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Old November 17, 2013, 01:35 PM   #2801
Chaz88
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I have always had a problem with executive privilege, unless it is used in clear cut matters of national security. Other than that, to me, it is just a way to cover up getting caught with your hand in the cookie jar.

I think this will end up being something like Irangate. The whole truth did not come out tell after president Regan passed away. If it had happened at the time he might well have been impeached.

Now if Holder would have taken a page from the Oliver North book and fell on his sword the whole thing would probably have died out by now.
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Old November 17, 2013, 02:07 PM   #2802
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Interesting argument. I suspect it will be granted.
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Old November 18, 2013, 08:01 PM   #2803
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Purely a delay tactic pursued in the hope it will go away if it strings out past Obama's term of office.
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Old November 19, 2013, 05:24 PM   #2804
Glenn E. Meyer
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Judge says NO:

http://www.politico.com/blogs/under-...96.html?hp=l25

Quote:
A federal judge has refused Attorney General Eric Holder's request that he be allowed to proceed now with an appeal in a case where the House of Representatives is seeking to enforce subpoenas for documents related to the controversial Operation Fast and Furious gun investigation.
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Old November 20, 2013, 09:22 AM   #2805
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He may petition for a writ of mandamus. Technically, the underlying case should move forward in the meantime.
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Old January 1, 2014, 01:32 PM   #2806
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Meanwhile, another gun from the operation has shown up at a shootout in Puerto Penasco.

The Bureau gave a typical non-apology.

Quote:
ATF has accepted responsibility for the mistakes made in the Fast and Furious investigation and at the attorney general's direction we have taken appropriate and decisive action to ensure that these errors will not be repeated. And we acknowledge that, regrettably, firearms related to the Fast and Furious investigation will likely continue to be recovered at future crime scenes.
And of course, nobody in the chain of command has been so much as reprimanded.
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Old January 1, 2014, 07:36 PM   #2807
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At the risk of repeating myself, the ongoing shenanigans, the stone walling and obfuscation of/by the Obama administration, it's ATF and DOJ constitute a giant ZITZ in the face of what passes for the system of justice, as it exists in this country. Of course, I fully expect a continuation of the above mentioned, I would be terribly surprised to see anything else.

As to the following, posted by Tom Servo: "ATF has accepted responsibility for the mistakes made in the Fast and Furious investigation and at the attorney general's direction we have taken appropriate and decisive action to ensure that these errors will not be repeated. And we acknowledge that, regrettably, firearms related to the Fast and Furious investigation will likely continue to be recovered at future crime scenes,", recently JP Morgan-Chase, in one of their "settlements" with federal regulators actually admitted wrongdoing, if I understood published reports correctly. Interestingly, nobody there is being punished either, certainly no responsible parties, though possibly some oh so convenient, low level sacrificial lambs might one day be found.

Last edited by alan; January 1, 2014 at 07:42 PM.
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Old January 3, 2014, 11:16 AM   #2808
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Meanwhile, a federal judge released Ian Garland from prison.

He is a gun dealer who made the mistake of cooperating with the ATF and doing what they asked him to do.

http://libertyunyielding.com/2013/12...-fast-furious/
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Old January 3, 2014, 11:34 AM   #2809
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Yep, it's sad that the US congress refused to rein in the BATFE.
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Old January 3, 2014, 10:22 PM   #2810
alan
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thallub wrote:

"Yep, it's sad that the US congress refused to rein in the BATFE. "

Being just a retired Draftsman, I might not know much. That being said, "sad" doesn't begin to adequately describe the situation. Oh by the way, given the weak-kneed attitude of Congress, I suspect that the situation can reasonably be expected to get worse.

BTW, re the Garland case, mentioned in another post, exactly how did the firearms he sold to traffickers, with the knowledge and consent of the BATFE ever come to be "mislabeled" as machine guns? I also wonder as to exactly what the judge might have had to say to the referenced but unnamed "federal prosecutors"

Last edited by alan; January 3, 2014 at 10:31 PM.
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Old January 13, 2014, 10:46 PM   #2811
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Fast and Furious just heated up again. Bigtime.

We now have actual court documents from a US court that the US DEA was allowing drugs into the US from one particular Cartel in exchange for ongoing information on the rest. The "friendly" Cartel?

Sinaloa.

http://www.businessinsider.com/the-u...-cartel-2014-1

DEA agents are now talking about this alliance in court filings.

