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Old June 27, 2011, 06:56 PM   #1
DMMikey
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Do I trade?

I have a Sig P239 in 9 mm. I like it, but I don't. I've only fired it about 200 times. I'm pretty accurate with it in single action mode, but I haven't really been able to master the long first double action pull. I too frequently pull that off target. It also is small enough and light enough that any extended firing sessions get tiring. Most of this problem is due to a combination of small hands and having pretty severe inflammatory arthritis. I think some of this could be cured by going to Sig's short trigger.
On the other hand, I was in my LGS today, and looked at both a Hi Power and a CZ75B SA. The CZ seems a little heavier than the Browning, but it fits my hand very well. The model they had in stock was the competition shop, which is a little expensive at over $1100. The trigger was fantastic. They didn't have the regular SA in stock, but it would sell for about $550. Is the trigger close to being as good? or can it be made that way for not much money?
The Hi Power they had was the 75th anniversary addition, about $880. Trigger very, very nice. Grip a little too fat, but that is far preferable to too thin. The reach to the trigger was fine, surprisingly, shorter than the Sig.
LGS would not give me a trade value on the P239 sight unseen, but would be interested.
Do I trade? Try to fix the Sig? Which gun do I go for? Is the stock CZ SA trigger great? Any opinions welcome.
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Old June 27, 2011, 09:41 PM   #2
Sgt Pepper
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I bought a Sig P239 nib for around $450 when I seized upon a major sale at Carter's Country in Houston in 2000. It took a good 200-300 rounds through it before it was really accurate. After that, it was money. I am sure that years ago I posted a number of reviews and comments about the P239 on this board if you do a search.

Anyway, the biggest "problem" about the P239 is that it is really big and heavy for what it is: a "compact" 8 round 9mm. As much as I enjoyed shooting that pistol, I sold it in 2007 and have never looked back. As a comparison, I much prefered my Hk P7 to the P239.

I've owned all three: P239, BHP, and CZ75. Among those, for all around duty (carry, concealed, and fun), I would choose BHP hands down. Same or lighter weight. Slide and frame are thinner. Can get thin grips if you like. Very accurate. Just as reliable and soft shooting as the other.
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Old June 28, 2011, 07:26 PM   #3
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Thanks for the opinion, Sgt. Pepper. I guess no one else is much interested. My Sig has been very accurate right out of the box, the problem is me. I agree, it's a little heavy and a little large for easy concealed carry compared to many guns now out there. And it's a little small for extended firing sessions or target work. So I want to go the larger gun route. i like my Detective Special for concealed carry. I think I am going to go with the CZ, checking another LGS, as the first I went to doesn't seem to want to move off the MSRP.
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Old June 28, 2011, 08:06 PM   #4
AustinTX
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I can't speak from experience, but it sounds like a good idea to trade the Sig toward something a little less punishing to your hands. I prefer the BHP to the CZ, but the CZ is a heavier gun and will probably be easier on your hands.
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Old June 28, 2011, 08:45 PM   #5
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You will not be sorry with the CZ. It is a great pistol. Just be forewarned, it is heavy and may not be fun for everyone to carry.

I used to read about how great CZs are and used to think it was just CZ owners embellishing their gun's abilities. Ever since I bought my first CZ I doubt them no more. My last 3 pistols have been CZs.

Last edited by Mr.Blue; June 28, 2011 at 09:38 PM.
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Old June 28, 2011, 09:35 PM   #6
grumpa72
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First off, I don't think you have enough rounds through this pistol to give up on it and sell/trade it. Before you go this route, I would have at least 1000 rounds through it. My Sig P226 is very accurate in double action only because I spend a lot of time and bullets practicing. I LOVE Sigs.
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Old June 28, 2011, 09:37 PM   #7
AustinTX
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Quote:
First off, I don't think you have enough rounds through this pistol to give up on it and sell/trade it.
He has shot it enough to know that it bothers his arthritic hands in extended shooting sessions. That's reason enough to move on to something else.
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Old June 29, 2011, 10:32 AM   #8
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I agree Austin. I have realized that I'm not gonna use it for concealed carry. That is the only reason to have something this small. There is definite discomfort after 20 or so shots. I would rather have something more amenable to range work. I have to be very careful about how I grip the gun to avoid discomfort at the base of my thumb. The form of arthritis I have causes severe degeneration of the very ends of my fingers. Because of this, I have to resort to using the first joint to pull the trigger, rather than the pad at the end. The long double action reach forces me to shift my grip. I then have to shift again for the shorter reach. That just isn't going to work in the real world. So I'm looking for a consistent, shorter single action movement. I am also considering a 1911 in 9mm for this reason, but I have doubts about reliability, and they have a tendency to cost a lot.
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Old June 29, 2011, 10:43 AM   #9
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I had a BHP, wish I still had it.

