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Old October 16, 2011, 11:14 AM   #1
titanicslim
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New Member with Ack. Imp. question

Hi All

I am having a new rifle made in .257 Robts. Ack. Imp. Of course, I decided to do this before investigating the costs of shooting this calibre.

So, searching for reloading dies, I can find no neck-sizing dies, just full-length resizing dies.

So my questions are: Is it felt that this round needs full-length resizing, and can I resize the neck with the full-length die? Maybe a .257 Weatherby die?

Thanks!
Dave
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Old October 16, 2011, 12:23 PM   #2
mkk41
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Redding has neck-sizing dies.

http://www.midwayusa.com/Product/244...egree-shoulder
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Old October 16, 2011, 06:03 PM   #3
titanicslim
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Yikes! $53 just for the neck sizing die? Is that my only choice? Anyway, I appreciate the help- I'll be on the lookout for a used one!
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Old October 16, 2011, 06:17 PM   #4
steveno
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you can just back off the full length size die a little bit and accomplish the same thing. mark the neck with a black magic marker and the slowing screwing the die down by watching the marking made on the neck.
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Old October 16, 2011, 07:21 PM   #5
mrawesome22
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A custom rifle deserves a custom die
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Old October 16, 2011, 07:41 PM   #6
JerryM
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Although some recommend it, I have never found neck sizing with a FLRS die satisfactory. The FLRS die resizes the body to some extent, and in my rifles it is enough to make the rounds too difficult to chamber. If it works for you then go for it, and it will save some money. I buy Neck Sizers for all my rifles.

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Old October 16, 2011, 08:22 PM   #7
mehavey
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Start w/ the Full Length resizer die about a quarter's width (1.75 mm or 1 turn) off the shellholder Try to chamber a sized casing. (It may now have been side-squeezed/lengthened too long and the bolt will not close easily.) Gradually adjust the die down to where the case will just re-enter the chamber and the bolt close w/o any significant feel. Lock the adjustment ring at that point.

That will size your case to custom fit the chamber (pretty much) as well as a neck sizer only.

Pick up Hornady comparator kit ...
http://www.amazon.com/Hornady-Lock-L.../dp/B000PD5VLA
...and you can turn what you've determined by feel -- into a measurable science.
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Old October 17, 2011, 08:59 AM   #8
zplinker
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+1 for JerryM. You can actually use the fact that partial sizing(which is what you are doing) causes the shoulder to rise, to set your full length die correctly: load and fire a couple brass that have been partial sized, then repeat. Often, the second time around, they will chamber hard. Perfect. Now, turn the full length die down carefully, until the sized brass chambers w/o resistance. You have your die set correctly for your gun.

If you want a laugh or two, mark the die position with a marker, then set the die according to the manufacturers instructions..touching the shell holder, then add 1/8-1/4 turn...you will see why so much brass is ruined by oversizing.

Hornady offers a universal caliber neck die. Get one for .25, set it down in small steps until you size the amount of your 257AI neck you want, and you are home. It runs under $20.
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Old October 17, 2011, 03:00 PM   #9
Mike / Tx
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Quote:
A custom rifle deserves a custom die
Well absolutely especially a wildcat, I thought that was just part of the deal.

Seriously though you can do exactly like what is mentioned and do fine.
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Old October 17, 2011, 03:49 PM   #10
brickeyee
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Quote:
Yikes! $53 just for the neck sizing die?

It might not be much more to get a competition neck sizing die and have the sliding sleeve bored out with the same reamer used to chamber the barrel (unless Redding lists the die you want).

You will also need a shoulder bump die at some point.

Last edited by brickeyee; October 17, 2011 at 03:56 PM.
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Old October 17, 2011, 04:48 PM   #11
steve4102
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The best Neck Sizing die made is available in 257 Roberts AI and it's cheap. Just pick up a Lee Collet Neck die and you are good to go. The Lee Collet die will work with a standard 257 and the AI.
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Old October 17, 2011, 07:48 PM   #12
titanicslim
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Wow! All your replies are sure appreciated. I guess I'm trying to pinch pennies- which is a little silly considering the cumulative costs so far. Or maybe because of them

I guess with the way I feel about accuracy it makes sense to anticipate a lot more expenditures before I'm done. A fine rifle is worth it.

It's just that my first rifle (a sportomized Swede) came with a Lee Loader, 20# of components and instant, devastating performance. So I guess I feel offended when asked to pay for this stuff!

I am glad to have so many helpful, knowledgeable and friendly members reply. Thanks again!

Dave
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Old October 18, 2011, 12:39 PM   #13
F. Guffey
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I do not build a rifle until I have located the dies, sometimes that requires a lot of digging at gun shows, there are times I purchase dies for chambers I do not have a barrel or reamer for. I purchased a set of ‘G’ dies for 8mm338 Winchester Mag for half price, before purchasing the barrels I had determined I could modify two sets of dies to form, size and seat bullets, both sets cost me a total of $15.00.

