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Old May 13, 2000, 12:08 PM   #1
Shin-Tao
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Have any of you heard about the tactic of using a fire extinguisher as a defensive weapon.
You blind the assailant with the high pressure cloud of powder or liquid and then crack him on the head with the heavy device.
It's a good idea for someone traveling in no-gun areas, countries. And the Socialists still haven't relalized a subject can defend himself with this safety tool.
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Old May 13, 2000, 03:23 PM   #2
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BUY A GUN.

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Old May 13, 2000, 03:55 PM   #3
TEXAS LAWMAN
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Dry chemical extinguishers contain either ammonium phosphate (class A:B:C) or sodium bicarbonate (class B:C [baking soda, as in Arm & Hammer]). Class D extinguishers (dry powder) are for fighting water-reactive metal fires and contain powdered graphite or some proprietary powder. All of these are pressured with compressed nitrogen generally to 195psi. Any of these would "inconvenience" a BG by blowing "sand" in his eyes and making breathing difficult.

Like carbon dioxide (CO2) exinguisher, Halon ones convert a pressurized liquid into vapor (gas) upon discharge. Either could suffocate the BG or cause frostbite of the eyes.

The only common extinguisher which emits a liquid are the 2½ gallon water pressure ones which are charged with compressed air to 100psi. It would not be difficult for a BG to defend himself against this type.

Hope this helps.
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Old May 13, 2000, 04:52 PM   #4
Gabe Suarez
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Not a bad idea if the things weren't so big & heavy. I still think having easily divorceable weapons is the key in such areas. ("No that steel pipe isn't mine...no really).

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Old May 13, 2000, 11:32 PM   #5
Shin-Tao
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Already own quite a few. Get over it Tessi. There is no reason to carry this into the forums.

It's a trick Australian truckers supposedly use. The ones that drive the big ugly road trains.

[This message has been edited by Shin-Tao (edited May 14, 2000).]
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Old May 13, 2000, 11:49 PM   #6
Gary H
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How would you dress for this type of conceal carry?
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Old May 13, 2000, 11:51 PM   #7
Shin-Tao
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Not for concealed carry. For vehicles. Like the aforementioned road trains.
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Old May 14, 2000, 01:58 AM   #8
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Facefull of ABC powder will take out a junkyard dog, dog gets bronchial spasm and cant even bark. Deadly for dog, might be same for goblin.
Facefull of Berrymans carb cleaner did in a carjacker, not fatal.

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Old May 16, 2000, 02:26 AM   #9
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I've actually been hit in the face with dry chemical from a fire extinguisher. I had just put out a fire under the hood of a car (beating it with a jacket) , when the cashier of a convenience store decided to "help" me. I'm not sure which type extinguisher she used (I assume ABC)but powder was everywhere afterwards.
Texas Lawman says it's like blowing sand in your eyes.......sorry , but I DISAGREE !
Sand in the eyes is an inconvenience. The stuff that hit me burns. It burns BAD and it keeps on burning your eyes for a couple of days. For about 10 minutes, all I could do was cough, gag, blow blood out of my nose, and hold my face in a stream of cold water. I have been maced ( CN spray ) and OC peppered ... neither compares to a fire ext.
Now, it may be that she hit me just right or something, and I wasn't in fight/flight mode but dry chem. sure put me out of commission. Neither mace nor OC pepper did.
Wouldn't rely on a fire ext. for protection unless there was no other option, though.
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Old May 16, 2000, 11:17 AM   #10
redhat1
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Be careful discharging one inside a room. The cloud of powder will likely stop/slow down a bad guy but you will end up coughing etc from the cloud of powder too.
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Old May 16, 2000, 12:36 PM   #11
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Real-world example, FWIW: Anyone remember the Israeli dentist who shot up the mosque in Jerusalem a few years ago? He was beaten to death with fire extinguishers by the (unarmed) mosque-goers.

Another FWIW: He used aimed, semiautomatic fire to do the deed. It was touted by the media as a "special" technique, taught by, and used only by, the military, and deadlier than the "usual" technique (which is...?).
 