There is a thread on these 2 pistols you're asking about:

http://thefiringline.com/forums/show...7&highlight=cz
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Old June 29, 2011, 10:45 AM   #10
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It's hard to go wrong with either a CZ-75 or a Hi-Power. My preference would be the Hi-Power.

SIG P239? Gone in a heartbeat if it would get me a Hi-Power.
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Old June 29, 2011, 11:10 AM   #11
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My opinion on getting a 1911 chambered for 9mm is - I would only do it if I my hand didn't fit something like a BHP or CX 75B SA. But I wouldn't have questions about their reliability - plenty of reliable 1911 models chambered for 9mm. Springfield makes one that I think is pretty good.

I've said before that I think the BHP is a fine gun but when Browning has a $1,000 MSRP on it, it's pretty tough. I know that you can find them cheaper than list but they're still expensive.

The CZ 75B SA is very similar - some people like it better and its way way cheaper.
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Old June 29, 2011, 11:18 AM   #12
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For me the BHP would be the way to go. I think their price is a little high. Do you have a good transfer dealer? If you do you can get a NIB BHP for $700 from CDNN. You will pay $15 shipping and then transfer of $10 to $25 is fair depending on the market and you will not pay sales tax.

That should get you out the door on the BHP for $740. Sell your P239 straight out. You might not like it but somoene will give you $550 for it which means the BHP will cost you under $200.
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Old June 29, 2011, 12:21 PM   #13
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I have no idea why you say you have doubts about the reliability of a M1911 design. I have an actual M1911 built in about 1914 and surely does look like a 90+ year old gun and it shoots. I am sure that at one time or another in it's army career it saw an armor's fine touch but it also took some abuse both from WW2 and from neglect.

Just don't go with one of the short barreled ones, stay with a classic 5" M1911 chambered in 9mm, lightened a little if you want. All it takes is going to the gun store and checking out how it feels.

I am not saying that an M1911 is the perfect choice, just that reliability problems are not specific to the M1911 platform, they are specific to some manufacturers and a modified M1911 platform.

P.S. there probably are some shorter M1911s that are very good, I have a 3" Kimber Ultra Carry 2 myself but I only have this one and I have only put about 400+ rounds through it so far. The manual says 450 - 500 just to break it in. It was stiff and I had problems with some steel cased Russian crap ammo initially, but since I switched to brass from decent manufacturers it's been flawless.
.45 Cal is alot to hold on to in a lightened framed 3" but a 9mm at 4 to 5" and say somewhere around 30+ ounces might just do the trick.

Then again, a HiPower is a fine design and might be just the ticket for what you want.
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Old June 29, 2011, 12:56 PM   #14
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You know, I have thought about trading my P239 9mm as well. I don't know if it is that for as big it is, but it just have not grown on me. My also has only been fired about 350 rounds.

The guns that I will target once I do this are either the new SR1911 or CZ75B. I do like the H&K P2000sk also.
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Old June 29, 2011, 11:20 PM   #15
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lcpiper
My concern about reliability of 1911 in 9mm is anecdotal only. Yes, those chambered in .45 can be and usually are very reliable. I have just heard that with the lower power (and lower recoil) from a 9mm, modifications have to be made to ensure the gun cycles properly. Lighter springs or lighter slide, etc. Nothing insurmountable, but the problem can be there. I doubt I will go that way because of cost. I may change my mind, or wait a while, and eventually get both. The good thing is, when you buy quality guns, trading usually doesn't cost and arm and a leg. i paid about $550 for the Sig, I can probably get close to that back out of it.
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