The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Conference Center > Law and Civil Rights

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old September 5, 2010, 08:05 PM   #26
s000
Junior Member
 
Join Date: September 5, 2010
Posts: 1
A SCOTUS decision really doesn't mean anything anymore. The moment they get a couple leftist justices in they start rewriting all of the books. :barf:
s000 is offline  
Old September 5, 2010, 08:24 PM   #27
csmsss
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 24, 2008
Location: Orange, TX
Posts: 2,986
I don't see it as a left-right issue of contention, rather one of a statist vs. individualist perspective. There are left-leaning folks who strongly support the 2nd Amendment, and there are right-leaning folks who are all-too-friendly to those who would strip it bare.

All that said, it certainly seems to me that should the Heller/MacDonald majority evaporate, the SCOTUS is far more likely to take a "back door" approach to repeal of the 2nd by using the discretion afforded via Heller for the local/state regulation of firearms and firearms transactions. There would be little need to directly reverse Heller - instead, you just kick out the legs from underneath it and render it meaningless.
csmsss is offline  
Old September 5, 2010, 08:38 PM   #28
Glenn E. Meyer
Staff
 
Join Date: November 17, 2000
Posts: 15,799
Usually precedents that have been overturned have expanded rights. The support of segregation was overturned. Laws that attempted to regulate the sexual behavior of adults were overturned.

So overturning Heller or McD would be an interesting reversal to limit an expansion or strengthening of rights.

Does that play into thinking about reversal? I don't know.
__________________
NRA, TSRA, IDPA, NTI, Polite Soc.
http://www.teddytactical.com/archive...05_Feature.htm
Being an Academic Shooter
http://www.teddytactical.com/archive...11_Feature.htm
Being an Active Shooter
Glenn E. Meyer is offline  
Old September 5, 2010, 08:49 PM   #29
Tom Servo
Staff
 
Join Date: September 27, 2008
Location: Foothills of the Appalachians
Posts: 10,524
Quote:
1986-Bowers vs. Hardwick, SCOTUS rules 5-4 that states have the right to outlaw private homosexual acts. 2003-Lawrence vs. Texas-SCOTUS rules homosexuality is a constitutionally protected freedom.
You've got a point there. I've heard the change in judicial philosophy on the matter between 1986 and 2003 had something to do with changing attitudes in the mind of the general public. Then again, I haven't read all the amicus briefs from both cases. It could very well be that one of them advanced novel new arguments in the second case that weren't presented in the first.

There are times the Court needs to change its stance. The Citizens United case was one example. Even then, however, Justice Roberts made it quite clear that reversing precedent was a matter to be taken very seriously. After all, if the Court reverses precedent too quickly and easily, then what credibility do those precedents have in the first place?

What's ironic is that in Lawrence v. Texas, Justice Stevens wrote that the Court had read the right to privacy too narrowly in Bowers. This is the same guy who wants the 2nd Amendment narrowed to nearly nothing.

...which brings us to Bartholomew's point. We still haven't built the case law. We need to establish a strict standard while the iron's hot, and we need to know the whole topography of the right in question before the idealogical balance changes.

Quote:
SCOTUS is far more likely to take a "back door" approach to repeal of the 2nd by using the discretion afforded via Heller for the local/state regulation of firearms and firearms transactions
That's what worries me. One of the worrying parts of Scalia's opinion in Heller was this bit:
Quote:
(...) nothing in our opinion should be taken to cast doubt on (...) laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms. (p. 54)
We're seeing it in Chicago and Washington DC right now. A municipality could simply outlaw the sale of arms, and we've got a de facto ban. Heck, you could even skip the legislative process and do the same thing through zoning regulations.

We've still got work to do, and a limited window in which to do it.
__________________
Sometimes it’s nice not to destroy the world for a change.
--Randall Munroe
Tom Servo is offline  
Old September 5, 2010, 10:36 PM   #30
SIGSHR
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 13, 2005
Posts: 3,130
In the case of Bowers vs. Hardwick being reversed in Lawrence vs. Texas, changing public attitudes had nothing to do with it. After the 2004 election the Wall Street Journal had an excellent editorial "The Blue State Court", noting how 11 states had public questions on their ballots regarding prohibiting
same sex marriage and affirming the traditional definition, in all 11 states- both Red and Blue- the voters approved consitutional amendments so doing. Rather too much of the work of the SCOTUS is actually done by the law clerks who are drawn too heavily from the elite law schools where homosexuals are over represented and have more clout. The liberals honked and whined and worked to reverse Bowers before the ink was dry on the opinion.
SIGSHR is offline  
Old September 6, 2010, 02:54 PM   #31
Glenn E. Meyer
Staff
 
Join Date: November 17, 2000
Posts: 15,799
Done - we are wandering into Let's rave about sexual orientation.

We will pass.

Closed.
__________________
NRA, TSRA, IDPA, NTI, Polite Soc.
http://www.teddytactical.com/archive...05_Feature.htm
Being an Academic Shooter
http://www.teddytactical.com/archive...11_Feature.htm
Being an Active Shooter
Glenn E. Meyer is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:43 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.06976 seconds with 7 queries