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Old December 24, 2010, 12:31 PM   #1
Constantine
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"Take your gun to work" Florida

Correct me if I am wrong..But wasn't a law passed in July 1, 2008 in Florida that states it as a "take your gun to work" state? Where I was last employed a corporate building...They knew the laws and the head of security said

"We have a no illegal weapons policy here, however..We have to respect the State of Florida's law, and for those of you who have a concealed carry permit can only, and ONLY keep your weapon/firearm in your vehicles at all time, that means if it leaves the vehicle for any reason at any given time you are subject to the consequences that you will face. Florida passed this law to give the right to the people to abide if need be to the second amendment "right to bare arms" when in a commute to and from work, but it must stay in the vehicle while in our parking lot and our property"

He then moved on talking about other stuff....I felt happy there.



NOW, I just got a job at a hotel in Miami, Florida..These swines (during orientation) tried pulling off the whole "NO GUN NO GUNS! NO WEAPONS!"

I am positive that I am red flagged now because I argued with this man during orientation, that Florida State Laws are above your "rules and regulation" and Federal Laws are above both..That and I explained to him the proper and correct way to carry in your vehicle while at work so Americans who have their permit can take advantage of their (my, our) 2nd Amendment in our commute to and from work...



This man fought me to the end and turned red in the face, for the sake of keeping my job I respectfully told him.."I do not believe what you are saying, and I feel this 'rule' is in the policy so that people who do not know the real LAWS follow them as you all please. For the sake of this job and being searched for 'suspicion' I will follow this. But no ____ I do not believe you."




I felt completely naked and unprepared, going to the mall with my girlfriend after and doing regular everyday thing without my glock or 1911 in the equation and it sincerely felt extremely uncomfortable....So how do these people think they have the right to take my right away from me and not leave it in my car when I have the right to do so? So whatever I have to do after doesn't matter to them? I have to put myself on the line for this stupid job?


My point, anyone know anything about this and could help me out 100% is there something I'm missing?? He says there is no way around it he checked all "sources" and nothing I can do about it...I think it's completely stupid.
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Old December 24, 2010, 12:54 PM   #2
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I would call one of your state gun owner's organizations and see what the truth is. If not them, perhaps a lawyer who is familiar with your state's firearms laws. You definitely don't want to get this wrong.
If you wish to push the issue, I recommend you wait until your probationary peroid is complete
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Old December 24, 2010, 01:16 PM   #3
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Florida law currently states that your employer can not keep you from having a firearm in your car parked on their property, and can not take disciplinary action against you for doing so. In addition, there is no legal penalty for carrying your firearm on the job, but if your company finds out and doesn't like it, they can fire you.

You can research the laws yourself here.
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Old December 24, 2010, 01:32 PM   #4
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I remember a thread on here a while ago where a poster was asked by his employer to help write the employee handbook.

In the part about firearms he wrote "No illegal firearms are allowed on company property".

It is clever, because that means all legal firearms are allowed. The boss never knew the difference
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Old December 24, 2010, 02:21 PM   #5
Constantine
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Quote:
Florida law currently states that your employer can not keep you from having a firearm in your car parked on their property, and can not take disciplinary action against you for doing so. In addition, there is no legal penalty for carrying your firearm on the job, but if your company finds out and doesn't like it, they can fire you.

You can research the laws yourself here.

Six Rounds,

Please show me where it says this...I REALLY want to know for sure. This is kinda driving me insane.
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Old December 24, 2010, 03:15 PM   #6
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Hi,
I looked it up on the link Six_Rounds provided:

http://www.flsenate.gov/statutes/ind.../0790.251.html

790.251 (3)

Quote:
3)LEGISLATIVE INTENT; FINDINGS.—This act is intended to codify the long-standing legislative policy of the state that individual citizens have a constitutional right to keep and bear arms, that they have a constitutional right to possess and keep legally owned firearms within their motor vehicles for self-defense and other lawful purposes, and that these rights are not abrogated by virtue of a citizen becoming a customer, employee, or invitee of a business entity. It is the finding of the Legislature that a citizen’s lawful possession, transportation, and secure keeping of firearms and ammunition within his or her motor vehicle is essential to the exercise of the fundamental constitutional right to keep and bear arms and the constitutional right of self-defense. The Legislature finds that protecting and preserving these rights is essential to the exercise of freedom and individual responsibility. The Legislature further finds that no citizen can or should be required to waive or abrogate his or her right to possess and securely keep firearms and ammunition locked within his or her motor vehicle by virtue of becoming a customer, employee, or invitee of any employer or business establishment within the state, unless specifically required by state or federal law.
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Old December 24, 2010, 03:41 PM   #7
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In FL They can FIRE you without reason ; )
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Old December 24, 2010, 04:25 PM   #8
Bernie Lomax
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In addition, there is no legal penalty for carrying your firearm on the job, but if your company finds out and doesn't like it, they can fire you.
Are you sure about that? Here in Arizona, that's held to constitute trespass, even though it's not expressly prohibited by law.
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Old December 24, 2010, 05:02 PM   #9
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Florida law has some exceptions, such as businesses that store or handle explosives. Disney uses their fireworks as a means to ban guns on property under the explosives exception.

