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Old January 15, 2011, 10:39 AM   #1
jwm8375
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Remington 700 VTR or SPS SS .308

This is my 1st post here, i am brand new to this so i am glad i have found a board where i can learn a lot! I have decided to start hunting, i have always loved guns and own a few but not a hunting rifle. I was originally going to go cheap and get a remington 770 with scope ready out of the box but then after bad reviews ( and also realizing that none of my guns now are the cheapest on the market) decided to go for the 700. i think i have narrowed it down to the 700 VTR or the 700 SPS SS .308. I am going to start off with hogs here in FL then move on to white tail here in FL and with family in MI. Which would you guys (and girls) say is the best fit and why? Also, i am planning on mounting it with a Nikon Prostaff 3-9X40, comments on that as well would be appreciated. (is there any advantage to a SS scope over a matte)? thanks in advance!
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Old January 15, 2011, 02:18 PM   #2
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Old January 15, 2011, 03:22 PM   #3
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Good choice in caliber, me I'd opt for the sps and pick up better scope than the prostaff. Recently saw Nikon Monarch 3-9x40 for $200 which is a much better scope than the pro-staff. If you want a Nikon get a Buckmaster at a minimum. FWIW I have several Nikons, good glass for the money imo.

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Old January 15, 2011, 03:55 PM   #4
jwm8375
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thank you, i will look into the Monarch, any benefit to a SS scope? Also, do you think the Remington is better then the equivalently priced Savage ($550ish)?
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Old January 15, 2011, 04:37 PM   #5
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Monarchs are definitely worth a look for the price.

Either rifle would be great for hunting, but I would choose the SPS because of no muzzle break. That will deflect more of the sound back towards you and others around you. Most hunters don't wear hearing protection which is a bad idea (I'm guilty of it at times too!). I don't know of any advantage of a SS scope over the matte.. and most would argue the matte is better because it will be less noticeable by the animals you are hunting.

And it seems like most of the reviews I read say the VTR isn't accurate enough to demand the higher price.

I personally would get the Savage over the Remington. They are great rifles.
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Old January 15, 2011, 04:47 PM   #6
jwm8375
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ndking1126, thank you for your input, what model Savage would you recommend in the $500-600 range? i would prefer a SS barrel though..


Also, if the majority of my shooting is going to be in FL for hog and white tail with a rare trip to MI here and there, is a 308 a better choice then a 30-06?

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Old January 15, 2011, 06:23 PM   #7
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For hunting purposes, .308 and .30-06 can be considered equal unless your trying to push bullets over 200 grains. I like .308 because of the short action and being able to find cheap ammo and brass to reload with.

I would say .308 based off cost and short action. .30-06 is only really an advantage if you are shooting to 1000 yards or hunting large game that need a 200+ grain bullet to take down.
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Old January 15, 2011, 06:55 PM   #8
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If you're in Florida Dick's sells the 700 ADL stainless for $489 in .308. They often run additional savings of $30. That will save you about $200 over the SPS and you can put the money towards a better scope.

A 3x9 40 in the $189 to low $200 range would be a step up from the Prostaff. Burris has some nice scopes in that price range. The matte scope has the advantage in that you will have a lot more scopes to choose from.

For deer and hog hunting in Florida I think the .308 is a very good choice.
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Old January 15, 2011, 09:50 PM   #9
jwm8375
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does it come in a SS barrel option? what would you guys say the best scope for under $200 would be? sorry i am truly new to this!

Also is 308 going to be ok for MI hunting?
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Old January 15, 2011, 10:43 PM   #10
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I've found the Weaver scopes to be absolutely fantastic. In equal length barrels, toss a coin between the 308 and '06. Have loaded for them longer than I like to remember. The 308s I've owned over the years shoot 150 Hornadys and Sierras about 1/4" better than the '06.

In the SPS, you'll get a 24" barrel, so 30-06 would be the correct choice because 2850 with a 180gr bullet leaves the 308 well behind.
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Old January 15, 2011, 11:06 PM   #11
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if i can "grain down" a 30 /06 and it wont be over kill for FL that sounds like maybe a better all around caliber because i could always "grain up" if i ever by chance went out west for big game AND it would be big enough for anything on the east coast. What do you guys think? 308 or a 30 / 06? would the 06 be WAY over kill for FL if grained down?

What is 2850?

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Old January 15, 2011, 11:27 PM   #12
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I bought a marlin XS-7 in 308 with a Vortex scope for about 500. The Vortex scope is a great scope and they are gaining popularity in my area very quickly. If you are set on a SS barrel then you wont see a price difference, but I am really happy with my marlin, if you can live with a blued barrel then the marlin will make you very happy. And the 308 does real well as an elk round here in Idaho. There are many people who think they need a magnum rifle but the 308 and 30-06 do very well taking animals here. I can't imagine you having a hard time taking deer in Michigan with a 308
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Old January 15, 2011, 11:29 PM   #13
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2850 is velocity/speed ... in feet per second

I would go for the 308 because there is not as much recoil as 30-06

I am able to shoot my 308 better than my brother's 30-06 because my shoulder gets beaten up which results in flinching after ~10 shots with the 30-06; then my shooting gets worse.
The 308 is very manageable and I have shot 80 rounds in a row without flinching, which results in better shooting and more enjoyable shooting. Unless you're gunning for bear a 308 will do for most any bigger sized game.

Ammo is easily found and decently priced for both. As far as game hunting, Remington core-lockt's (in 30-06) are cheap and work good, my brother used 165 grainers in his 30-06 with good results, I use 174 grainers in 308 which I like.

