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Old May 25, 2011, 09:35 PM   #1
Coach Z
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Keltec KSG as HD gun

Am I muts to be thinking about waiting around till the fall to get one of these or should I just go with my original plan of a mossberg 500?

This is not the only weapon in the house but I don't have a pump gun...
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Old May 25, 2011, 09:44 PM   #2
the rifleer
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I'd wait if you can't get both, its a pretty neat looking gun.
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Old May 25, 2011, 09:53 PM   #3
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I'm not really a fan of being a Beta tester when it comes to keeping my hide in one piece. I wouldn't have a problem with a Kel-Tec as a range toy but for keeping my bacon in one piece, I'd stick with a proven design like the Mossberg you mentioned.
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Old May 25, 2011, 09:56 PM   #4
Willie Lowman
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I'll bet those things have a host of issues.

I haven't been very impressed with any Kel-Tec gun I've handled.
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Old May 25, 2011, 10:03 PM   #5
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Consider the release history of the PMR-30, and of the RFB.

If you can even get one in the fall, which is doubtful, you will pay through the nose for it.

If the Mossy isn't enough to get you through a home defense situation, I don't really think the KSG would save you. And you can go buy a Mossy tomorrow instead of some indeterminate time this year or next year.
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Old May 25, 2011, 11:23 PM   #6
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Get a used shotty now so you have it. IF, IF, IF the KT comes to market I'd wait until the rush subsides, and the bugs are worked out. Then you could sell the shotty for what you paid and break even and get the KT.
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Old May 26, 2011, 12:45 AM   #7
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I agree with Willie Lowman..... I havent ever been impressed with kel-tec. Im not really a fan of that particular shotgun. I do think you would be better off getting the mossy and waiting until the kinks are worked out of the kel-tec before buying one. Thats what I would do at least. Im gonna protect my family with something I have 100% faith in.
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Old May 26, 2011, 02:31 AM   #8
Bill DeShivs
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They're not called "shottys."
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Old May 26, 2011, 07:15 AM   #9
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No, they are "shotties" and we apparently have hundreds of threads where they are called "a shotty" and "shotties." So apparently they are...
http://thefiringline.com/forums/sear...archid=5299941
I don't care for the term either, but it seems to be an accepted term.

As for the KSG for HD, I really like the bullpup aspect for a reduced length gun that would make it easier to use around corners. I have a Knoxx Spec Ops stock on my 870 that gives a nice short profile, but I think the KSG is shorter. The Knoxx is nice in that it can be reduced to being shorter than a typical youth stock and yet extended if you prefer. It also helps with felt recoil.
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Old May 26, 2011, 09:35 AM   #10
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I think it's a great design.

But when I went through the pump vs auto debate in my own head - I decided I'd rather have an auto.

I also personally think that 8 rounds are going to be enough to handle any HD situation that I might face.

I am leaning toward a Mossberg 930 SPX. Having said that though, there seems to be no way to shorten the 930 up, no way to have a collapslble butt stock. There are some corners in my house I really can't go around with a long arm, the KSG would be nice for that.

I also think the vertical grips that people have put on the KSG prototype / test models slow down the functioning of the pump action on the KSG. If you watch the YouTube videos of people using these - the pump action is not smooth and I think it's because of the vertical grip.

But anyway, I think I can engage 2 targets with an auto in the time that it would take me to cycle the action once on a pump shotgun.

If I could have my wish - I'd like a KSG semi auto, and with a mechanism that automatically switched to the second feed tube after the last round came out of the first feed tube - or a mechanism that automatically switched between the two tubes, but I was thinking you'd probably need the best engineers and designers at H&K and Benelli to come up with something like that that worked and worked reliably.
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Old May 26, 2011, 09:45 AM   #11
hogdogs
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What would the weight be on this if fully loaded?

I am fine with 3-4-5-6 rounds (whatever is in it when I put it away last time) of ## buck, slugs, #4,#6, #7 1/2 or what ever is in it when I last used it...

In my Mossberg 20 gauge Pump 'em up Shottygun...

Brent
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Old May 26, 2011, 12:18 PM   #12
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Quote:
I don't care for the term either, but it seems to be an accepted term.
Not hardly, only by those lacking in certain areas.

