. My Mn 91/30 also has completely matching serial numbers, so I don't want to make permanant changes to it too. I had a chance to buy a 91/30 a while back, but on the left side of the receiver someone tried to install a scope mount on it. There was 2 holes driled into it that were about 3/8" round. They only wanted $140.00 for this bubbarized thang(sarcasm!)!! Needless to say, I passed on buying it!
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Old November 18, 2011, 01:27 PM   #28
Rick W.
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By the way, I figured that I better stay on topic and post pictures of my MN 91/30 too. I've went to 7.62x54r.net to try to find out what some of the markings are on this rifle, but I have some markings that I couldn't find there. It is real easy to see one of the markings in the picture and that is the Roman Numeral number II inside a circle and on the left side of the Tula Star. Does anyone happen to know what this means? There is also another marking that is just to the right above the top point of the star that wouldn't show up, no matter how much flour I used to make it stand out. This isn't stamped very deep, but it is an upside down C with the opening of the C facing to the left. The corners of this C are squared off, but not as much as the refurbishment mark that is below the manufacture date. The C is almost closed off into a rectangle too, but upon close inspection I can see that it isn't closed off completely and there is an opening there. From what I understand, there was 2 tests done to determine whether a rifle qualifies for being a sniper. Does this mark mean that it passed one of those tests? Does anyone have any insight into what these 2 marks are?
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Old November 18, 2011, 06:07 PM   #29
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The rifle shoots fine. Not high at all it shoots to the right actually. The lower magazine bolt screw was loose a bit. Is tightened maybe that was the cause?
So far my list of sport no damaging mods are easy but pricy all together. Here's a list of the parts I'm gonna go with.
Fiber optic front sight
Tri rail mount Amazon.com
Boyd's thumb hole stock
Black tactile sling
utg. Underrail bipod and mount
Rear stock cheekrest and ammo pouch/holder( holds stripper clips inside and out side has 5 round in loops)
A long relief pistol scope with illuminated cross hairs
This all.together will make a fairly accurate sporter sniper rifle that can be easily swapped back to battle rifle mode.
Easy cheap and simple setup, will make Boyd stock matt black with that black rubber paint. I seem to get sweety hadst when I shoot and I think I should look into grip gloves
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Old November 18, 2011, 06:12 PM   #30
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My mosin is a 1937 non hexagon
I really love my rifle color dark red and its bolt is by far the smoothest I've herd of on a mosin nagant. Its better than my father's bolt action rifle that is newer. The only defect is it had rust on the barrel close to rear ring. It was treated it seems but it is cratered a bit
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Old November 18, 2011, 07:29 PM   #31
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Duzell, sounds like a plan to me! But, could I give you a suggestion? Instead of taking the factory front sight off and putting a fiber optic on, go down to your local hobby shop and get some flourescent model car paint(preferablly an oil based, brushed on paint like Testors). When you go to the range, take some tape with you and wrap a piece of tape around your front post where the bottom of your rear sight lines up with it. Take a few shots with it this way with lining the top of the tape up at the bottom of your rear sight and make sure that you have your tape exactly where you need it for zero. With the tape wrapped around the front post, this will mark the spot for the depth for your aiming point. Take your flourescent paint and paint your post from your tape to the top of your post. If your tape is wraped around your post tight enough, then the paint mark will be exactly at the top of the tape and at your point of aim. Let the paint dry for just a little bit, then carefully take the tape off. If you ever decide on selling your 91/30, then all you have to do is take a pocket knife and scrape the paint off your front post to put your rifle back to original condition. The flourescent colored paint(red, orange, yellow, ect-any color that would stand out)would act the same as a fiber optic sight and might even pick up even more light when it gets to be dusk. Besides that, most of your fiber optic sights(with the shock that's put out, I don't think I'd trust a stick on one!)will require drilling and taping and when you sell you rifle, then the barrel will have holes in it when you try to put it back to original condition.
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Old September 23, 2012, 04:35 PM   #32
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so far..