Good luck in choosing, I dont think you can go wring with either caliber but I think you will have more fun shooting 308 and it will do the job for whitetail etc.
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Old January 15, 2011, 11:43 PM   #14
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I've got the 700 SPS SS .308 with a Prostaff 3x9 and I'm pretty satisfied with it. The stock seems a little flimsy in the fore-end but it shoots straight.
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Old January 16, 2011, 12:05 AM   #15
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"...700 VTR or SPS..." Hi. Same rifle with a different stock and barrel. The SPS is an entry level M700. The VTR is a bit higher end and a couple hundred more expensive. The muzzle brake will increase the noise to you and anybody near you, but reduce the muzzle jump and felt recoil.
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Old January 16, 2011, 12:07 AM   #16
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My son's SPS Varmit is a tad bit more accurate than my VTR. Both are 700's in .308. I really like my VTR toriugh. About 2 pounds lighter than his SPS.
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Old January 16, 2011, 12:36 AM   #17
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You want the SPS Varmint! It's a tack driving son of a gun out of the box.
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Old January 16, 2011, 12:46 AM   #18
ndking1126
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Here is my recommendation for rifle. It comes with a scope, but plan on changing that out. You may even be able to find one a little cheaper without it. The accutrigger is much better than the Xmark trigger that comes on the Remingtons IMHO. At this price range, I would give Remington a slight edge in the quality of the stock.. neither are fantastic though.

For scope, you're in luck if you are planning on buying one right now. Burris FFII for sale for $200. I bought this exact scope (but with ballistic plex) for their normal price about 2 years ago. This is a legitimate $350 scope on sale, not one of those deals where they jack the "normal" price way up so it looks like a good deal. I still have this scope on my hunting rifle (.30-06) and I shot an antelope this year at 330 yards. You won't find better glass for the money, promise.

Ah-ha! Found this rifle for actually in your price range!! Weather warriors are great rifles, I've known a few guys that loved them.

In all honesty, don't sweat over .30-06 vs .308.. at all. They really are that similiar. Even the price of ammo is usually the exact same. Here is the .30-06 and its a little more expensive. Buy the .308 and use the extra money for the scope or more ammo to practice.
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Old January 16, 2011, 01:05 AM   #19
jwm8375
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thank you all so much! so this --> http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/78556

is better then this --> http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/97136

??
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Old January 16, 2011, 01:14 AM   #20
ndking1126
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My take..

Accuracy.. could go either way, entry level rifles are more accurate than they have ever been. Probably the Savage will be more accurate out of the box. You can expect both to be well accurate enough for hunting.
Trigger.. I give this to Savage
Stock.. I give this to Remington, but it's close.
Barrel.. the extra 2" of the Remington will make the bullet have a higher muzzle velocity. For what you will do, however, there will be no noticeable advantage because both are plenty strong for killing deer and pigs. The extra 2" may make the gun feel front heavy and a little more awkward to shoulder in a hurry. (hunting pigs you sometimes have to whip it up there and make an accurate shot!!)
Upgradeability.. both rifle have a lot of aftermarket parts, but Remington probably has more. The Savage is easier to replace the barrel on your own if you ever want to/need to down the road. There are tons and tons of gunsmiths that work on Remingtons.

Both guns will serve you very well. You're best bet is to hold each one and see which fits you better. As mentioned, the stock and over all feel of the gun will be different, and will likely sway you one way or the other in your purchasing decisions.

Now.. buy one and give us a range report with pics! I've earned it with all this typing
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Old January 16, 2011, 01:19 AM   #21
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And one more thing

The Remington has a hinged floor plate magazine, meaning you can empty the shells out of the bottom. The Savage if you fill it up, you have to chamber each round and then eject it.. round after round.

I've never had a rifle with a hinged floor plate magazine, and I've never felt it was something I needed. Some people think they are a necessity. That's fine by me, I just don't understand why. Other than maybe some tactical/police sniper situations, I just don't see any advantages they offer.
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Old January 16, 2011, 09:51 AM   #22
jwm8375
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ndking1126,
Thank you very much! I am going to the gun store and looking at them both in person (along with the scope you recommended) but i think due to the price difference i will buy from Buds. I will do a post for pics and a range report ASAP, thank you all so much for all of your help. I am so happy i found this board, seems like a good group of people!
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Old January 16, 2011, 01:29 PM   #23
Flatbush Harry
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I got a Rem 700 SPS SS in .308 Win back in 2008 to use as a hunting rifle. I mounted a Zeiss Conquest 3-9x40 scope on it but otherwise left it stock, including trigger pull.

With my handloads it will produce <0.4" 3-shot groups at 100 yds all afternoon. Based on this, I recommend the SPS SS, but I am a simple guy.

FH



Last week with handloads, 42.0 gr RL15 under a 168gr SMK, CCI BR2 primers, 1x R-P cases
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Old January 16, 2011, 02:35 PM   #24
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If recoil isn't a concern I would go with the 30.06. You can get factory ammo for 110gr-220gr and everything in between.
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Old January 16, 2011, 10:00 PM   #25
ndking1126
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Just to make sure..

Are you familiar with ordering guns online? If not, you have to have an FFL licensed dealer local to you fax/send their FFL license to buds. Normally the FFL dealer will charge about $25-35 per firearms transfer. The cost could be free or it could be more, just depends on what the FFL holder wants to charge. This is a federal requirement so it will apply to any online sales.

I'm sure Buds would be happy to explain it in more detail.

I was rereading the posts here, and noticed one guy said he saw a Monarch for $200. I would recommend the Monarch over the FFII if you can find one at that price. The difference is higher magnification for the FFII, but higher optical quality for the Monarch. For hunting at normal ranges, the 3-9x is plenty of magnification.
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