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Old March 28, 2011, 05:58 PM   #1
duelist1954
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Video - Shooting cap & ball with paper cartridges

One of our readers sent me some of his combustible paper cartridges to test. It was a hoot getting out with the C&B sixguns!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vx_nQphKO4
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Old March 28, 2011, 07:25 PM   #2
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Here you go!

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Old March 28, 2011, 07:35 PM   #3
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Mike,

Did you have to use a nipple prick to puncture the paper after seating, or did they crush open when seated?
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Old March 29, 2011, 12:49 PM   #4
duelist1954
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The paper is nitrated, so it is highly combustible. The cap gets it going without ripping or pricking.
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Old March 29, 2011, 01:21 PM   #5
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Quote:
The cap gets it going without ripping or pricking
Perhaps, but I imagine there'd be a bit of a delayed fire if it had to burn through the nitrated paper first (paper ain't powder). My bet is that the end does tear some when the cartridge is rammed down the cylinder. Would be interesting to seat a cartridge, remove a nipple, and check it out.
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Old March 30, 2011, 09:17 PM   #6
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Great video! It looks like his cartridges work nicely. Am curious - did you grease over the ends of the cylinder chambers after loading or leave them un-greased and shoot with just the cartridge in the chamber? Thanks!
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Old March 31, 2011, 04:16 AM   #7
Bill Akins
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I enjoyed the video Mike. Got to make me another similar batch of those out of magician nitrated paper. Love to hear you ring that gong!



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Old March 31, 2011, 07:08 PM   #8
CameronP
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Great Video.
I made up cartridges using cigarette papers that also worked well using balls.
I was wondering though: The aforementioned paper cartridges looked like they were made up using the old-original style conicals. I was wondering if the maker used the small iron/brass double mold to cast them.
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Old April 2, 2011, 07:05 AM   #9
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Cameron, I wondered the same thing. I'll have to ask him. I know my conical molds are more rounded at the bullet nose.
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Old April 2, 2011, 03:06 PM   #10
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Duelist - still curious as you don't show it on the video - did you grease over the projectiles or just load them and shoot? Thanks.
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Old April 2, 2011, 03:49 PM   #11
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This thread has given me the bug and I have been thinking about starting to "roll" my own cartridges for my C&B pistol using conicals, so I have some questions. Having only used round balls in my pistol where a ring was shaved off, I assume from the video that you do not shave off a ring of lead with conical bullets. So what diameter bullet do I use in my .44 cal revolver (Pietta Colt replica)? Do they have a hollow base the expands like the Minnie bullets? If I mould my own bullets, do I lubricate them?

Thanks
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Old April 2, 2011, 05:24 PM   #12
hongrn
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Darwin,

Please see the enclosed chart from my Pietta 1851 and 1860 manual. They recommend .454" for conical bullets.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf BP Powder&Projectile.pdf (64.7 KB, 15 views)
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Old April 3, 2011, 10:48 AM   #13
darwins
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You reminded me that I also have a booklet that came with my revolver, however the chart in it only indicates the size of ball to use. It doesn't have the chart you scanned. Mine is about 5 years old. so my booklet is no help. I must say I'm puzzled that it would say to use the same diameter conical bullet as round ball. That just seems to me it would be quite difficult to load a conical of that diameter.
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Old April 3, 2011, 11:39 AM   #14
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My manual says "comical" bullet
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Old April 3, 2011, 11:40 AM   #15
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I use a Lee conical in my .36's and they're tapered. Easy to load straight.



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Old April 3, 2011, 01:01 PM   #16
darwins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hongrn
My manual says "comical" bullet
Thats funny. Do they make you laugh when you shoot them?
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Old April 3, 2011, 01:04 PM   #17
darwins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawg Haggen
I use a Lee conical in my .36's and they're tapered. Easy to load straight.
Nice. I was just looking at some Lee molds.
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Old April 3, 2011, 06:24 PM   #18
Bishop Creek
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This guy has some nice custom molds for both cartridge and cap and ball black powder pistols:

http://www.biglube.com/

And here is his excellent cap and ball mold to make lubed conical type bullets, the EPP-UG:

http://www.biglube.com/BulletMolds.a...d-6d9c2d504d33

Or you buy pre cast and lubed bullets made from his molds here:

http://www.whyteleatherworks.com/BigLube.html
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Old April 3, 2011, 08:06 PM   #19
Hawg Haggen
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85.00 for a six cavity lee mold without handles when the standard bp conical molds work just fine. I don't think so.
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Old April 3, 2011, 09:09 PM   #20
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I have the standard two cavity Lee conical molds for a .36, .44, and .58 mini ball. All three cost me about $65.....total. For $85, he can keep them.
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Old April 3, 2011, 10:01 PM   #21
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Hawg - I checked T or the W and they show a Lee 90378 double cavity mold for 130 grain .375 conicals - is this the one you are using for your 36s? I'm using 375 balls in both my Pietta Remington 36 Navy and my Uberti '51 Colt Navy for with the tapered base, I'm assuming these would work in both and have room to index under the loading rammer? I haven't shot conicals out of a C & B revolver for years but would like to have a go at it again. What are your accuracy results like comparing the round ball with the conicals? Much of any difference? The conicals I shot years ago were solid base and I see the ones from the above mold are hollow base. What are you using for lube (I'm assuming you are lubing the base?) - are you using Crisco the same as in a .58 minie? Thanks for any info you can provide. BTW - T of the W lists the double cavity mold at $19.25 + shipping. I've used steel molds as well as the Lee molds - RB and minie - was happy with both. I think Lee puts out a good product at a reasonable price. Thanks!
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Old April 3, 2011, 10:20 PM   #22
Hawg Haggen
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Bedbug, thats the mold I have but I got mine from Midway for about the same price. It is a solid base mold tho. Accuracy is about the same as round balls. I use a Crisco/beeswax mix for lube. As you can see in the pic most of the bullet seats from thumb pressure and leaves plenty of room for it to get under the ram.

6 shots, minute of coffee can at 25 yds.



But you say there's only five holes?






Expansion with stick on wheel weights is good too.

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Old April 4, 2011, 12:06 AM   #23
darwins
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They seem to be key holing. Is that to be expected?
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Old April 4, 2011, 12:26 AM   #24
Hawg Haggen
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No they don't keyhole they just tear the metal on the way in.
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Old April 4, 2011, 01:38 PM   #25
bedbugbilly
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Hawg - my mistake on the hollow base - I went back and took a better look at the mold. From the looks of your coffee can . . . well . . . I'm glad I'm not a facin' you in a gun fight! Impressive indeed! I wondered about "key holing" as well with a conical - not based on your coffee can but I remember years ago my friend and I used conicals in his Remmie - this was in the 60s - and we had some problems with it. It was a bronze/brass frame Richland Arms NMA. We always figured the cause was the difference in the cylinder bore and the barrel bore. I had the same problem with my Remington Zouave when I was shooting NSSA (key holing) until I got the minie size corrected and sized right. My bore was just oversize enough that they'd hit sideways - I never was in a hurry to correct it as it peeved one of the guys on the team who had plenty of money and was shooting a custom built rifle. I think that when I get back to MI, I'll order one of the 36 conical molds and give it a try - your shooting has cinvinced me that they have a lot of merit! My friend died about 40 years ago and his widow gave me the Richland Arms Remmie as a keepsake. Unfortunately, his sone had taken it apart and lost the loading lever - how, I don't know. I'm hoping that I can get a replacement fitted to it as I can't find a Richland Arms loading lever ass'y. Maybe that would be a good "project" for Doc Hoy? Thanks for the info and photos Hawg - greatly appreciated!
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