lol @ rick, me and my father had that idea, we had some old yellow model plain paint that we used on tip of both front and rear site, this tightened my group about .5-1" at 100 and made my group close to 2" at 200


this is the first time i shot it at 100yrds


i actually havent taken pics of the new grouping buts its better with the paint
this was it shooting stock(nothing added or taken off)

the recoil pad helps all lot when shooting and the cheek pad i find worthless except to store rounds , stripper clips

im looking into getting the Brass Stacker scope mount, nutnfancy has been using his on a bunch of mosins without issue and says its good and alows for adjustable rings

Id also like to post my new project plan so far(scraping the older plan)

1.recoil pad(done)
2.cheek rest(done)

3.scope mount that dosnt need to mod gun* (currently on this)
4.scope/reddot
5.stock(duracoat paint)
6.bipod
7.sling


1> recoil pad (amazon.com)
here

GET IT, this will defiantly help you shoot and actually helps us who are not of russian stature , gives you better a better view to shoot the rifle and makes the recoil very low on your body so less impact
its cheap and easy and does no damage to rifle and its drop in installation. come in black or brown

2>Allen Company Buttstock Shell Holder and Pouch(amazon.com)
here
its nice, small and does what it says, easy to use and no damage or modding needed, i dont use the cheek rest much other than a way to store my ammo. its good and easy to use
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Old September 25, 2012, 06:58 AM   #33
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we got a regular 1943 mosin to completely redo. i am having the front sight cut off, the rear sight removed an the pins put back then then rounded an the gaps filled to make it look like its not even been there. then its getting drilled an tapped for the Rock Solid mount an red thread-locked permantly into place. then its getting the bolt handle bent instead of cut an welded an we are going to drop it into a boyds walnut an bead the action an free float the barrel. we are unsure yet to have the long barrel cut down an re-crowned to 22" yet. would it be better for accuracy to cut the barrel down? or see were it shoots first then descide?
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Old September 25, 2012, 08:08 AM   #34
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AnIn truth the maximum length of barrel needed to create max velocity for bullet and bot create loss of propulsion is the 22 ,so for accuracy and distance shooting with id do it if its what you want. I like the long barrel look and with brass stacker mount i can still use irons while i have a scope, just in case i damage the scope as i do tactical and wilderness shooting matches with it. I will get the ft stock from boyd as i like the stability and its good for heat displacement due to the high amount of rounds i but out.(like 500 per shooting match and doing so tends to cause my stock to sweat its sealant and stain. But for low amount under 200 its ok. My project is to make a mosin that is interchangeable between standard and sport with no gunsmithing needed. Your project is more permanent just be aware that what your doing cant be undone,so make sure its what you really want because if anything is damaged it will be costly to repair.

If my wording is off sorry i am half asleep
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Old September 27, 2012, 06:59 PM   #35
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me stupid noticed the date of op
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Old September 27, 2012, 07:31 PM   #36
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There aparantly is a a guy trying to make a 10mosin round magazine for the mosin. He is also talking about makeing a detachable magazine
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Old September 28, 2012, 09:56 AM   #37
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Quote:
or see were it shoots first then descide?
Work up some loads with .311 SMK's and see how it shoots first.
Mine was minute of angle, but they are long, thin, "whippy" barrels and can be very inconsistent.

I didn't want a barrel that long, and cut/re-crowned to 22", and it did improve accuracy slightly.

Longer barrels provide more velocity, they may be more or less accurate than a shorter barrel.
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Old September 28, 2012, 11:03 AM   #38
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well as i stated above to reach max velocity the barrel needs a max length on 22, any other length for (30 odd 6, .308 or similar rounds) will just reduce velocity and create drag down the barrel on the bullet and reduce the gas pressure on the bullet while it travels along the barrel(this is easily looked up on the net)

now the problem of doing this is it takes the "historic" quality away.(i personally dont give a darn there are millions of these things)

its just another way to improve accuracy a bit
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Old September 28, 2012, 12:59 PM   #39
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Ummm....

You're really trying to tell me that maximum bullet velocity is reached with a 22" barrel...and this is "easily looked up on the net"??? 'Fraid not...

I guess all of us with 26", 28" and 30" barrels must be nuts.

I'll bite...

