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Old August 11, 2011, 12:36 PM   #1
tahunua001
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Savage M25 LV-T 5.45mm

ok I'll make this as blunt as possible. I suck with rifles. I used to be alright but I've gone a few years without shooting and now I've grossly out of practice. I know that practice makes perfect but practicing with a 300 Weatherby requires a 6 figure salary and a 22 hasn't really helped in getting rid of my flinch. so I've been looking at the 2011 savage catalog and they have a model 25 in 5.45 soviet. it's cheap, it's available, and it has just that right amount of recoil to where I dont feel like I'm shooting a bb gun but I'm still not afraid of the recoil. does anyone have any experience with this gun?
is it as accurate as say...223?
how does the M25 stack up as far as quality, fit/finish, reliability required cleaning/maintenance compared to a remington 700?
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Old August 12, 2011, 12:48 PM   #2
tosainu1
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5.45 is not the answer

If a 22 has not helped your flinch, a harder recoil weapon will definitely not help. The rifle should be capable of accuracy, but shooping surplus is not going to help you become as accurate of a shooter as possible, but would be better than nothing. If your looking for a lil. more bang or flash, maybe a 22 mag or better yet a 17hmr would be better for you..
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Old August 12, 2011, 07:42 PM   #3
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I think tahunua001 is saying that the 22 doesn't recoil enough to help break the flinch habit.
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Old August 12, 2011, 09:07 PM   #4
tahunua001
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Quote:
I think tahunua001 is saying that the 22 doesn't recoil enough to help break the flinch habit.
yes, that's pretty much the point I'm trying to put across. ok here's my dillema.
I am perfectly fine with my 10/22.
I have an ar15, I can get MOA groups with it no problem.
I have 2 bolt action rifles and as soon as I grab them my body switches from shot mode to flinch mode.

I'm fairly certain that it's just an unfamiliarity with my bolt guns that is causing me to do it. and as previously stated in the OP, I just need a lot of trigger time with a bolt gun so that my subconscious doesn't automatically assume "this is gonna hurt" but both of my bolt actions use (in my opinion) ungodly expensive ammo which is my reasoning for not going with something like 223, 22-250 or similar small round. since I'm looking at getting a rifle that is solely going to be a practice gun, I dont want to be spending 100 dollars per range visit just to shoot up 50 rounds.


I know that russian surplus isn't the best ammo but I'm fairly certain that it's quite possible to get MOA groups from a 24 inch barrel at 100 yards even with crappy ammo. and I'm also aware that the savage is only availible in this chamber with a thumbhole stock which could mess with the familiarity of both my guns but my little brother has a remington 700 with a thumbhole in the same chamber as mine so that would also be a good transitional gun once I get comfortable enough to start trying to actually zero-in my rifles
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Last edited by tahunua001; August 12, 2011 at 09:12 PM.
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Old August 12, 2011, 09:36 PM   #5
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You would be better off getting a .223 than you would a 5.45. I know the ammo is cheap but so is the 223 and you have a ton of different types of ammo to choose from. Just my thoughts.
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Old August 13, 2011, 12:24 AM   #6
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5.7 soviet? That sounded interesting, I went to see if Savage was selling a new rifle chambered for a surplus pistol cartage. Its the new FN 5.7 x 28mm though. Perhaps you where mixing it up with the 7.62 x 25mm Tokarev?
Still, its a neat gun. I imagine it would have less recoil than a .223 though. Maybe one of the Ruger bolt actions in 44mag or 357 would fit your purpose. Or find someone who could make lite reloads for the 300 weatherby.

edit:
I just caught on that there is the 5.45x39 Soviet. Its not listed on the Savage website though.

Last edited by GTlefty; August 13, 2011 at 01:48 AM.
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Old August 13, 2011, 03:22 AM   #7
Jimro
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5.45 Soviet isn't exactly known for match grade accuracy. Should be fine for plinking. If you want accuracy get the M25 in .223, because then you can shoot the cheap 5.56 steel cased stuff and also have access to match grade ammo, although the twist rate on the M25 is a bit slow for the heavy pills so stick with 55gr and below.

