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Old May 3, 2011, 06:01 PM   #226
threegun
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Threegun, you and your range buddies; ain't up to police work, you sure as heck ain't up to spec war duty; I would put more trust in a mall cop. At least they are actually professional security
You need to put your trust in someone since you obviously can't defend yourself.

The best decision you have made to date is not trusting me to defend you. You make your unarmed untrained bed, you sleep in it.

Never said I was up to police work or military duty but you knew this already. Kinda your style to evade and deflect. Still don't make you right.

BTW for you to say that a mall cop is professional just proves how little you know about this subject matter. You make a fun punching bag however and I have enjoyed it, thanks.
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Old May 3, 2011, 06:38 PM   #227
mnero
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You have already stated more than once that you are 'better trained' then the police. AS for the poor, much maligned mall cop; they most certainly are professional, as it is their task to secure the mall. As for my 'untrained bed' a life time of training in jujitsu and 11 years of military training and service should do; of course I have enough sense to avoid trouble, on the street anyway
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Old May 3, 2011, 07:11 PM   #228
Glenn Dee
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ThreeGun,

I'm sure that you and friends are recieving competent training, and have honed your skills to a fine point. I dont dispute this. I'm glad you understand that you are the exception... not the rule. I have personal respect for any individual who accepts the responsibility of not only arming him/herself, but going the extra mile with training, and practice.

Of course there are Police Officers who are not ready for a violent confrontation. They are the exception... not the rule. Most Police Officers are better prepared for violent confrontation than 99 9/10% of all non police(civilians). The police engage in organized training in the police academy, and yearly or semi-yearly firearms training and qualification. For the most part this is not what qualifies them better. Police Officers first go through a field training period. Thats not it either. A police Officers most serious training begins the night they have to fend for themself. The company of more experienced officers, and the individual Officers own sense of survival, and experiences is what makes the difference. These experiences can be had at the range... cant be gotten in any amount of training... cant be tought in a classroom. In my experience Officers go through several phase during their career. I'm talking strictly about street cops... Not pouge's

A probie is someone who is in training, and not ready to fend for himself.

A rookie is an officer who is inexperienced, but has been thrown to the wolves.

A Cop is a rookie who's made it.

A pecock is an officer usually with around 7 years in who believes he's at the top of his game. And in fact is a legend in his own mind.

A senior man is an officer with 10 years or more who may be trying to live down his Pecock reputation, but is truely at the top of his game. These officers tend to mentor the rookies.

An old timer/hairbag is usually an officer who's over 20 years in, or a senior man who's given up and is working for the pension.

THE SENIOR MAN.. the cock of the walk. _ Command Sgt Major.

I know this has little or nothing to do with firearms. Sorry bout that. I just want folks to understand... It aint just organized training.
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Old May 3, 2011, 07:13 PM   #229
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The biggest difference being... Civilians can avoid trouble. The Police cant.
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Old May 3, 2011, 07:35 PM   #230
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You have already stated more than once that you are 'better trained' then the police
I'll pay another toll.......Better trained than MOST police. Please get it right.
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Old May 3, 2011, 07:41 PM   #231
mnero
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If only the definition of most was zero; then at least one thing you have posted in this thread would have made sense
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Old May 3, 2011, 07:55 PM   #232
threegun
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Most Police Officers are better prepared for violent confrontation than 99 9/10% of all non police(civilians).
I would agree 99 9/10 with that statement LOL.

Quote:
The police engage in organized training in the police academy, and yearly or semi-yearly firearms training and qualification.
Very basic and focused of hitting the target. Little or even nothing on tactics after the academy and few there. So while better than most civilians, who practice zero tactics and even less shooting, it is still lacking IMO compared to say a SWAT team member.

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Police Officers first go through a field training period. Thats not it either. A police Officers most serious training begins the night they have to fend for themself.
Again we agree but to a point. I believe that this on the job training hones skills needed to deal with the more common situations like traffic stops, pat downs, room clearing, etc. and not a full out shoot out.

Example......As the alarm response employee for the shops that I work, I have had dozens of opportunities to enter the shops at night with LE under suspected burglary conditions. I can tell you that not a single man or woman used good tactics in 20 years.