Show me.
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Old November 9, 2012, 01:29 PM   #40
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im not saying your nuts or anything of the sort

the typical bullet of a rifle achieves maximum velocity in 22 (30 ODD 6 and similar rounds is what im referring to) that is typically the amount of length needed to burn the gas and propel the bullet, a longer barrel can be handy to keep accuracy higher, but typically the 22 is the minimum range you go to keep accuracy and velocity of a rifle , even a 24 is better in some cases to improve accuracy. now a sniper rifle usually has a long barrel to provide the maximum accuracy and range, but the gas loses its initial momentum and can lower the maximum velocity, but not hamper accuracy, this is a basic ballistic characteristic of a rifle bullet. its just a physics concept that has to do with barrel which is the length to travel from exit of muzzle, and the gas burn rate + amount of inertia placed upon bullet to achieve muzzle velocity. as gas burns it creates energy and applys a force ->, as it travels the gas burns itself out to a point were inertial energy transfer begins to drop. this 22 idea was thought up during the war originally i believe, when extensive test showed rifles of length 22 could still reach the max velocity(look at old war rifles lengths if youd like) so for close combat and weigth loss, the 22 length was easier to use and maneuver with while in combat, unlike a long barreled rifle such as my 91/30 which were typicaly used as sniper long range rifles.

basically its determined by what funtion youd like the rifle to achieve
close combat/ tacticle use that can retain long range capabilities

or

long range and highly accurate at the loss of mobility and inertia
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Old November 9, 2012, 01:38 PM   #41
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UPDATE

well just got my boyds thumbhole and its to say the least, awesome O_O. the feel and structure of it allow quick mobility and easy sighting capability. the thumb hole fits perfect. my father who hates them has stated he likes this one very much. it free floats the rifle well and it needed NO modifications.

now if you read boyds stock it states its for a round receiver 91/30 most people buy and mod for a variation of the rifle.

either that or my mosin is still another weird trait in actually fitting.

i also did work to repair my barrel (which had treated rust damage but looked horrid) i used jb weld and sanded it down a day later till its flush. i then applied "high heat header paint" same as for my vw beetle. its a matt black and it was the same color as the paint already on rifle and can take high heat.

so if you have issues with your mosin i recommend this treatment so far.

oh i also found a 91/30 muzzel break at
http://www.milsurpstuff.com/proddetail.asp?prod=MP9130
no clue how it performs but was happy to finally find one
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Old November 11, 2012, 12:00 AM   #42
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Loose Stock

Adding to the newest Mossin Nagant thread rather than starting a new one.

Anyone one fix a loose stock on one of these?

Googling a bit says Soviet Snipers used pieces of brass stripper clips to upgrade the rifles they had.

Possibly the one I have is missing strips?

Or another method of fixing a loose stock.
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Old November 13, 2012, 05:48 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duzell
im not saying your nuts or anything of the sort

the typical bullet of a rifle achieves maximum velocity in 22 (30 ODD 6 and similar rounds is what im referring to) that is typically the amount of length needed to burn the gas and propel the bullet, a longer barrel can be handy to keep accuracy higher, but typically the 22 is the minimum range you go to keep accuracy and velocity of a rifle , even a 24 is better in some cases to improve accuracy. now a sniper rifle usually has a long barrel to provide the maximum accuracy and range, but the gas loses its initial momentum and can lower the maximum velocity, but not hamper accuracy, this is a basic ballistic characteristic of a rifle bullet. its just a physics concept that has to do with barrel which is the length to travel from exit of muzzle, and the gas burn rate + amount of inertia placed upon bullet to achieve muzzle velocity. as gas burns it creates energy and applys a force ->, as it travels the gas burns itself out to a point were inertial energy transfer begins to drop. this 22 idea was thought up during the war originally i believe, when extensive test showed rifles of length 22 could still reach the max velocity(look at old war rifles lengths if youd like) so for close combat and weigth loss, the 22 length was easier to use and maneuver with while in combat, unlike a long barreled rifle such as my 91/30 which were typicaly used as sniper long range rifles.

basically its determined by what funtion youd like the rifle to achieve
close combat/ tacticle use that can retain long range capabilities

or

long range and highly accurate at the loss of mobility and inertia
Some of the powder I use is slow burning enough that velocity is still increasing when the bullet exists the 29" barrel.