Brent - I imagine the forward weight when fully loaded would be a real PITA to try and maneuver quickly with
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Old May 26, 2011, 12:48 PM   #13
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Quote:
Not hardly, only by those lacking in certain areas.
Your condensention aside, search here for shotty and you will find the search maxxes out at 40 pages quite readily, as does the search for "shotgun." The expression is very heavily used for one that is non-accepted, don't you think?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=shotty

Go figure.
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Old May 26, 2011, 01:00 PM   #14
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On some web sites the use of slang or shortened words, the site program automaticly inserts the proper word. This would be there to instruct the poster/author of proper wording/terms to use when posting in any forum.
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Old May 26, 2011, 01:01 PM   #15
hogdogs
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DNS, I have used every slang term possible to describe a shotgun.... But in the search that maxes out at 40 pages... about how many of the shotty hits are people correcting the poster for using the term?

And how many hits of the "shotgun" search are of folks correcting the poster for using the term "shotgun"...

There are some sites or even circles of friends where I use the terms Shotty, clip, and auto rather than Shotgun, magazine and auto loader...

But for use on TFL, I have tried to be a bit more "proper" in use of terminology if for no other reason than to make sure the readers of my posts don't assume I am a mallninja/tacticool/assault/airsoft/paintballer/WoW sort of fella...

Brent
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Old May 26, 2011, 01:16 PM   #16
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Quote:
The expression is very heavily used for one that is non-accepted, don't you think?
Does not make it correct or proper though. Does make the folks using it though seem immature - YMMV. Maybe having taught school for a while makes me dislike certain slang words, especially when one more key stroke allows the proper term to be used.

For many years a certain word used to describe persons of color was regularly and routinely used, even in the newspaper - didn't make it proper and correct, did it?

Back on topic.........while the KSG seems like a interesting application, I still wonder about handling with fully loaded magazines
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Old May 26, 2011, 01:26 PM   #17
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Kinda like when the newspeople say that the accused "pleaded" guilty, or "the driver ran him over". Pixx poor grammar, but seems to have become common usage. Makes my skin crawl every time, though. Goatwhiskers
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Old May 26, 2011, 03:42 PM   #18
Dave McC
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"Shottie" kinda irks me. I doubt that Miyashi called his best tools "Katy" for his Katana or "Washi" for his Washikazi. Respect for the hardware, IMO, is a good thing.

But to the real issue here......

The KSG may or may not be a viable HD tool,it's too new to have established a track record.

Like Brent, I opine that the dual wide track mags may adversely affect handling.

The two HD 870s here have mag extensions but handle well. Frankenstein has no extension, but with a short barrel handles FASTER than the HD tools. They're by no means slow, but Frank is Rattler fast. So is the little 20 gauge Express with it's 21" barrel.

Home defense crises rarely require more than a shot or two. It's burglars, not The Battle For Hue. Except for very rare incidents,what's in a standard pump or auto will be more than enough for reducing the threat level to acceptability.


And for those exceptions, we do practice reloading drills, do we not?
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Old May 26, 2011, 06:20 PM   #19
Coach Z
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While I hate to interrupt the terminology argument I wanted to say thanks for pointing out that this will be a heavy bastard fully loaded and I hadn't considered that. The power of the forum.


Carry on....
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Old May 26, 2011, 06:24 PM   #20
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For a purely "fun gun" it seems neat to me but not at the asking price.

Also, If you were to use it with a few rounds in each tube for a total of 6-8 for the selectivity of 2 different load types/sizes it could prove useful.

Brent
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Old May 26, 2011, 10:49 PM   #21
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Why?

Do you really see a home defense situation where you'd want to switch between ammo types?
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Old May 26, 2011, 11:36 PM   #22
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If I had total control of what round were next in line for the chamber.... sure...
And by useful, I do not mean strictly HD against human intruders... I am a utilitarian spartan sort of fella...

There are times I might need the gun to drop a 'yote at the trash can. Armadillos diggin' the yard will have 9-11 dogs both indoors and on the dog yard barkin'... Dillars only need shot with a number 6 shot.

For indoor use against an intruder, I could switch to my 00 buck tube.

I would expect, in my country setting, to need the gun 1,000 times for 4 leggers to any chance of one time against a human intruder.

Brent
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Old June 1, 2011, 04:38 PM   #23
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The KSG will make a great HD shotgun, as long as Kel-Tec puts some effort in quality control.
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