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Old October 23, 2011, 04:52 PM   #1
Usertag
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Which Nagant would YOU choose?

Ok, so I'm wondering should I get a Tula or A Ishevsk M1895 Nagant? The reason I want Ishevsk is, because it is more OG. But the downside is the years it was made in (Earlier Models). When you buy from JG Sales do you get the newer models (1940's) or older models (Pre-40's)? Also which year has the best (right) specs to fit in a .32ACP Cylinder, with no problem? Because I have heard that there are mechanical problems with the cylinder on certain model years. To sum it all up. Does the year it was made have anything to do with the way it shoot or durability? Please actually answer this and don't say "Ishevsk and Tula are the same". There are reasons I asked this question.

Questions Simplified

1. Should I get a Tula or A Ishevsk M1895 Nagant?

2. When you buy from JG Sales do you get the newer models (1940's) or older models (Pre-40's)?

3. Also which year has the best (right) specs to fit in a .32ACP Cylinder, with no problem?

4. Does the year it was made have anything to do with the way it shoot or durability?

PLEASE, be specific when you answer.
Thank You!
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Old October 23, 2011, 05:08 PM   #2
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1. It doesn't make much difference. All the soviet-made nagants are about equal quality. Pre-soviet ones have more collector value though.

2. I think you get whatever is on top of the pile when they grab one. They import these things by the truckload.

3. The 32acp cylinder is hit or miss regardless, since the tolerances on these guns was so loose the entire time they were made.

4. Nope
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Old October 23, 2011, 07:00 PM   #3
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these things are crappy no matter what year or era you get. they are not a bullseye gun, and they are not a gun i would ever think about carrying....for any reason.
they are a range toy, and piece of history. they solved a problem, that never really was.
i have one from 1917, and never even bothered to shoot it. the single action trigger pull, is something like 20 pounds, seriously. it only gets a little better in single action.
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Old October 23, 2011, 07:12 PM   #4
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The main goal of the Nagant was to shoot a dissenter in the back of the head and let them die slowly thereafter. They are literally dishonored for any purpose I can think of. If they were the last guns on earth I'd make my own first.
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Old October 24, 2011, 02:02 AM   #5
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Quote:
these things are crappy no matter what year or era you get.
They're extremely rugged, durable, and reliable, and with decent accuracy. Not fancy or refined, but is "pretty" the standard by which one is to judge whether something is crappy?

Quote:
it only gets a little better in single action.
Untrue. The DA trigger pull is heavy because it both pulls back the hammer and shifts the cylinder forward, if cocked and shooting in SA, the cylinder is already in the forward position. Nagant SA triggers aren't actually bad at all.

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The main goal of the Nagant was to shoot a dissenter in the back of the head and let them die slowly thereafter.
No doubt Nagants were used for that but one would have to be lying to suggest that this was the original intended purpose of that particular firearm. For one thing, the gun was introduced well before the Stalin era, which is when Nagants gained the notoriety you allude to. What's more, it simply makes no sense to go to the trouble of designing and mass-producing a gas-seal revolver with a goal of maximizing the efficiency of the cartridge's gases, if the intended purpose is simply to shoot people in the back of the head. It's an unnecessary waste, a complicating factor. The Nagant's predecessor in Russian service would have been adequate for that purpose, no? What's more, why bother making the gun so rugged, if the intended purpose isn't quite so taxing on a gun's durability?
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Old October 24, 2011, 02:10 AM   #6
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Vasili Blohkin used a suitcase full of Browning .25 Auto pistols for his executions...... just sayin' ....
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Old October 24, 2011, 02:54 AM   #7
Doug Bowser
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I have an Izhevsk 1945. The double action is quite heavy but the single action is about 4 pounds.

The .32 ACP cylinders are not worth the trouble they will cause you. Once we got one to work the accuracy was dismal. I guess, because the bullet has to jump so far before engaging the rifling.

