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Old September 11, 2014, 02:15 PM   #1
motorhead0922
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Missouri overrides veto; gun rights expanded

From an email I got today:

-----


Missouri Firearms Law changes - Important information

Last night the Missouri Legislators overrode Gov. Nixon's veto of Senate Bill 656. Takes effect in 30 days.

This will result in important changes to the Missouri Firearms laws and represents a huge victory for freedom loving Missourians.


A few important changes in the law include:

1. Open Carry with your valid Concealed Carry permit is now legal throughout the State of Missouri.

2. The legal Concealed Carry age has been lowered to 19.

3. The live-fire of the Concealed Carry permit test will now only have to be done with EITHER a revolver OR semi-auto, but not both as in the past.

4. School will be able to designate one or more teachers or administrators as School Protection Officers.

5. Licensed Healthcare Professionals may not be required by law to ask patients about firearms ownership.

6. Prohibits housing authorities from barring a lessee or household members from possessing a firearm.

The full summary of the bill can be found here: http://www.thegunshowradio.com/gun-f...by-legislators

-----
I'm interested to see how the open carry expansion plays out. And I hope 19 and 20 year old females in particular choose to carry for protection.
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Last edited by motorhead0922; September 11, 2014 at 02:25 PM.
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Old September 11, 2014, 03:40 PM   #2
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Nice.

Good for Missouri.
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Old September 11, 2014, 04:29 PM   #3
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Yes, very nice indeed. It's good to see some positive legislation!
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Old September 11, 2014, 08:28 PM   #4
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that sounds like a great victory, love the healthcare and housing authority. Even here in GA the CC age is 21 which I find heinous, if your old enough to work, enlist, pay taxes, vote and live on your own, why is CC not important for those particular people.
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Old September 11, 2014, 09:36 PM   #5
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WELL DONE!
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Old September 11, 2014, 10:09 PM   #6
Tom Servo
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Quote:
The legal Concealed Carry age has been lowered to 19.
I'm curious as to the age of 19. Why not 18?
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Old September 11, 2014, 10:38 PM   #7
skizzums
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I can't b certain why they chose 19, but it could have to with kids with early birthdays still being in high school at 18, who knows
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Old September 12, 2014, 08:14 AM   #8
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I especially like number 5
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Old September 12, 2014, 10:56 AM   #9
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Good on Mo
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Old September 12, 2014, 12:50 PM   #10
Brian Pfleuger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skizzums
Even here in GA the CC age is 21 which I find heinous, if your old enough to work, enlist, pay taxes, vote and live on your own,

.... join the military and be sent to kill and be killed for your country. Heck... you could literally be a Navy SEAL and not be allowed to CC when you're home.
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Old September 12, 2014, 01:01 PM   #11
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Quote:
Even here in GA the CC age is 21 which I find heinous, if your old enough to work, enlist, pay taxes, vote and live on your own,
Quote:
.... join the military and be sent to kill and be killed for your country. Heck... you could literally be a Navy SEAL and not be allowed to CC when you're home.
Actually I believe recent legislation in Georgia now allows members of the military to obtain a Weapons License at 18.

http://www.nraila.org/news-issues/ne...-governor.aspx
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Old September 12, 2014, 02:43 PM   #12
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Quote:
2. The legal Concealed Carry age has been lowered to 19.
I have heard claims that this would void our CCW reciprocity with many other states. Does anybody have any facts about this?
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Old September 12, 2014, 04:24 PM   #13
skizzums
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yes in GA, active duty can get CC at any age. well 18 anyways, but I am not sure if that qualifies them to buy a pistol, since you can't here until you are 21
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Old September 12, 2014, 05:49 PM   #14
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I have not read all the law yet, but in Missouri the age to purchase a handgun is 21 years of age.
I assume now that will change.

As for reciprocity I'm sure it will change in some states, there's already several states that did, but no longer honor a Missouri CCW.

A big thank you is in order to the elected officials that kicked out Nixsons veto.

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Old September 12, 2014, 07:12 PM   #15
Cheapshooter
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Quote:
A big thank you is in order to the elected officials that kicked out Nixsons veto
But why, if we lose reciprocity in more states. That one part seems to be a real poison pill. I'm sure that wasn't the reason for Nixon's veto. I think if this causes Missourians to lose their right to carry in other states it was a big mistake. It would have been better to bring a bill back next session with just the good parts. What sense does it make to allow concealed cary for someone that can't leagally buy a concealed carry firearm?
I just hope the legislators that did this are smarter than me about the loss of reciprocity, and have worked out a solution.
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Old September 12, 2014, 10:12 PM   #16
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I could be wrong, but I don't anticipate much, if any, loss of reciprocity. Other than Illinois (which doesn't honor any states) the states that don't honor Missouri licenses now are all on the east and west coasts. No surprise there.

Really? You would force law-abiding young people to continue to be unable to defend themselves from a deadly attack because you might not be able to carry in a state hundreds or a thousand miles away?

