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Old July 2, 2011, 11:07 PM   #51
Lee Lapin
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Gehrhard,

The folks at Trulock have made a real name for themselves in the shotgun choke tube business. But ya know what? Nowhere on their page did they mention shotgun vs. thug/felon/housebreaker. Waterfowl, turkeys, wingshooting, claybirds, yes.

Humans, no.

I have said before that works for a sporting shotgun in the field does not necessarily apply to a defensive shotgun - defensive shotguns are handled differently. A defensive shotgun is best carried muzzle down at low ready when quick use is anticipated. On the other hand, anyone who came up behind my Brittany when she was on point with a bird gun carried muzzle down would get sent back to the truck. In the field, you carry muzzle up. Carry a defensive shotgun muzzle up and you open up too good a possibility that an assailant could get in under the muzzle and execute a disarm.

Anyone who grabs my shotgun when it's at low ready is a split second away from getting a new nickname- STUMPY. Because the muzzle will cover the assailant's feet or lower legs, and I will pull the trigger.

By the same token, what is desirable in a pattern for game birds on the wing or for clay birds is not necessarily what is desirable for antipersonnel use. For illustration, take a look at this 2007 thread at THR with quotes from professional firearms trainer John Farnam - http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/i.../t-304585.html .

See pattern pictures at http://blog.hsoi.com/2011/01/08/shotgun-ammo-trials/

There's as much more discussion of FliteControl buckshot loads on the web as you want to look for.

The stuff is 'standard' enough now that a good many LE agencies are buying it and using it in training and on patrol. ATK announced not long ago that their Speer Lawman line of buckshot will now offer a low recoil 00 FliteControl round as well ( http://le.atk.com/general/speerprodu...nbuckshot.aspx ). That makes three brands now that I know of using this wad - Hornady TAP, Federal LE and Premium, and now Speer Lawman.

In short, this stuff does what people who anticipate the necessity to use shotguns on people want their shotguns and buckshot to do. That's my standard.

YMMV of course.

lpl

And as to the 4" pattern at 25 yards - believe it or not. Other people/agencies report similar results with FliteControl loads. LE127 00 is cheap enough and widely available enough these days that anyone who wants can try it. Word of warning tho - it likes open choke barrels, CYL seems best for it. It's possible if not easy to overchoke buckshot.
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Last edited by Lee Lapin; July 2, 2011 at 11:16 PM.
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Old July 3, 2011, 02:22 AM   #52
TheKlawMan
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Gerhard, I am not talking about the standard for anything but clays, but pointing out that you were talking about the standard for clays and Lee is talking about an anti personnel application. I am not sure if he means law enforcement, but police armorer source adivese me that more that his customers are more frequently ordering modified chokes. Bare in mind that officers not only have need for buckshot, but also have occassion to fire slugs and special munitions with their shotguns. Otherwise, I imagine they might simply run with extra full or tighter chokes and need not carry the expensive flight control ammo. I really don't know and if I am incorrect anyone is welcome to correct me.
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Old July 3, 2011, 10:58 AM   #53
LockedBreech
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee
I have said before that works for a sporting shotgun in the field does not necessarily apply to a defensive shotgun - defensive shotguns are handled differently. A defensive shotgun is best carried muzzle down at low ready when quick use is anticipated. On the other hand, anyone who came up behind my Brittany when she was on point with a bird gun carried muzzle down would get sent back to the truck. In the field, you carry muzzle up. Carry a defensive shotgun muzzle up and you open up too good a possibility that an assailant could get in under the muzzle and execute a disarm.
As a (relatively) novice shotgunner, I found this very, very helpful to know. Thank you.
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Old July 3, 2011, 01:30 PM   #54
cajun47
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what kind of penetration does a 12 ga 2 3/4" buckshot have at 25 yards? 50 yards?
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