I rechambered my Nagant to .32-20 Winchester. Accuracy at 25 yards is about 4" from a sandbag. Factory .32-20 ammo is 1/10"+- too long to work in the revolver. I have had to make ammunition short enough to let the cylinder turn. I carry the Nagant in my old truck for self defense.

I have the reamer and would rechamber the cylinder for $40 INCLUDING RETURN SHIPPING. The cylinder would be the only thing I would need to do the reaming. The whole pistol would not have to be sent.

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Old October 24, 2011, 09:00 AM   #8
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Odd thing: I've never hear or read of anyone denigrating the Walther PPK because those guns were issued by the Gestapo.

Just sayin'....
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Old October 24, 2011, 09:53 AM   #9
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"these things are crappy no matter what year or era you get. they are not a bullseye gun, and they are not a gun i would ever think about carrying....for any reason.
they are a range toy, and piece of history. they solved a problem, that never really was.
i have one from 1917, and never even bothered to shoot it. the single action trigger pull, is something like 20 pounds, seriously. it only gets a little better in single action."

Thanks for the opinion, but crappy is not always the case. They are cheap, reliable, accurate weapons that are rugged and proven. They are not the best weapon built, but that dang thing will take a deer down at 200 yrds on iron sights and 300+ with a scope. They are a basic bolt action, simple and good. I get 2 inch groups from mine at 100 yards with iron sights using priv 150 gr soft points. My son took a spike buck down this last weekend with it from 125 yrds with irons and it just buckled and didn't take a step. Had at least a 2-3 inch exit wound, heart was mush. Have another Mosin on order from Aimsurplus.
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Old October 24, 2011, 10:05 AM   #10
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I shoot 32 shorts out of mine. Yes, there case mouth does have a bulge. Nothing so bad that could not be ironed out in the reloading process.
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Old October 24, 2011, 10:17 AM   #11
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They are cheap, reliable, accurate weapons that are rugged and proven. They are not the best weapon built, but that dang thing will take a deer down at 200 yrds on iron sights and 300+ with a scope. They are a basic bolt action, simple and good. I get 2 inch groups from mine at 100 yards with iron sights using priv 150 gr soft points.
I hate to break this to you, but the OP is discussing the Nagant Model 1895 revolver, NOT the Mosin-Nagant Model 1891 rifle.
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Old October 24, 2011, 10:28 AM   #12
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The .32 ACP cylinders are not worth the trouble they will cause you. Once we got one to work the accuracy was dismal.
I don't have a Nagant, but this sentence neatly summarizes almost everything I've heard about the .32ACP cylinders.

IMHO you're better off handloading rounds using trimmed and resized .32-20 WCF brass. Most Nagant shooters report much better luck doing this than using .32ACP. Rechambering the gun to .32-20 is an interesting idea too, although I haven't heard much about it before.
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Old October 24, 2011, 10:28 AM   #13
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"these things are crappy no matter what year or era you get. they are not a bullseye gun, and they are not a gun i would ever think about carrying....for any reason.
Yeap, that's true, but they are also a heck of a lot of fun to shoot. The double action trigger really sucks but the single action isn't too bad. They are underpowered but again, a heck of a lot of fun to shoot.

I make my cases from 32-20 brass, not long enough for the gas seal to work but they still shoot.

I'm gonna shoot it with my Mosin in one of our club's multi gun matches. Gonna come in dead last I'm sure (can't find speed loaders for the Nagant), but I bet I'll have more fun then any other shooter.

If you pay attention they don't shoot that bad.

Did I mention, they are a heck of a lot of fun to shoot.

This was shot at 15 yards, slow fire single action of course.

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Old October 24, 2011, 01:53 PM   #14
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Yea, I knew he was not talking about a rifle, the brand itself gets a bad rap with the "Cheap, crappy" thing. If it's military, then standards were followed in the production.

Thanks,
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Old October 24, 2011, 02:16 PM   #15
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If they were the last guns on earth I'd make my own first.
Man thats cold and brutally honest!
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Old October 24, 2011, 03:56 PM   #16
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Quote:
Ok, so I'm wondering should I get a Tula or A Ishevsk M1895 Nagant?