Unless the OP's hotel falls under that exception, or some other, then the person running the orientation was full of it.

And no, it would not be criminal trespass if it is not excluded under statute.
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Old December 24, 2010, 05:08 PM   #10
spacecoast
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These swines (during orientation) tried pulling off the whole "NO GUN NO GUNS! NO WEAPONS!"
What exactly does that mean? Did they forbid guns in parked cars as well as carried? Do you park in the hotel lot? Do they think their guests won't have guns in their cars as well, or carry them into the hotel with them as they are permitted to under law?

I wouldn't have argued about it, but I wouldn't hesitate to exercise my rights either. They have a right to ban you from carrying while working but not locked in your parked car.
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Old December 24, 2010, 05:15 PM   #11
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Quote:
Florida law currently states that your employer can not keep you from having a firearm in your car parked on their property, and can not take disciplinary action against you for doing so.
This law echo's Kentucky's law. Legally, my employer cannot prevent me from keeping a loaded handgun in my vehicle nor can they punish me if I do.

However, Kentucky is also an "at will" employment state so they could certainly find a way to remove me if they really wanted too.

Your best bet is to obey the laws and keep silent about your 2nd Amendment rights. In other words, leave your gun in your car and don't shoot off your mouth about it.
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Old December 24, 2010, 05:23 PM   #12
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Your best bet is to obey the laws and keep silent about your 2nd Amendment rights. In other words, leave your gun in your car and don't shoot off your mouth about it.
+1 this is exactly what i have to do, my work cant legally do anything but they could fire me if they want.
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Old December 24, 2010, 05:26 PM   #13
Bernie Lomax
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And no, it would not be criminal trespass if it is not excluded under statute.
Property as well as people can be trespassed off property. If you carry a gun in your employer's place of business, and he has forbidden such, and you are not protected by any of the provisions of the TYGTW law, then in most states, you have committed trespassing.
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Old December 24, 2010, 05:42 PM   #14
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Bernie, can you provide a link to the applicable Florida law stating such?

As far as I know, you aren't trespassing unless you have been given a verbal or written order not to go somewhere and you go there anyway. It doesn't make any sense that a gun can be trespassing, because it is not a person, and it cant be you who are trespassing because of the gun, because you are not prohibited from being there.

Your employer (in most cases) also has no right to search you or your property looking for weapons, so there is no way they would know you have a gun if you don't tell them.
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Old December 24, 2010, 05:51 PM   #15
Constantine
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I don't or haven't told them anything about having one.

And they said it can't even be in the car locked away, I'm not saying I want it on me, although that would be very very awesome...

I don't shoot off my mouth on anything, lol just don't like being lied to about something that's complete !&*@ which is what he was saying to me.

The link stating the statues of Florida seem pretty clear cut, I no nothing of fire works and definitely no explosives either. They just want to have a bunch of mindless drones working for them so that they feel safer or something, and this random HR woman had his back and stupidly said "what if you get mad at your manager? and go back into your car"

To which I stupidly said "anyone can get killed with this pen"
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Old December 24, 2010, 06:42 PM   #16
Bernie Lomax
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Quote:
Bernie, can you provide a link to the applicable Florida law stating such?
Sure:

Quote:
Whoever, without being authorized, licensed, or invited, willfully enters or remains in any structure or conveyance...commits the offense of trespass in a structure or conveyance.
link

If your workplace has given you reasonable notice that guns are not permitted, then you are not authorized to be in your workplace while carrying a gun. This means you have committed trespassing if you do so. What's more, if you read further in the link I posted, you'll see that trespassing while in possession of a firearm turns misdemeanor trespass into a felony.
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Old December 24, 2010, 10:18 PM   #17
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Bernie, this is superseded by the new statute. It was covered in some detail in the local news at the time. Employers cannot legally prohibit weapons in vehicles in most cases, so in most cases the law you cite is NOT applicable.

