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Old January 10, 2011, 07:49 PM   #1
Wildalaska
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So Is There a Right to Bear Glocks?

Not according to the NY Times:


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/10/op...s.html?_r=1&hp

'If Loughner had gone to the Safeway carrying a regular pistol, the kind most Americans think of when they think of the right to bear arms, Giffords would probably still have been shot and we would still be having that conversation about whether it was a sane idea to put her Congressional district in the cross hairs of a rifle on the Internet.

But we might not have lost a federal judge, a 76-year-old church volunteer, two elderly women, Giffords’s 30-year-old constituent services director and a 9-year-old girl who had recently been elected to the student council at her school and went to the event because she wanted to see how democracy worked. "

Does she have a point? Would the banning of semi automatic pistols be constitutional if revolvers were untouched? Can some arms be banned as long as all are not? How about Hi Cap magazines, would a ban on that pass strict scrutiny...how about intermediate scrutiny?

Your thoughts

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Old January 10, 2011, 07:59 PM   #2
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Hell, why leave it at that? Why allow revolvers? Why not disallow everything but single shot flintlock pistols?
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Old January 10, 2011, 08:28 PM   #3
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9-year-old girl who had recently been elected to the student council at her school and went to the event because she wanted to see how democracy worked.
This is not a democracy, its a republic.
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Old January 10, 2011, 08:28 PM   #4
sakeneko
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Don't give 'em ideas. :/

I doubt very much that many lives would be saved by banning semiautomatic pistols, or banning high-capacity magazines. As to whether it would be held constitutional or not.... I don't think that it *should* be, but it isn't my opinion that matters. It's the opinions of at least five Supreme Court justices that matter.
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Old January 10, 2011, 08:33 PM   #5
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I doubt very much that many lives would be saved by banning semiautomatic pistols, or banning high-capacity magazines.
We tried a ban on high-capacity magazines and military-pattern semiautomatic rifles a few years back. It wasn't proven to save anyone. In fact, violent crime had begun to decline prior to the ban, and it continued to do so after.

So, the "safety" argument is pretty much out of the running, and that's the last real argument the gun control crowd has to present to the courts. If they can't prove that a ban on high-capacity magazines serves a compelling government interest, and that it's the least restrictive way to achieve that interest, they're out of luck.

It might pass "intermediate" scrutiny, but the parameters of that are still a bit fuzzy. We could easily show that pistols with 15-round magazines are "weapons in common use" by both the military and law-enforcement.

Let McCarthy write her bill. I'll wager it'll die quickly in committee.
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Old January 10, 2011, 08:43 PM   #6
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Would the banning of semi automatic pistols be constitutional if revolvers were untouched?
I believe that Heller already stated, more or less, that it wouldn't be constitutional to ban semi autos as they are in common use.
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Old January 10, 2011, 08:50 PM   #7
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By banning hi or standard capacity mags and or weapons nothing will be accomplished. Criminals will still get guns, ammo, illegal mags, etc. and commit crime with them, look at what the ban on standard/high capacity mags, and assault weapons has done in California besides keep them out of law abiding citizens hands. ... not much.
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:22 PM   #8
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Yet another example of a bleeping idiot ruining it for hundreds of thousands of responsible gun owners-
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:29 PM   #9
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Gun laws do not work, because the only people who follow them are the good guys. Unless you passed a confiscation provision where all mags over X number of rounds had to be collected and destroyed or it would be say a felony then you will see no impact in the overall crime rate or even these type of events. I would remind everyone that one of the worst serial shooting incidents in American history , the "DC" sniper case, seldom were more than a handful of rounds fired in most cases 1 or 2.


I am crossing my fingers that if legislation is passed the limit is somewhere around 15-20 for pistols, would be annoying if their was a rush on 15 round .40S&W mags for my P-226 or if I could not get my new P-229E2 9MM with 15 round mags.
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:37 PM   #10
AC89
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If there gonna neuter the magazine limit there likely going to take after California and limit it to 10 rounds.
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:38 PM   #11
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Yet another example of a bleeping idiot ruining it for hundreds of thousands of responsible gun owners-
He hasn't ruined anything. Had the guy been more McVeigh than Hinckley, I might be more worried. But this isn't 1995, and things are different.

Back then, the news would be flooded with commentators, lobbyists, and politicians calling for new gun controls. Such measures might have stood a chance at passage.