I think Tula's are popular because it's the only Russian arsenal that Americans can pronounce!!!
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Old October 24, 2011, 04:07 PM   #17
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The problems with the gun aren't quality-related, they're design related. They're built like tanks with a good bluing. They just suck. It'd be like a mil-spec craftsman lawnmower. It may never break down but it's no john deere.
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Old October 24, 2011, 04:19 PM   #18
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Yea, I knew he was not talking about a rifle, the brand itself gets a bad rap with the "Cheap, crappy" thing.
  • I believe that this is the first time I'm heard of something coming out of the Soviet Union being referred to as a "brand".
  • In my experience, Nagant revolvers draw much more criticism than Mosin-Nagant rifles. The rifles are crude but functional, but the revolvers are more the former and less the latter.
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I think Tula's are popular because it's the only Russian arsenal that Americans can pronounce!!!
Come on. Be fair. It's also because of the bold and striking star logo.
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Old October 24, 2011, 06:09 PM   #19
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For one thing, the gun was introduced well before the Stalin era, which is when Nagants gained the notoriety you allude to.
You haven't read much regarding the Tsar's secret police, have you?

Hint: that's who faked the "Protocols Of The Elders Of Zion"...not nice people at all.
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Old October 24, 2011, 07:58 PM   #20
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Man thats cold and brutally honest!
Actually dishonest, as it's an emotional statement not based in fact.

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You haven't read much regarding the Tsar's secret police, have you?
Spare me the condescending one-liners. Unless you come up with some some fact-based evidence proving that the Nagant was purpose-designed and built for shooting dissenters in the back of head, I am not interested.

Maybe one should bare in mind a gun is an inanimate object, and is neither inherently good nor evil.
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Old October 24, 2011, 08:13 PM   #21
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During the 1890s military trials, the Nagant revolver was required to drop a horse at 25 paces.

The Nagant revolver saw action in the Russo-Japanese wars, WW1, the Russian Revolution, the Civil War, the Russo-Finn wars, WW2, Korea, Vietnam and scores of brush wars. When German Lugers froze up and jammed in the Russian winter, the Nagant worked.

Was also known to have used steel core bullets. With proper ammo the Nagant is quite accurate, however it is slow to reload.

Tho the Nagant DA pull is usually heavy, if you shop around some can be found with a 5-6 lb pull.

All in all, an enjoyable historic collectible. Good luck.
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Old October 24, 2011, 08:17 PM   #22
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Saying a nagant was made for killing dissenters is like saying the springfield rifle was made to kill foreign conscripts or the colt 45 was made to kill Indians. Guns were made to kill. Everything else is splitting hairs.
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Old October 25, 2011, 05:29 AM   #23
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I picked up a Nagant revolver with holster a couple years ago for $90 at a gun show. Looked brand new and this one had plastic grips. Even got a couple boxes of ammo for it at a different seller at the same show.
They are a great piece of history. No I havnt shot it and don't plan on it.
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Old November 23, 2011, 10:13 PM   #24
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In Defense of the Nagant Revolver

First I own a 1938 Tula with bakelite grips (prelastic) and am considering buying a 1935 Ish(cant pronounce it)mek with wood grips. They have a harsh trigger pull. But I will bet you cant find an archived news story were a child accidently shot somebody with a nagant. 14 lb trigger pull. I didn't buy the .32 cylinder. I have gone deer hunting with my model 44 carbine and took the revolver just to deal with coyotes. This gun is inexpensive, and easy to use. It is the devil to reload quick. I am a fan of the nagant revolver as a piece of working nostalgia. People want to compare it with modern day revolvers and to me it is like saying "well I think my Ferrari will blow your quarterhorse away."
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Old November 23, 2011, 11:52 PM   #25
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How many glocks will be working in 115 like the Nagant works today.
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