This is the same gang that the vast majority of the F&F guns went to. While the court docs don't seem to mention (yet) a parallel cooperation between ATF and the Sinaloa on the guns, the fact that the DEA was in bed with them raises the odds that there was absolutely no intention of a "sting" ever - the whole point was to have the guns "walk" to a criminal gang we had been treating as an ally from at least 2000-2012.
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Old January 14, 2014, 12:03 AM   #2812
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Whoa. No wonder this has been dragging - if true, past and present AG and Administrations are guilty of aiding and abetting, BIG trials. Nobody in government wants something this big to blow open - they will have to build a whole new federal prison to house all the convicted felons to come out of it.
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Old January 14, 2014, 07:11 PM   #2813
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Re the latest, if you think that there have been or are cover-ups of government shenanigans ongoing, did you ever come across the following admonition: "You ain't see nuttin yet honey".
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Old January 14, 2014, 08:01 PM   #2814
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Quote:
if true, past and present AG and Administrations are guilty of aiding and abetting, BIG trials. Nobody in government wants something this big to blow open - they will have to build a whole new federal prison to house all the convicted felons to come out of it.
Nah!

Like the Ollie North fiasco, there will be a low level fall guy.
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Old January 14, 2014, 08:26 PM   #2815
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This latest information is confirmation but is not new that the U.S. was favoring the Sinaloa cartel. A post from 1911 -- http://thefiringline.com/forums/show...postcount=1061
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Old January 14, 2014, 08:47 PM   #2816
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Yes, we knew the Sinaloa were "favored sons" of some sort for years.

We now have proof from actual DEA agents doing court filings, AND we know that the alliance extended from cash to drugs to guns - the entire gamut of cartel activity short of kidnapping and murder, and we'll likely find out about those soon enough.

I'm ready to take the next jump and tie this to the NSA spookery. If the USofA is doing all their heinous crap in regards Mexico and God only knows where else, are they likely to use the NSA to both further the criminal conspiracies and use the snooping abilities to close in on anybody ready to blow the whistle?

At what point do we use terms like "intolerable"?
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Old January 15, 2014, 12:39 PM   #2817
alan
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Anyone want to bet, either for or against the possibility of additional Obama Executive Orders, more gun control, for after all, isn't a crime to let a "crisis" go to waste.

Think that any of the possible executive orders will be aimed at punishing guilty parties in the Obama Administration, or checking their antics? I know it's a silly question, just couldn't resist asking.
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Old January 15, 2014, 12:44 PM   #2818
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The CIA angle is very interesting, and dovetails quite nicely within what we already knew about F&F. It also helps explain why certain of the congressional leadership has been foot-dragging with respect to the F&F investigation.
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Old January 15, 2014, 09:15 PM   #2819
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csmsss wrote:

"The CIA angle is very interesting, and dovetails quite nicely within what we already knew about F&F. It also helps explain why certain of the congressional leadership has been foot-dragging with respect to the F&F investigation."

You are an evil minded individual.
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Old January 15, 2014, 09:52 PM   #2820
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We're really drifting into conspiracy on the CIA angle. Let's stick to what we can verify.
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Old March 11, 2014, 06:25 AM   #2821
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Sheryl Attkinson resigns CBS

She deserves a lot of credit for her work on F+F.I saw the news of her resignation on The Blaze.Her reason,media bias and her work being buried.
I will be curious to see where she goes,and what she may reveal.
I do not think we have heard the last on F+F. 2014 might be an enlightening year.
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Old March 11, 2014, 04:42 PM   #2822
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Here's the story from Politico. I agree she deserves a lot of credit for her work on F&F/Gunrunner. The article indicates she is going to concentrate of finishing a book.
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Old March 11, 2014, 07:36 PM   #2823
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It I may be permitted to sum things up, the following comes to mind.

1.The entire criminal fiasco of Op.F & F climbs to the highest levels of government, where the present administration is concerned.

2. No way in hell will those ultimately responsible ever, in any way at all, be punished.

3. Congress critters who carry water for Obama et al, the DOJ under Holder, Obama's AG and the BATFE won't ever be called to task either, I truly hope I'm wrong here, don't think so though.

4. It strikes me as to sad to carry one with at the moment.

5. Almost forgot, the culpability of media in this criminal fiasco should not be forgotten either. With unfortunately few exceptions, media's culpability remains, emblazoned on the horizon, to its' everlasting shame.

Last edited by alan; March 11, 2014 at 07:51 PM.
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Old March 12, 2014, 03:17 AM   #2824
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I never stopped following this issue, but I stopped following this thread more than a year ago. I'm shocked to come back now and find it still going. This whole debacle has just gotten ridiculous, but more ridiculous than the actions of the government itself is the complete lack of will to hold anyone accountable. It's a dangerous trend for party's to be more concerned with saving face than promoting justice.
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Old March 12, 2014, 08:32 AM   #2825
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Quote:
This whole debacle has just gotten ridiculous, but more ridiculous than the actions of the government itself is the complete lack of will to hold anyone accountable.
This is the tragedy of the entire Fast and Furious train wreck. Too bad Issa and crew lacked the stomach for reforming the BATFE.

Once it became widely known that the same BATFE agents who ran guns into Mexico under Operation Wide Receiver also ran Operation Fast and Furious the steam went out of the investigation.

The fact that Issa dropped the F&F hearings after the 2012 elections makes his investigation reek of a election year extravaganza.

Last edited by thallub; March 12, 2014 at 08:39 AM.
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