From what I've seen, there have been very few calls for gun control in the wake of Saturday's shooting, and those have been from the same impotent, wizened minority that always tries (and fails) to capitalize on tragedies such as this. I don't see the mainstream media blaming guns. Mostly, they're blaming political rhetoric.

Even if a law were to be proposed in today's climate, it wouldn't stand a chance at being passed.
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:40 PM   #12
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I’d like to know what the author means by stating “a regular pistol, the kind most Americans think of when they think of the right to bear arms”.

Have they done a survey on “the kind most Americans think of”?

It seems like he is projecting his view of “a regular pistol” to “most Americans”.
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:48 PM   #13
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Standard Pistols? Take your pick suppose.
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:52 PM   #14
Patriot86
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The only thing "irregular" about this guys pistol was the 30 round mag. The Glock 19 is probably one of the more common handguns in America.
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Old January 10, 2011, 09:54 PM   #15
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Even if a law were to be proposed in today's climate, it wouldn't stand a chance at being passed.
I'm a little worried about new restrictions at the state level here in Arizona. Our state legislature would never do such a thing, but I'm afraid that some anti group will put a proposition on the ballot in 2012. That's a presidential election year when all this idiots come out to vote. New restrictions could very well pass that way, if they sound "sensible" enough.
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Old January 10, 2011, 10:18 PM   #16
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I see the father of the 9 year old told Fox news in an interview that he does not support any new restrictions on gun ownership as a response to this. He stated it was a random even that could happen anywhere.

That's very brave of him. This young lady will be used as the posterchild for gun control for some time to come - despite the views of her parents. I'm not sure I could thnik as clearly as he has following something like this.
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Old January 10, 2011, 10:24 PM   #17
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I see the father of the 9 year old told Fox news in an interview that he does not support any new restrictions on gun ownership as a response to this. He stated it was a random even that could happen anywhere.

That's very brave of him. This young lady will be used as the posterchild for gun control for some time to come - despite the views of her parents. I'm not sure I could thnik as clearly as he has following something like this.
It's a cardinal rule in politics that you never leave a crisis or tragedy go unexploited. It ain't about the victims, it's about the leverage they give you.
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Old January 10, 2011, 10:25 PM   #18
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Forgive my ignorance, but wouldn't any use of said child's name or photo need to be approved by the parents if it was to be used in a public manner?
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Old January 10, 2011, 10:28 PM   #19
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If it's used in an advertisement, I suspect that would be the case. But if it were casually bandied about by McCarthy and other knee-jerk reactionaries, to include the media, then no.
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Old January 10, 2011, 10:43 PM   #20
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How is a Glock not a regular pistol?

From the same article:
Quote:
Loughner’s gun, a 9-millimeter Glock, is extremely easy to fire over and over, and it can carry a 30-bullet clip. It is “not suited for hunting or personal protection,” said Paul Helmke, the president of the Brady Campaign.
Not suited for personal protection. Wow.
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Old January 10, 2011, 10:50 PM   #21
Wildalaska
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Sorry guys, but the issue here is not whether an AWB could pass, or even whether it would be effective (in a philosophical sense) but whether it would pass constitutional muster.

Can some one tell me how a mag capacity limit would violate Heller?


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Old January 10, 2011, 10:58 PM   #22
Al Norris
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Forget the mag question. It is not the question Ken asked.

Per Heller, the Glock 19 in particular is in common use. As are semi-auto handguns. They are "overwhelmingly chosen" by the people for self defense.

That's the answer.
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Old January 10, 2011, 11:00 PM   #23
ep2621
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Deleted by me...
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Old January 10, 2011, 11:04 PM   #24
Bernie Lomax
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I see the father of the 9 year old told Fox news in an interview that he does not support any new restrictions on gun ownership as a response to this.
This from an anti editorial in Business Week:

Quote:
Because of the N.R.A., calls for banning semi-automatic weapons have been made to sound extremist. I wonder how they sound to the parents of Christina Green, the 9-year-old girl curious enough about government to attend Giffords’ community event, where she was slain.
link

Gun grabbers are truly clueless. With enemies this dumb, you don't need any allies.
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Old January 10, 2011, 11:39 PM   #25
Wildalaska
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Forget the mag question. It is not the question Ken asked.

I protest! I did ask it

"How about Hi Cap magazines, would a ban on that pass strict scrutiny...how about intermediate scrutiny?"

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