I asked my cousins who are LEO's how to reload with one hand.....a very basic skill, neither was taught how. Same for shooting on the move and others.
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Old May 3, 2011, 08:21 PM   #233
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Wow,
This has been quite a thread. It all boils down to rock-solid proof that I have been right all along (I love saying that whenever I can). If you live in the woods you will never have to worry about the gangs....they are afraid of the skeeters.

As for the subject of the thread, I hope none of us have to experience that type of situation...there is no way to win with any certainty.
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Old May 3, 2011, 09:02 PM   #234
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If only the definition of most was zero; then at least one thing you have posted in this thread would have made sense
Thanks buddy. Having you as a polar opposite is extremely reassuring. You must be correct after all you know my firearms training and that of MOST LEO's right? Oh wait no you don't LOL.

One thing is clear to me, you sir would have been at the mercy of the gang. Your jujitsu would be quickly over powered by just a handful of gang youth.

Can you post some of the firearms curriculum run at your choice of police academy?

How about the curriculum from say Front Sight or Thunder Ranch?

Might be fun to compare the two. I suspect you won't however.

Ever hear of the Fluid threat response?

You know my money is on you right LOL.

I didn't intend to make this about me. You attacked and in my own defense I was forced to compare firearms training. I really don't care if you believe. Just folks should know that they don't have to take a beating because some none gun carrying member who hates gun talk says that they cannot survive this encounter if they had to shoot. You are obviously biased against guns in the hands of civilians. You don't even carry yet you post in a tactics and training FIREARMS thread.

Friend please ignore my future posts as strongly as you have ignored the facts in my past posts. We should simply agree to disagree for the sake of TFL and the MODS.
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Old May 3, 2011, 09:20 PM   #235
mnero
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Jujitsu against a mob? yeah it would be problematic, it would be fool hardy. AS for non-gun carrying, yes to carry a gun in MD would mean committing a serious felony, it's the law. It is very hard to get permit to cc in MD> I has to be related to your job or they just won't give you one. As for at their mercy, no I would have gotten out of their way and I assure they would have moved on. I have been workin on the streets since I left the service, I'm older now but I am still kind of a big dude. As long as I don't bother them; they don't bother me.
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Old May 3, 2011, 09:23 PM   #236
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Wow, how we have digressed to my **** is bigger than your **** sort of "evidence" on how to tactically control a crowd of 30 gang bangers. Great. I am impressed, but nevertheless, if 30 thugs want to get you, it won't be them going home in the body bags. Have at it and good luck to anyone that thinks that they could "control" that sort of event. Yup, good luck.
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Old May 3, 2011, 09:35 PM   #237
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How about social responsibility?

You have made the choice to carry a deadly weapon. You may have made it only to protect your life and that of your family or maybe your friends. Or maybe you take responsibility of protecting your fellow citizens. Of course the problem those who defend themselves let alone others always face is being incarcerated for our troubles.
What would I do if a bunch of gang-bangers were advancing on me? I would retreat ,draw, and if the BG's continued to advance I believe I would open fire. Of course, as I'm an engineer, there is plenty of opportunity to over-think so I could very well fail.
The real question is what I would do if I thought a fellow citizen was in danger of grave injury or death. We are lucky if we don't go to jail for defending our own life, I would seriously be weighing my odds of staying out of jail for defending another. THAT is the real issue.
By all means let's watch fellow citizens get beaten , I'm sure it looked like they might survive it.
Could this possibly be why we are in the situation we are in? Everyone thinks the security of our society is the responsibility of others?

Just a thought.
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Old May 3, 2011, 09:42 PM   #238
mnero
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Alaska is right; if a gang of 'thugs' is bent on kickin your butt, then your are screwed. Avoid them; give them no reason to focuse on you; pray if you gotem' but the real key to survival is don't f... with them.
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Old May 3, 2011, 09:51 PM   #239
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Wow, how we have digressed to my **** is bigger than your ****...
Sadly this is right on target and that's going to wrap things up for this one.
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