I lived in FL at the time. Most of us carried in our cars, and we verified what the new law meant.

Check the link to the new law, posted earlier in the thread.
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Old December 25, 2010, 01:36 AM   #18
Bernie Lomax
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Bernie, this is superseded by the new statute. It was covered in some detail in the local news at the time. Employers cannot legally prohibit weapons in vehicles in most cases, so in most cases the law you cite is NOT applicable.
I know that. We were discussing cases where the TYGTW law doesn't apply, like if you're carrying on your person.
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Old December 25, 2010, 04:44 AM   #19
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Merry Christmas. Why is it that everything comes in kit form and has to be put together Christmas Eve night?

I don't know if you realize what "at will" means, but my laymans understanding of the law of at will employment is that in a state where employment is "at will", like most southern states are, you can just be terminated from your job at any time for no reason whatsoever, UNLESS you have entered into a contract that specifically protects you from that. That means you may be protected if youare a member of a Union where they've negotiated that point so that you can't just be terminated without just cause. For example most federal employees can't just be terminated without just cause.

So regardless what Floridas law is regarding guns in your car, if the employer doesn't want guns on his premises and if Florida is an "at will" state, and you don't have a contract protecting you from it, your employer may just terminate you because he doesn't like the color of your eyes. You'd have a heck of a time proving he terminated you for having a gun in your car too. (of course, if you could prove that, you might have a case because even at will employment has a few tricky areas, and terminating someone for excercising a legal right, MAY be one of them. I don't know.

The only sensible solution is to keep your mouth shut and do whatever you decide to do. You may decide to run the risk of being terminated. Or not, But why in the world would you draw attention to yourself by arguing with your employer over it. You're practically asking them to terminate you. It doesn't make any sense to me.
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Old December 25, 2010, 09:07 AM   #20
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Bernie, I guess you were side-bar arguing with Six_Rounds, as the OP has been talking vehicle.
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Old December 25, 2010, 08:15 PM   #21
Constantine
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Hello, and Merry Christmas..

Yes yes, I was talking about in the vehicle and that was a sidebar conversation. I would not carry it on me during work at a job that's not meant to be.


So I guess, I'm getting a 50/50 on being okay to leave it in the car and another hand is saying I'm totally screwed if I do. Especially since I'm probably being watched now about it.

Also, no...I did not stupidly dig my own grave I had made a very incorrect assumption that I could have an actualy agreement with this "fellow NRA Member" that's what he said lol...Failure. Well...I guess he was right then. Or maybe he isn't..Looks like a hit or miss to me. They MAY just be that one place where I really cannot even have it in my car. I didn't know that even existed to be honest. Total bullcrap.

Also what I have in mind, would they really search my car? Randomly? Cause they have a hunch..well more than that..That I do carry? Can they? Will they? Could they?
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Old December 25, 2010, 08:24 PM   #22
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Quote:
Also what I have in mind, would they really search my car? Randomly? Cause they have a hunch..well more than that..That I do carry? Can they? Will they? Could they?
If I remember correctly no, they cannot enter or search your car without your consent, even police need a search warrant unless they (police officer, not the property owner) see something obviously illegal in your car as bag of dope or something like that.
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Old December 25, 2010, 08:28 PM   #23
Constantine
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So, the probably cause thing isn't so black and white? Or how does that work? It's kind of a pain to keep thinking about that. I mean, I highly doubt they forgot about that heavy toned converstaion/debate already. Don't want them to build up a case on me or something. That's the only time I've ever mentioned a firearm in anyway.
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Old December 25, 2010, 08:37 PM   #24
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The probable cause apply to criminal (or possible criminal) activity. You are not breaking law by having your legally owned firearm in your vehicle in Florida.
If you really want to get on the bottom of this situation I suggest to consult a lawyer but if I'd be you I'd just do what I and most of my colleagues do - keep it in car, out of sight and shut up about it...
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Old December 25, 2010, 10:04 PM   #25
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If I remember correctly no, they cannot enter or search your car without your consent, even police need a search warrant unless they (police officer, not the property owner) see something obviously illegal in your car as bag of dope or something like that.
True, but you can be terminated for non-compliance.

In many states you do not have the state's grace to carry in your vehicle on company property. I warn all my new hires to park off property or be subject to a possible search or resign situation. I actually had to make good on that promise once, much to my dislike. No weapons were found, but a bag of pot was. I do hope TX will enhance their 2A rights in the future by extending personal rights into parking lots.
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