The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Skunkworks > Handloading, Reloading, and Bullet Casting

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old September 18, 2010, 09:48 AM   #1
demigod
Junior member
 
Join Date: March 13, 2008
Location: AZ
Posts: 1,129
Is this a problem???

30-30 winchester brass..

I found this empty where I shoot. What do you think happened?

demigod is offline  
Old September 18, 2010, 09:55 AM   #2
birdshot
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 17, 2008
Location: north platte nebraska
Posts: 305
7.62x54

my guess is shot from 7.62x54 chamber. i am impressed with the brass in that the web did not expand. what brand is that?
birdshot is offline  
Old September 18, 2010, 12:45 PM   #3
FrankenMauser
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 25, 2008
Location: 1B ID
Posts: 6,798
Quote:
what brand is that?
The photo shows a Winchester head stamp.



It may have been fired in a .30-40 Krag.
__________________
"Such is the strange way that man works -- first he virtually destroys a species and then does everything in his power to restore it."
FrankenMauser is offline  
Old September 18, 2010, 03:34 PM   #4
Unclenick
Staff
 
Join Date: March 4, 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,254
I suspect that's a pretty good guess. The shoulder is blown forward just about the right amount for that. The .30-30 rim would have been a little loose in the Krag chamber, which is wider at the rear, of course, but it wouldn't have fallen in.

I was shooting on the 100 yard range a few benches down from a hunter zeroing a borrowed rifle at the adjacent 50 yard range one year. He came over and handed me a case with no shoulder at all. Just a little inward bending near the mouth. He asked if that was normal? He'd borrowed this .308 from a cousin, IIRC, and picked up the ammo at Wally World, then headed for the range. I had the pleasure of introducing him to barrel stampings. The rifle he had read ".30-06".

If you're curious, he actually did hit the paper in the corner at about 50 yards. The case headspaced on the extractor, of course. The bullet was long enough to get into the neck and part way into the throat. It certainly lent credence to Hatcher's contention that excess headspace doesn't normally cause head separation in a brand new case. Once the extractor stops the head going further forward, the shoulder just blows out to use up the extra room, same as in forming an Ackley Improved case.
__________________
Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member
CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor
NRA Certified Rifle Instructor
NRA Benefactor Member

Last edited by Unclenick; September 18, 2010 at 03:44 PM.
Unclenick is offline  
Old September 18, 2010, 05:49 PM   #5
FrankenMauser
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 25, 2008
Location: 1B ID
Posts: 6,798
Quote:
He'd borrowed this .308 from a cousin, IIRC, and picked up the ammo at Wally World, then headed for the range. I had the pleasure of introducing him to barrel stampings. The rifle he had read ".30-06".
Yep... I had to keep a really close eye on my ammunition on this year's antelope hunt. I had my .270 Win and .30-06, and my .30-40 Krag and 7.62x54R.

The ammunition for the .270 and 06 even had similar bullets, so the head stamp was the only definitive way of knowing. (The old "I can tell the difference by bullet diameter" argument, that gets presented here periodically was, of course, no help. I thought I could tell the difference, too. I was wrong. I had to sort by head stamp, and keep everything segregated.)

The Krag ammo won't chamber in my 7.62x54R chamber, and the 7.62x54R wont chamber in my Krag. They will, however, lock the action up like it was welded shut. (The rim on the 7.62x54R jams in the Krag's action, and the Krag's shoulder likes to wedge itself in the x54's chamber before the extractor slips off the rim.) That's not exactly something I wanted to contend with while trying to put a follow up shot into a wounded antelope.

The .30-40 and 7.62x54R cartridges are very easily distinguished, when compared side by side. Reaching into a pocket, for a quick reload, is a different story. I did a test run, to see if grabbing a few cartridges, with a 7.62x54R mixed into the Krag ammo, would allow me to tell the difference. I did notice the x54, after some cartridge juggling in my hand, but never would have caught it during a quick in-field reload (until it was jammed in the magazine or action).

In the end, I kept one type of ammunition on me at a time (even when I carried both the '06 and Krag for stalk-in-and-wait ambush at a water hole -- both rifles had a full magazine, but my pocket had only '06 ammo in it).


When I'm at the range (actually, the middle of the desert), I usually only have one type of easily-confused ammunition open at a time. I even try to keep the .380 Auto put away, while the 9mm is out. It's not me, that I'm usually worried about, but the wife, kids, and any other guests that may have come along.
__________________
"Such is the strange way that man works -- first he virtually destroys a species and then does everything in his power to restore it."
FrankenMauser is offline  
Old September 18, 2010, 07:08 PM   #6
demigod
Junior member
 
Join Date: March 13, 2008
Location: AZ
Posts: 1,129
Definitely fire in the wrong chamber eh? I agree from where the new shoulder is positioned.
demigod is offline  
Old September 18, 2010, 08:25 PM   #7
kraigwy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 16, 2008
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 9,444
It's easy to do, you got to be careful and really watch your shooters.

I was running a sniper school for the NG and Reg Army. The NG still were using M1C/Ds and the Reg Army students were using M-21.

I have cased of M-72 (for the garands) and M-118 for the M-21s. Both White Box. No problem from the M-21 guys because they couldn't chamber the M-118, not so with the Guard guys. But the extractor held the cases so the spent brass just ended up with no necks.

To eliminate the problem I had to have my armor issue the ammo as needed instead of allowing the students to pick up their own.
__________________
Kraig Stuart
CPT USAR Ret
USAMU Sniper School Oct '78
Distinguished Rifle Badge 1071
kraigwy is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:13 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.06947 seconds with 7 queries