Old May 17, 2000, 05:27 AM   #12
George Hill
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Icky...
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Old May 17, 2000, 02:18 PM   #13
Matt VDW
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Does anyone have a good idea of the effective range (for defensive purposes) of the most common types of fire extinguishers? (I'm thinking about spraying range, not bludgeoning range. )
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Old May 17, 2000, 02:25 PM   #14
Coinneach
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Matt, if you're talking about the little canisters that hang on the inside of the cabinet doors, you're looking at about 10 feet.

Having been on the receiving end of an ABC bottle, I can testify to their effectiveness. I was completely useless for about 30 minutes afterwards (not that I'm not completely useless now, y'all unnerstan'). Hacking, wheezing, blowing snot, running at the eyes... it reminded me of the gas chamber at basic.
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Old May 18, 2000, 04:18 AM   #15
animal
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10 feet sounds about right. When I got hit it was at a distance of about 1-1/2 feet, max.
Fire was out. I was leaning over the car, looking into the engine compartment. Heard her coming up behind me, turned head to see who it was, and Whammo ! Straight into the face... Not pleasant.
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Old May 19, 2000, 01:29 PM   #16
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I was working in one of the newly formed Russian states about 4 months ago. Getting into that place was more difficult than getting out, believe me. Slim to no chance of getting in a firearm.

The story goes like this, my team wanted dinner and I wanted sleep, so our escort was dropping them off at a resturant near our hotel, then dropping me off. As I waited, I noticed an issue developing. I did a quick assesment and found a tire iron and fire extinguisher. I choose the fire extinguisher and got out of the vehicle. I really did not have to do anything, but stand there with this red canister in my hands and the "businessmen" stopped in thier tracks, rattled something to which I shrugged my shoulders and backtracked. The funny thing was they litterally walked backwards, never really taking their eyes of me.

With my luck, it was probably the same design they use to carry nuclear grade platonium in, they really did not want anything to do with it, or I guess they could have recognized it as a fire extinguisher.

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Old May 22, 2000, 11:43 AM   #17
Jack 99
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I sense a business opportunity here.

Let's see, take some high-pressure extinguishers with some range to Australia, paint them black so they look more "tactical", hang out at truck stops and sell them for $50 a pop.

Hmmmmm.
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Old May 24, 2000, 02:45 PM   #18
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Just grab a charged hoseline with 100psi. It hurts bad enough.

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Old May 27, 2000, 01:30 AM   #19
Jake 98c/11b
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A friend of mine is a long haul trucker who told me of an encounter he had in New York. He was at a red light when someone with a knife jerked the door open and began to pull my friend out of the truck. On the way out of the truck my buddy was able to lay hands on a can of wasp spray. When he hit the ground my friend was able to push his attacker back a few feet and gave him a blast in the face. The attacker staggered back choking, screaming and clawing at his face. My friend got into his truck and drove down the street and stopped the first policeman he found and related what happened, in the end he had no legal trouble. He says he chose the wasp spray because it can be transported anywhere in the country (in a vehicle anyway) has a reasonable range (up to 35 feet) and should be (was) very effective (its basicly a wattered down nerve gas). The fact that he has a horrible allergic reaction to wasp and bee stings is just icing on the cake, his prescription case of epinephrin auto injectors couldnt hurt his defence either.
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Old May 27, 2000, 11:09 PM   #20
Shin-Tao
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Wasp spray. That sounds nasty.
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Old May 28, 2000, 09:41 PM   #21
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Been there, done that!
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Old June 2, 2000, 12:00 PM   #22
medicjim
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OK, I'm new here, so I'll tread a little light...Wasp spray is usually a simple hydrocarbon that passes through the wasp's carapace and "interrupts" their open circulatory system. Nerve gas is an organophospate or carbamate, more common in the "tree spray" variant of insecticide.

Dry chem extinguishers hurt like heck when you get the powder on exposed mucous membranes or eyes, but Capsum Mace in PD strength hurts more....

You can buy the "super mace" canisters made for Bears, which is actually a small Halon extinguisher filled with mace...thus, the best of both worlds...

Oh, and the standard fire hose line (1-1/2, 1-3/4, 2" diameter) are not painful when employed at the standard 100 psi for a fog nozzle or 70 psi straight bore... we play with them all the time...

2.5" hoses and over can be painful, but not really....
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