People in those other states need to fix their laws. Missouri, like most of the country, is getting better all the time.
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Old September 12, 2014, 10:19 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheapshooter
What sense does it make to allow concealed cary for someone that can't leagally buy a concealed carry firearm?
I am not conversant with Missouri state laws, but the applicable federal law is that persons under 21 cannot purchase a handgun from an FFL. Anyone over 18 can purchase a handgun from a private seller (if not prohibited by state law) or receive a handgun as a gift (again, if not prohibited by state law).

The mere fact that one cannot "purchase" a handgun does not automatically mean that one cannot legally possess a handgun.
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Old September 12, 2014, 10:32 PM   #18
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What I am trying to find out is what states, if any, will Missouri CCW holders lose reciprocity. Is it worth the statis quo for a small number of people under the age of 21 in order to keep the right of others to carry in Arkansas, Oklahoma, Kansas, Nebraska, Iowa, , Kentucky, and Tennessee. States thatare notthousands, or even hundreds of miles away?
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Old September 12, 2014, 11:06 PM   #19
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Bravo Missouri!
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Old September 13, 2014, 07:20 AM   #20
motorhead0922
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Quote:
What I am trying to find out is what states, if any, will Missouri CCW holders lose reciprocity.
Here's my opinion on our bordering states. All of the states you mentioned honor Maine permits, where Maine residents can carry at age 18. Oklahoma even honors Vermont's no-permit situation, where residents can carry at age 18. I suspect OK only lets VT resident carry if they are 21.

A similar conversation is going on at missouricarry. http://www.missouricarry.com/forums/...t=71214&page=2
where this was posted:
Quote:
Originally Posted by from missouricarry.com
States that have concerns about the “young guns” have already preempted that “problem” by not recognizing permits held by those less than 21.
Would you like to guess how many Maine permit holders reside in Missouri under the age of 21?

Nebraska recognizes the Maine permit but only if held by an individual 21 or older. Having a Missouri permit doesn’t alter the 21 years old requirement that Nebraska already has in place.

Arizona recognizes all permits but only if held by someone 21 or older.

Iowa is like Arizona.

For those with the “loss of reciprocity” mindset, I suggest that you check the Chicken Little mindset at the door.
My opinion is that states that make a change will just require MO residents to be the same age as that state's minimum.
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Old September 13, 2014, 08:35 AM   #21
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Thank you, that clears up my questions with the answers I was looking for. The concern over the loss of reciprocity was brought up by a gun store owner who, along with his wife, hosts a frrearms radio talk show in St. Louis. I was really looking for the facts because in the past this fellow has been the most anti-second amendment, supposed "supporter" of gun rights I have heard. It seems his idea of second amendment rights only go as far as what he can turn a profit on.
In addition to the states that were mentioned, I looked at reciprocity in Mississippi, Alabama, Georga, and Florida. States that I travel to, or through. I did not see anything in their laws about reciprocity with states that have CCW age under 21. So it seems that as I hoped the legislators that overrode Nixon's veto are smarter than me, and a lot smarter than the Schmoe on the Radio!
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Old September 13, 2014, 09:11 AM   #22
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Reciprocity is a minor concern in the grand scheme. Meaningless to the vast majority. Sucks if you're one that it matters to but sometimes we have to take the best we can get.
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Old September 13, 2014, 09:17 AM   #23
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The real problem with all reciprocity issues is that there are reciprocity issues. What needs to be addressed is the fundamental problem that (a) states require permits for the exercise of what is supposed to be a guaranteed "right" at all; and (b) states don't automatically and universally accept any and all permits/licenses issued by other states. To me this seems to be a blatant contravention of the "full faith and credit" provision in the Constitution.
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Old September 13, 2014, 11:55 AM   #24
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Quote:
The real problem with all reciprocity issues is that there are reciprocity issues. What needs to be addressed is the fundamental problem that (a) states require permits for the exercise of what is supposed to be a guaranteed "right" at all; and (b) states don't automatically and universally accept any and all permits/licenses issued by other states. To me this seems to be a blatant contravention of the "full faith and credit" provision in the Constitution.
My thoughts exactly.

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Old September 16, 2014, 12:15 PM   #25
motorhead0922
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Looking through the text of the bill, I noticed this:
Quote:
The concealed
9 carry permit is valid throughout this state. Although the permit is
10 considered valid in the state, a person who fails to renew his or her
11 permit within five years from the date of issuance or renewal shall not
12 be eligible for an exception to a National Instant Criminal Background
13 Check under federal regulations currently codified under 27 CFR
14 478.102(d) relating to the transfer, sale, or delivery of firearms from
15 licensed dealers.
Whoa! This looks like Missourians with a CCW permit don't have to go through a NICS check:
Quote:
(d) Exceptions to NICS check. The provisions of paragraph (a) of this section shall not apply if—
(1) The transferee has presented to the licensee a valid permit or license that—
(i) Allows the transferee to possess, acquire, or carry a firearm;
(ii) Was issued not more than 5 years earlier by the State in which the transfer is to take place; and
(iii) The law of the State provides that such a permit or license is to be issued only after an authorized government official has verified that the information available to such official does not indicate that possession of a firearm by the transferee would be in violation of Federal, State, or local law: Provided, That on and after November 30, 1998, the information available to such official includes the NICS;
Am I wrong?
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