The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Skunkworks > Handloading, Reloading, and Bullet Casting

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old May 17, 2010, 11:04 PM   #1
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
.223 hard extracting problem

Hi, this is my first attempt on reloading .223. I have reloaded all my other rifles but never had this problem. I resized everything and wanted to test a few rounds in my Ar15 before I get too far. So I put them in the magazine and they chamber good but when I pulled the charging handle back to test how all (unfired) rounds worked. It's hard to pull back the charging handle. MY rounds are the same length as the factory ones and I tried them and they work fine. I have a crimp on the rounds. Any ideas thx robert
rude robert is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 02:32 AM   #2
steve4102
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 23, 2005
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 2,217
As stated in your other thread. Adjust your sizing die to bump the shoulder back, it most likely is not set deep enough.
steve4102 is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 08:13 AM   #3
HJ857
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 9, 2007
Location: haslett, mi
Posts: 349
I have one AR upper that has the same issue you describe. Rounds that fit in my other uppers will jam in that upper.

It is a sizing issue but not likely a shoulder bump problem. It is more likely that the case is not size enough at the base.

I use a Hornady headspace gauge.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct...tNumber=479704

This gauge measures how much you've set the shoulders back (photo 2255a).

This is helpful but you it will not show you a sizing error at the base. To diagnose that problem you need a different gauge.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct...tNumber=456614

Photo 2257a shows a really bad case, the worst I've ever seen. The case should insert and be flush with the gauge.

Any round that extends above the top of the gauge will almost invariably jam in the chamber as the bolt slams it home.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg _HJS2255a.jpg (115.3 KB, 38 views)
File Type: jpg _HJS2257a.jpg (129.6 KB, 40 views)
HJ857 is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 08:49 AM   #4
wncchester
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 1, 2002
Posts: 2,832
"It is more likely that the case is not size enough at the base."

Yep. Sounds like it's time for a Small Base size die.
wncchester is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 10:17 AM   #5
Lavid2002
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 6, 2007
Posts: 2,568
I went through this problem for MONTHS....literally.....Hundreds of rounds. A small base die will fix this.

-Dave
__________________
Math>Grammar
Lavid2002 is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 01:53 PM   #6
Dave R
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 7, 2000
Location: Idaho
Posts: 6,073
Double check your sizer die is adjusted properly, too.

I went through some of the same headaches, and thought I needed small based dies, until I remembered that I had my sizer adjusted to neck-size only for my boltgun.

Once I adjusted the die so it contacted the shellholder and "cammed over," all my troubles ended. I have not bought a small base die.

Of course, I may be the only one stupid enough to do this.
__________________
I am Pro-Rights (on gun issues).
Dave R is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 03:39 PM   #7
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
Something is wrong with my internet lol. Thx guys for the information I will have to order a small base die for the .223 thx
rude robert is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 06:49 PM   #8
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
Hi I just ordered sb dies and took my .223 dies back to the store that I bought them from and they gave me my money cool. Since, I have the cases basically resized and I just empty the powder and resize it with the sb dies, with the primers still in it? I hate to throw new primers away and or damage them if I punch them out thx robert
rude robert is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 07:37 PM   #9
howlnmad
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 29, 2009
Location: Harriman Tn
Posts: 413
de-capping primers

No need to push the primers out. If you bought the RCBS dies, just remove the de-capping pin and size away.

howlnmad
howlnmad is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 07:50 PM   #10
Lavid2002
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 6, 2007
Posts: 2,568
I dont know how well that will work, as the decapper has several jobs

On the UP stroke
*Expand the case mouth
*Decap the primer

On the down stroke
*Expand the case mouth(Since the die squashes it back in


If I were you I would just set the decapping pin so it still goes into the casing and does its expanding stages, but it isnt deep enough to pop out the primer.