Time as a factor? I have no infatuation with neck sizer dies, I use the versatile full length sizer die, a cylinder with tapered sides is a cone, a cone has varying diameters, when sizing a case the head of the case can be raised off the shell holder from .001 to .011 thousands when using an RCBS shell holder, raising the case off the shell holder reduces the length of the case from the head of the case to it’s shoulder, again, time is a factor, the difference between neck sizing and full length sizing is time.

http://www.midwayuk.com/apps/eproduc...eitemid=822343

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Old October 20, 2011, 09:23 PM   #14
titanicslim
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And another thing...

It just occurred to me- Say I fire a factory or standard .257Robts cartridge in my Improved chamber. The case should now conform to the inside dimensions of the chamber, right?

So if I resize that case in a full-length Ackley Improved die, what will its dimensions now be? It should squeeze down the neck and the body to some extent but surely it won't size all the way down to the standard Roberts case dimensions... ?

None of my reloading manuals has that data.
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Old October 20, 2011, 09:57 PM   #15
mouser868
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Found this link, it's a 2 die set

http://www.huntingtons.com/dies_neck.html

Last edited by mouser868; October 20, 2011 at 10:05 PM.
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Old October 20, 2011, 10:16 PM   #16
jepp2
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Quote:
None of my reloading manuals has that data.
The Nosler manual has most of the AI cartridges. It also has fire forming load recommendations.

Just an observation, you sound relatively new to a AI cartridge. I would suggest you ask lots of questions before you begin firing/loading for your new adventure.

Hornady also makes a caliber specific neck sizing die. Midway has them and you can buy the .25 caliber and it will work on all cartridges using that bullet. I have some, but the Lee Collet die will give you the least neck runout and with the case dimensions it is a natural for neck sizing. The sharp shoulder will allow many loads before full length sizing is necessary, provided you aren't off the chart with hot loads.
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Old October 24, 2011, 11:43 PM   #17
titanicslim
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Yes, this is my intro to "Improved" cartridges. I've been wanting to try one of these for a long time, mainly to irritate a good friend who thinks it is silly to use anything but a Winchester lever gun with a slow, round nose bullet for deer. I figure it'll do for lighter game when a .30-06 is not required.

Nosler, huh? Don't seem to have that one- thanks, I'll pick it up. And thanks for the links! I ordered a set of full-length Lee collet dies in Ack. Imp. Would it be a good idea to take them to my gunsmith, to check and ream if necessary, whilst we've got the reamers?

I've been looking at the Ackley books and he said a couple of things about headspace which gave me pause- Lee told me he had a set of standard .257Robt go/no-go gauges he could use. Is that not advisable?
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Old October 25, 2011, 08:16 AM   #18
steve4102
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Quote:
I ordered a set of full-length Lee collet dies in Ack. Imp.

Not sure what you ordered, but Lee makes a set of FL Pacesetter dies in 257 AI. The also make a "Collet" neck sizing die in 257 Roberts that will Neck size only the 257 AI. I have not seen a "set of FL Lee Collet dies in AI"?

Got a link to your purchase?
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Old October 25, 2011, 08:17 AM   #19
jaguarxk120
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Let's see yor "having a rifle made" and a Redding die at $53 is too much!
Maybe you should rethink the whole thing. Custom rifle and the cheapest die set money can buy doesn't add up ?
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Old October 25, 2011, 08:19 AM   #20
steve4102
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The Lee Collet die is certainly inexpensive, but it most certainly is not a POS. It produces some of the most concentric brass you will ever find.
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Old October 25, 2011, 08:49 AM   #21
CPTMurdoc30
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Many times I have heard of the smith cutting the chamber would also take a scrap barrels and make you a sizing die out of it.

Here is an RCBS set for the 257 ACKLY https://shop.rcbs.com/WebConnect/Mai...te=C09J045N142

Here is hte FL sizer die set.
https://shop.rcbs.com/WebConnect/Mai...te=C09J045N142

Redding offers a set as well. http://www.redding-reloading.com/onl...-sets-series-c

Getting popcorn and fanboy flame war chair. Cause here we go again.
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Old October 25, 2011, 09:28 AM   #22
titanicslim
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Correction

Looks like I got confused. These are !!!-NOT-!!! the dies I ordered: http://www.midwayusa.com/Product/292...egree-shoulder

Geez, as if I don't screw things up enough on my own, Midway mixed up the product number - THIS is the one i bought.
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And I didn't mean to make the project sound like a significant commission although, on my VA income, it seems that way to me, hence the low-cost dies. I am, in fact, doing the stock work and everything but chambering, fitting and d&t for sight mounting holes.

Last edited by titanicslim; October 26, 2011 at 06:50 PM. Reason: Correction
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