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Old July 25, 2010, 01:34 PM   #1
ScottRiqui
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Picture of .40 S&W rounds that wouldn't feed - opinions?

These were from the first batch I've made up using Missouri Bullet's 170 gr .401 bullets. Out of about 100, these were the only two that wouldn't feed. Something appears to have dinged up the case mouths during the feeding attempts. I used Lee dies, including the Factory Crimp Die. There's a step in the bullet profile right where the case ends that probably doesn't help, but I quite probably need to do something differently as well - perhaps a little more crimp?

The gun is a Springfield EMP that doesn't have a history of feeding problems, including a lot of my reloads using other bullets.

Thanks,
Scott



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Old July 25, 2010, 01:36 PM   #2
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looks to me like you have them seated too deep... and idea what the overall length is?
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Old July 25, 2010, 01:57 PM   #3
ScottRiqui
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The OAL I was aiming for was 1.10", and both of those measure between 1.095" and 1.10".

Here's a picture of the bullets from MBC's site, just to give you an idea of the bullet profile. When seated to 1.10" OAL, the shoulder on the bullet coincides almost perfectly with the case mouth opening.

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Old July 25, 2010, 02:04 PM   #4
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I've had the same problem. My Ruger PC-40 will not feed SWC bullets. Oddly enough, my hi-point 4095 will. I switched to a TC shaped bullet and the problem disappeared.
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Old July 25, 2010, 02:09 PM   #5
DiscoRacing
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You might want to try a few a little longer... I had a problem feeding once awhile back...with swc bullets...and now I load mine at an OAL of 1.115
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Old July 25, 2010, 02:19 PM   #6
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Thanks for the replies. I'll try up another large batch with the same measurements and see if I have the problem. These two FTFs happened when a first-time shooter was using the gun, and neither one was the first round in the magazine, so I can't swear that her grip didn't play a factor. If I don't have any problems, I guess I'll keep it the same, but if I do have any problems, I'll start off with a slightly-longer OAL and go from there.

Do you have any idea what part of the pistol would have snagged the case mouth to make those marks? I looked at the ramp and chamber and didn't see anything amiss.
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Old July 25, 2010, 02:21 PM   #7
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I know that if my girl limp wrists it .. mine will jam once in awhile... dont remember where the case catches tho..
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Old July 25, 2010, 03:04 PM   #8
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Scott,

I don't own a .40, but I can tell you the standard practice in .45 ACP with that bullet shape has been, since the 60's, if not earlier, to have the bullet shoulder stick out about 0.020" from the case mouth. This is unless you headspace on the bullet (bullet touching the throat when casehead is even with the back of the barrel). In that case it can be out even more.

I'm not sure what the case mouth caught on? That's obviously not supposed to happen.
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Old July 25, 2010, 03:08 PM   #9
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I'm pretty sure the .40 is designed to headspace on the case mouth, but if I have any problems the next time I shoot these loads, I'll certainly try a slightly longer overall length so that the bullet shoulder isn't flush with the case mouth.

There's also the slight possibility that there may have been imperfections in the case mouth openings on these two cases before I even loaded the rounds - just enough to catch on something. I'm pretty good about inspecting my brass, but I'll pay extra attention next time.
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Old July 25, 2010, 03:10 PM   #10
DiscoRacing
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Quote:
I'm pretty sure the .40 is designed to headspace on the case mouth
I disagree Scott.... thats what I did when I first started loading them, and had problems feeding
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Old July 25, 2010, 03:26 PM   #11
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Well, headspacing and feeding are two different things. Just because a cartridge is designed to headspace on the case mouth (as I just checked that the .40 S&W is), that doesn't mean that every gun chambered in that cartridge will reliably feed empty cases (to use an extreme example).

I think what's happened in my case (possibly in conjunction with limp-wristing) is that the abrupt step in case/bullet profile caused by the bullet shoulder coinciding with the case mouth caused the case mouth to catch on something before entering the chamber. Moving the shoulder out a few thousandths may solve everything.
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Old July 25, 2010, 08:15 PM   #12
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You're not belling the case enough. The seating die is pulling the case when you seat the bullet. Reset the dies and try again. You're only off a little.
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Old July 25, 2010, 08:20 PM   #13
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I don't think a lack of flare is the problem, because I would have expected to have been shaving lead from the bullets during seating if that were the case.

I may not have been clear in my original post, but the damage in the picture didn't happen during the reloading process - it happened during the bullets' (failed) trip from the magazine into the chamber.
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Old July 25, 2010, 09:42 PM   #14
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.40 reloads

When I first saw them, my thought was that they had been pushed into the case, meaning the sizing and crimp weren't sufficient.
They are way deeper than they need to be. You want the side of the SWC to contact the feedramp at the same location as a RN-FMJ. Yours are about 0.10" too deep.
I use 1.190-1.200 OAL with my 170-175gn L-SWC. The shortest I have seen referenced was 1.130.
The dings could by at the feed ramp to barrel interface (assuming it is not an integral feedramp barrel) or you left the cases without sufficient taper crimp.
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Old July 25, 2010, 09:52 PM   #15
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I agree with too short. I don't load SWC in .40, but I did a ton of it in .45 and had feeding problems until I started seating the bullet out about .1 or so more than what you have pictured, so that the bullet would hit the feed ramp rather than the case.
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