Referencing data from several cartridges fired in a long rifle (91/30 etc) compared to being fired in a shorter rifle (M44), the M44 loses a good 200fps or so to light ball.

Didn't look at heavy ball as that was phased out for infantry before most carbines were introduced in Russia.

Regards,

Josh
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Old November 15, 2012, 03:19 PM   #44
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@Zoro
I've never had issue with a stock. My standard fits perfectly. Maybe post picks and I can help recommend a solution.

@Josh
Sounds about right for a lighter , the gas has less resistance than the higher grain.
And most noted from watching my friends m44s is the amount of excess gass and power still burning.
This reaction can look even more dramatic with a muzzle break.
It's really dependent on the bullets you're putting in it.


Project update:
Bought peper laminate thumbhole stock from. Boyd's
dropped in no mods needed. Read as it's for a round receive mosin 9130
I have a bipod on way. I will use a m1 Garand sling as I have a spare one. Will post pics and hopefully a video

Now i need ammo... i prefer the soft point silver bear if anyone wonders

I spoil my mosin. Iteresting enough i used the glow in dark paint on sights and it didnt work. I was sad, repainted my sights yellow. Bayonet works great. Boyds stock feels great and it perfectly aligns your eyes to irons
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Old November 19, 2012, 02:13 PM   #45
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The best thing you can do to your Mosin 91/30 is to install a adjustable Huber Concept roller trigger assembly. It will definately tighten your groups up. It's a little price but will amost make your Nagant shoot as good as a Garand
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Old November 19, 2012, 07:09 PM   #46
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Pricy and a permanent mod. My mosin project is a easy swappable mosin. There are many trigger mods such timmny trigger. Or place a washer under the screw for the trigger to reduce lbs. a bit
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Old November 26, 2012, 06:53 PM   #47
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well hello those still reading my project
i will post a pick so far below, here is a summary so far to new comers:

my project is to create a mosin which performs well and will not need gunsmithing or any permanent mods done to it , and can swap between a historic mode and a scout/sport rifle mode

91/30 round reciever mosin nagant : 109$ big 5

swappable stocks (standard and boyds stock thumbhole)
stock: boyds pepper laminante thumb hole stock 113$ ->99$ plus ups shipping

bipod: NcStar Precision Grade Bipod Fullsize 3 Adapters (ABPGF) 27.99$ amazon

sling: black claw sling (i love the feel and how it takes the weight off me) 20.33$ amazon

scopemountstill to come), but i have my eye on the brass stacker mount (steel/made in usa/lifetimewarranty) 59.00$ no shipping charge and amazon .com

ok went to the laguna sega range last sunday to test this bipod and stock out. i set my target at 100 yards, and i was shooting with 2 others who have 91/30's set to 50 yards.

i have no scope and only use irons so far with my mosin "black lightning" as joke named after a russian movie hero , watch it or dont .....

anyaway i had an issue with a group of morons next to us shooting OUR targets and not theres (mine 100 morons at 50)(i had a spotter) was weird id shoot once and have 5 bullet holes? so the range guys asked them to stop or leave(they left)

ok targets
all the same
2 normal mosins at 50 yards, mine at 100

they were doing the typical mosin shoot high and were hitting the 7 and 6 rings

my target (even with odd holes do to those idiots, which i plugged)
i was hitting x/10/9 (i actually hit the same holes 2 to 3 times, to say the least im impressed)(it basically hit were i pointed it) so go boyds stock and ncstar bipod

now quick note my mosin stock hits a 1.5-2" group at 100 normally and has a great bolt. now im shooting like a .5" at 100. i shoot 5 rounds into a target and have a spotter (as i typically shoot a m1a socom scoped, this is my normal routine for target shooting at long range)

NOTES
things i noticed on boyds, perfect iron sight level on check rest built in to it, good grip, and the vents on side cooled my barrel great i grabed it after doing 100 rounds and it was slightly warm(may also be due to repaint with high header paint...dunno)

RECOIL: ok i have the buttpad on my normal stock for my mosin due to having long arms the back of the stock is to short, the boyds is perfect for american shooters, but word of warning its light.