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Old August 13, 2011, 05:19 AM   #8
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I'll second what jimro said in his post. 5.45 surplus ammo is cheep and not very accurate. You would be better served with .223. And theres always the possibility that the cheep 5.45 surplus could dry up. All it would take is one stroke of are leaders pen. Is any 5.45 made domestically right now, I don't know.
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Old August 13, 2011, 12:40 PM   #9
tahunua001
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Quote:
5.7 soviet? That sounded interesting, I went to see if Savage was selling a new rifle chambered for a surplus pistol cartage. Its the new FN 5.7 x 28mm though. Perhaps you where mixing it up with the 7.62 x 25mm Tokarev?
Still, its a neat gun. I imagine it would have less recoil than a .223 though. Maybe one of the Ruger bolt actions in 44mag or 357 would fit your purpose. Or find someone who could make lite reloads for the 300 weatherby.

edit:
I just caught on that there is the 5.45x39 Soviet. Its not listed on the Savage website though.
very true I had to do a lot of searching for it, even though it is not listed on their website it is listed in their 2011 catalog, I believe they're pretty much a made to order type deal. I didn't see anything about a 30 tok chamber though, that would also be a neat one to have though.

I'm leary of getting "cheap" 223 because I'm starting to hear a lot of KaBOOM stories from guys using tula and wolf ammo. nothing specific to 223, most f them are 9mm but it's still enough to keep me from taking the risk, hell I wont even use remington anymroe because of the inconsistency of their rounds.
aside from surplus wolf(which you already know my position), bear and hornady make 5.45mm ammo but it's all steel cased aside from silver bear.
hornady has a pretty good reputation so that would be good.

also what good is tack driver accuracy if the shooter inherently can't hit the broad side of a barn?
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Old August 13, 2011, 01:17 PM   #10
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in my opinion you might want to just trade the 300 off and get a 308 to replace it with. u never said what ur useing the gun for if its deer hunting or what.

as for the LWV in 5.45 the gun is good but the 5.45 is not and the LWV in 223 has a 1-9 twist and shoud shoot the 62gr brown bear ammo good and they ru right at $7 a box of 20 os they want brake to bank
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Old August 13, 2011, 01:34 PM   #11
tahunua001
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Quote:
in my opinion you might want to just trade the 300 off and get a 308 to replace it with. u never said what ur useing the gun for if its deer hunting or what.

as for the LWV in 5.45 the gun is good but the 5.45 is not and the LWV in 223 has a 1-9 twist and shoud shoot the 62gr brown bear ammo good and they ru right at $7 a box of 20 os they want brake to bank
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which gun?
the 300 is my "kill anything in north america" gun
my 243 rem 700 was my main deer rifle till my brother stole my AR15 last year and got himself an 250 pound buck, now I have to defend my honor and wont be able to rest until I take a deer with the AR.
the savage would be solely a plinker/practice gun, it will probably never see "active duty" service unless I'm dealing with coyotes or skunks in the back yard or something along those lines
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Old August 13, 2011, 05:07 PM   #12
M.O.A.
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well you dont have to have a 300 weatherby mag to kill any thing in north america. there is the 300 wsm that will do the same thing with less kick or even the 308 that will do at the right range's as for the 243 they dont kick that much at all and i love the round for deer and many elk and even black bear have fallin to it.
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Old August 13, 2011, 07:54 PM   #13
tahunua001
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I agree, I loved shooting my 243 and for at least a couple years I shot it quite well(by my standards at least). it's just that my gun does best with 100gr ammo, the super light 58gr winchesters behave worse than cheap rusky 5.45 probably would and for the decent stuff I end up spending a dollar every time I squeese the trigger. still a lot less than the weatherby but still enough for me to consider spending money on a gun with a cheaper round.
also a little side note, the 243 was inherited from my father and something about shooting it to such extent...I dont know...for some reason I have a lot of sentimentality built up in this gun and I dont normally get sentimental about the old man.
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Old August 13, 2011, 08:47 PM   #14
tahunua001
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I dont know...maybe I'm just being stubborn
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Old August 13, 2011, 10:40 PM   #15
M.O.A.
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most 243 wont shoot 58gners that well do to the twist rate stick to the 70 to 100 gners and they do great.

have you thought about some snap caps for the 300 and just go back to the basics of firing a rifle with out evan firing in
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Old August 14, 2011, 01:54 PM   #16
tahunua001
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I haven't been able to find snap caps for 300 WTBY. I guess I could take some epoxy and make my own...
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