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Old July 24, 2011, 11:59 PM   #1
Superdave70_02
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factory crimp

i have not been reloading very long and have seen die sets with the regular roll crimp die or a factory crimp die. what is the difference between the two and is it recommended to go ahead and shell out a little extra for the factory crimp?
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Old July 25, 2011, 12:03 AM   #2
mehavey
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what cartridges are you thinking of ?
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Old July 25, 2011, 12:14 AM   #3
zippy13
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There are roll crimps, tapered crimps and the so called factory crimp. The first two are accomplished by differing profiles of the constrictions of the crimping dies. The "factory" crimp is accomplished by a collet. Your crimp type is usually dictated by the nature of your bullet and your application. I use a "factory" crimp collet only when loading jacketed rifle bullets with a cannelure.
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Old July 25, 2011, 12:16 AM   #4
medalguy
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In general, IF you are going to crimp, I'd say use a factory crimp die. That way there's no chance of pushing back the shoulder of a bottlenecked cartridge and collapsing it when crimping. That seems to be a common problem faced by new reloaders from what I've read. In general, most handgun cartridges are crimped, and rifle cartridges used in some autoloaders require a crimp, but not all.
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Old July 25, 2011, 12:31 AM   #5
Superdave70_02
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So far I am loading .40 s&w and .223. For the .40 I have loaded some hornady xtp and some 155 gr lead cast. For the .223 I have loaded 50 gr. Vmax without cannalure to be shot out of a savage edge.
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Old July 25, 2011, 07:03 AM   #6
LDBennett
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Wonderful LEE came up with a very good idea .... Factory Crimp. Then they abused the name.

The LEE Factory Crimp (FC) die for rifle cartridges is a collet die. That is, it closes down as the cartridge is pushed up into the die. It make four or more indentation in the case neck which act to hold the bullet in. It is not a classical roll or taper crimp but indentation in the end of the neck. It is not sensitive to the trim length of the case as long as the case OAL is greater than the minimum, whereas uniform crimping in conventional die sets are trim length sensitive.

This rifle Factory Crimp die can suffer from a common LEE malady of the use of the wrong materials in the product. Eventually the similar metals of the collet and the die body gall and upset the operation of the FC die. It takes a stone to remove the galling to extend the life of the die. This was the case in my early examples of the FC dies.

When it was time for a similar Factory Crimp die for pistol cartridges LEE used the same name and a totally different design. The FC die for pistol cartridges uses either a roll or taper crimp in this die just as does the crimping action of the original die set. But LEE includes a carbide ring at the bottom of the die that works to size the finished cartridge during the FC crimping. It is not a bad idea to assure all your handgun ammo fits you gun's chamber but why did LEE not call it something else rather than ride on the success of the rifle version.

I have both rifle and pistol FC dies and like the rifle version. The pistol version was bought without knowing its design. I'll not be buying another FC pistol version as I have never had problem with any of my pistol reloads fitting any of my guns, nor have I had any trouble with using the crimp in the seating die provided with every die set.

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Old July 25, 2011, 07:22 AM   #7
mehavey
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As a straightwalled case which headspaces against the mouth, the 40 could best take advantage of a tapered crimp, commonly refered to (in my experience) a "factory" crimp.

By accident I discovered last week that RCBS is now supplying taper crimp seaters with their carbide 45 ACP dies and so too apparently also w/ their 40 S&W, etc. (They must have gotten the message.) So separate crimp dies may now be gilding the lily.
http://www.opticsplanet.net/rcbs-car...uto-22115.html

Conversely, light/medium recoil bottleneck cartidges (e.g., 223 Rem through 30-06 & beyond) headspace on the shoulder and can be run w/o any crimp at all using standard neck tension. If a crimp is used on those latter cartridges, a standard roll crimp on bullet having a specific crimping canelure is more than suitable.

Last edited by mehavey; July 25, 2011 at 07:27 AM.
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Old July 25, 2011, 07:56 AM   #8
BDS-THR
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Pistol FCD for semi-auto calibers with jacketed/plated bullets is OK but will post-size larger diameter lead bullets and add to leading problems (especially in over-sized factory barrels).

Some reloaders will knock out the carbide sizer ring so that they can seat on station #3 and taper crimp on station #4 without post-sizing lead bullets.
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Old July 25, 2011, 11:20 AM   #9
Superdave70_02
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Thank you for the help. I don't think I'll spring for the factory crimp just yet. Maybe I'll if I start reloading for my AR-15 I'll get some cannalure bullets and factory crimp.
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Old July 25, 2011, 12:09 PM   #10
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I like to separate the seating and crimping process with pistol ammo (I rarely reload any rifle ammo). From my experience, it's easier to set up. Sure there are some who say that setup without a FC die is super easy and only takes 10or 20 steps to adjust (I exaggerate) and you don't have to pull the handle an extra time, yada yada. Been covered on this forum exhaustively. My preference is to use the FC dies for both roll and taper crimping, depending on the ammo. I haven't always done so, but it has been my preference for quite a while now.
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Old July 25, 2011, 07:24 PM   #11
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I use the factory crimp die on all my pistol calibers I do not with rifle cartridges simply don't find the need to crimp.

I prefer with pistol calibers to seat and factory crimp in different operations and have not had an ftf yet with my reloads. some don't like the Lee factory crimp but in my experience any problems are caused by the set up and or operator.
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Old July 25, 2011, 07:46 PM   #12
m&p45acp10+1
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For the .223 rem being shot out of the bolt action do not worry about the crimp. I have loaded over 15k rounds of .223 since december and have not crimped a single one. A lot of those went into AR platform rifles with no problems at all.

For the .40 S&W The Lee FCD is awsome to help prevent that one or tow that would cause a hicup in spec. I use one for 9mm and .45acp.
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