so i fired the first shot, and it felt like someone shot a bottle rocket at my shoulder, the recoil pad on the boyds OK for a recoil reducer but i didnt get a bruise shooting 100 rounds unlike normal stock with a 1 inch thick pad, so boyds disperses the KE better, but your shoulder will start feeling numb after 25 shots , were recoil pad on normal stock i felt nothing but had a big bruise later. ODD....

now if any of you have shot at laguna sega before you know about the bell or the tin plates they have set at 300 -500 yards (as a target for anyone to shoot)

i took the mosin and fired at the 300 plate, it hit right below it, (note: aim at the link to chain right above plate) anyway doing that after round 1 (using irons set for 100) i hit dead center and knocked the tin around, and proceeded to fire my last 3 rounds into it (literary my last rounds as i was out of ammo again Y_Y )

ammo :
brown bear: my mosin loves this soft point and its 10$ <- i reccomend this
silver bear: mosin is ok with it but its not as consistant as brown bear
winchester: my mosin HATES these, very inconstant and not good quality at all
talua: (this is what ive been shooting with this time)
it is a mixed bag, cheap, consistent , but my mosin dosnt like it going in , and it ejects weird sometimes, i think its the rim of the cartridge
surplus: best for a mosin but its corrosive, after shooting jam Windex down barrel to neutralize corrosive ammo,(still must clean gun but stops it burning)



SIGHTS: ok i am planning to get a night scope or a red dot cope because i want to shoot at night and in the dark , my father says he has a spare so i may use that (hope mosin dosnt break it, its for a rifle...)

ok a way to improve your irons, paint tip of front sight with a bright colored model paint(i used yellow) and will help you aim now so you dont have black sights on a black target (i hate this personally )

well thats it so far so hope this project thread has been helpful, i will order the brass stacker soon

pics bellow: current mosin with bipod at max length / origional stock / and the boyds stock

i threw in the old pic just so you can see the difference between the stocks, but mounting is the same
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Old November 26, 2012, 07:04 PM   #48
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sks modded scoped vs irons mosin boyds stock

ok shot my dads customized yugo sks with his scope mounted on it(we had to zero it in first)

and my mosin black lightning with irons
AMMO: talua rounds for both rifles
range: laguna sega
first had dad fire the two rifles at 100yrds 3 rounds each, with me spotting

his shots were at low 8 and 7 with some black later on 9 (after he tightened his scope)

now mosins turn 9,9,9 all next to each other

he says the trigger on my mosin is better than the sks, not so spongy ?

my turn dad spotting me

sks yugo : (9,10,9) , hes right the trigger sucks on this sks
mosin : (10, 9,X) ya i was kinda impressed with the mosin on this, my first X at 100 with it, my mosin tends to shoot low right so im in 10's or 9's usually

as a finally we shot the plates at 300 for kicks and spent the ammo we had

cleaning: mosin set up bipod, ram it with rags till shes clean (about 10-5 min)
sks (clean gas system/barrel, trigger/spring and alot of ect)
1/2 hour

mosin is way easy to clean save for the bolt which is a jigsaw to those new to them, im good with mine due to practice but still that occasional .... were does this go?

next time i shoot hooking the bayonet on the mosin just to freak out people LOL
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Old November 28, 2012, 03:21 PM   #49
Duzell
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here is my target at 100 with my mosin on irons , now i had issues due to an idiot cross firing an ak at my target , when his was at 50 yards with a 10X scope.
(the range asked them to leave, as they were shooting more than 1 round per sec, and were cross firing multiple targets on the range)

so the white is them not my mosin.

ok using talua 7.62x54r non corrosive rounds(i hate these as they jam a lot, not well made but good consistency), boyds stock, ncstar bipod, claw sling.


so as you can see with my first shots on the bottom left of the black i put five in a nice tight group, though later i got 3 x's at the end of my shoot.

if your wondering why im shooting left, its me not the mosin, i was compensating for my mosin(shoots low right) so i was aiming high left (a little to left in beginning)

so anyway proof a mosin can be very accurate without a scoping it.
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Old November 28, 2012, 03:23 PM   #50
Duzell
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Join Date: October 30, 2011
Location: Monterrey/hayward
Posts: 710
if anyone has a mosin feel free to post some pics id love to see them, i dont judge what youve done to it, or will and if you have questions just ask , ill be happy to help
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