-Dave
__________________
Math>Grammar
Lavid2002 is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 09:16 PM   #11
Unclenick
Staff
 
Join Date: March 4, 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 10,327
It depends whose dies they are? If he got one whose decapper stem holds replaceable decapping pins, he can take just the pin out.
__________________
Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member
CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor
NRA Certified Rifle Instructor
NRA Benefactor Member
Unclenick is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 09:21 PM   #12
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
Hi the dies are the small base .223 from rcbs. thx robert
rude robert is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 09:41 PM   #13
Jim243
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 5, 2009
Location: Just off Route 66
Posts: 4,575
Robert

Not sure how your going to seat the bullets, since you took your dies back?

Instead of wasting a lot of money, MAKE A DUMMY (no primer or powder) ROUND!!!!!! And smoke the case and bullet with a candle. Where the smoke rubs off is where you are having the problem. Only takes one case and bullet.

Had the same problem on a new Bushmaster Varminter any time I set the OAL to anything over 2.200. Using Hornady bullets seems to be a little too wide for the throat of my chamber. No problem with Winchester or Remington factory ammo or Sierra bullets.

Find out what's wrong before you try to fix it.

Jim
Jim243 is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 10:11 PM   #14
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
The cablela's web site shows the small base dies with 2 different dies. one that sizes and the other one looks like it seats the bullets. Am i wrong on this yikes
rude robert is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 10:14 PM   #15
Volucris
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 30, 2009
Posts: 293
Sounds just like you're not seating the bullet correctly and the bullet is being pushed into the lands upon chambering. You're essentially pulling the bullet out of the barrel grooves and not just the chamber. Check your OAL and adjust your seater accordingly.

OR you're not resizing the brass properly and need to adjust your resizing die. A small base die is an unnecessary "fix" proposed by people who haven't figured out how to adjust their sizing dies properly. There is no need for a small base sizing die for commercial AR15s. They generally have rather loose chambers and FL sizing works 100% if done right.
__________________
"From my cold, dead hands!" - Charlton Heston
Volucris is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 10:24 PM   #16
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
Actually, I thought maybe the bullet was doing just that, but I made a dummy round and seated the bullet way low and still had the problem. Cases are trimmed to hornaday's case length so there is no problem there. I made my rounds to factory length and the again the dummy round was way less then that so the only other option would be to try the small base. If I had known that there were two sizes for the .223 I would have just bought them. It looks like this problem comes up on some Ar's so we will see. thx
rude robert is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 10:24 PM   #17
howlnmad
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 29, 2009
Location: Harriman Tn
Posts: 413
de-capping pins

Unclenick,
Thanks for the back-up. I thought putting the expander ball back on would be obvious.

howlnmad
howlnmad is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 10:30 PM   #18
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
You never know for sure what people will do lol
rude robert is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 10:54 PM   #19
Jim243
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 5, 2009
Location: Just off Route 66
Posts: 4,575
Can't tell if the second die is the seater. Good price, paid $45 plus shipping for my RCBS X-Small Base Die (1 only). Where on your dummy are you getting rubbing (scratches)?
Jim243 is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 11:04 PM   #20
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
scratches no. On the dies It comes with 2 and they look like the full length size dies
rude robert is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 11:06 PM   #21
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
I might in time try the x die but not now. My wife says I spent too much money lol. now I have like 3 hundred bullets waiting to be loaded
rude robert is offline  
Old May 18, 2010, 11:36 PM   #22
Jim243
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 5, 2009
Location: Just off Route 66
Posts: 4,575
Been there, good luck on the wife thing, mine still thinks I'm spending too much eventhough she keeps telling to go out and shoot. She has no concept of component costs. (LOL)
Jim243 is offline  
Old May 26, 2010, 01:06 AM   #23
rude robert
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2009
Posts: 110
The small dies worked yippy lol
rude robert is offline  
Old May 26, 2010, 01:12 AM   #24
Lavid2002
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 6, 2007
Posts: 2,568
Awesome man : )

Have fun shooting
-Dave
__________________
Math>Grammar
Lavid2002 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:16 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.11082 seconds with 10 queries