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Old May 16, 2010, 01:45 PM   #1
johns7022
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Shoot out at Walmart

First off, after reading the sticky on 'scenarios' I am not going to ask 'what would you do' knowing that many will run to your tactical cell phones..., a tiny few will fight...I got this from Glock talk, and got booted....

Here is the scenario for those that would fight...runners go find another thread....

Your going to meet your wife at Walmart...you pull into the parking area...people are running out saying there is a shooter doing a 'Virginia Tech' up and down the aisles...you get a call from your wife, she's holed up someplace..so your going in...

Smart peeps will sneak in, sneak up as close as they can get to take this guy out..as you do this, you see he's got all sorts of tactical vests and such, AK47...so your figuring for a headshot..yes he's moving, but not running....

Time is off the essence...a long shot miss, and he simply peppers you with full auto, no good cover...the longer you take to sneak up he is killing peeps point blank..and getting closer to taking out your wife(no wife jokes)

For the shooters in here, with thier typical CCW carry piece what is your maximum effective range for a headshot...so that in this scenario, at what distance will you take the shot...
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Old May 16, 2010, 02:03 PM   #2
SigP6Carry
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Sounds to me like you gotta stop playing Videogames and watching action films and get back to the real world.
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Old May 16, 2010, 02:18 PM   #3
ATW525
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Quote:
Sounds to me like you gotta stop playing Videogames and watching action films and get back to the real world.
I was thinking the same thing. It reads like somebody's hero fantasy.
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Old May 16, 2010, 02:25 PM   #4
Deaf Smith
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So johns7022, you wanna lock paws with multiple armored AK-47 opponents and all you have is a pistol?

Lots of luck.
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Old May 16, 2010, 02:32 PM   #5
jhenry
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I don't think I would be moving very slow at all.

Now, put down the XBox peeper.
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Old May 16, 2010, 02:37 PM   #6
SigP6Carry
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I've just got to point out real quick that it's not the Xboxes or Movies that do it, it's an awkward disconnect from reality. I played GTA for about 8 hours yesterday (I'm between semesters, currently unemployed and have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do), and I can still appreciate the levity of a situation involving guns.
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Old May 16, 2010, 02:41 PM   #7
SouthCali
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well ill lay it down since these guys won't.

I get the call. I throw on my ever ready vest, helmet, and night vision goggles. i see him in the dairy section. LOB a flash bang, disorientating him while i hot wire the forklift. I jam the forklift lever and use the slow steady speed as cover as he sprays, uselessly, towards me. Realizing what deep **** the BG is in, he drops his banana mag to reload. I look him dead in the eyes. He freezes knowing ive got him jammed up. I ask if hes feeling lucky. He replies he wakes up lucky. he catches one of my Smith and Wesson .500 hollowpoints in the jugular.

the store patrons surround me, lifting me on top of their shoulders, dress me in various flowers, and walk me out to the awaiting media.

sorry i was bored
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Old May 16, 2010, 02:47 PM   #8
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I crash the glass doors in my SUV and drive down the aisles blazing away at BG's until... Oh wait - this isn't Hollywood? Never mind.
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Old May 16, 2010, 02:49 PM   #9
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Nuke 'em from orbit...it's the only way to be sure.
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Old May 16, 2010, 02:56 PM   #10
stephen426
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Some of you guys seem pretty quick to blow off this scenario, but terrorism may take a new and ugly twist. Their idea is to inflict fear and kill innocent people. There have been mall shootings before... a Walmart is equally plausible. It certainly does nto have to be a Walmart in this scenario. There have been lone gun men shooting up all different kinds of places including gyms, and office buildings. If you are there to pick up your spouse or child, I doubt many of us on the TFL would just wait for the boys in blue to show up.

If I get a call from my wife that she is in there with my baby, I'm going in. I would tell her to keep moving away from the sound of the gun fire and to either get to an exit or the restrooms. I think the rules have changed sicne Virginia Tech and the police are not supposed to rush in.

I would certainly not rush in with my weapon drawn. That would be a pretty good way to get mistaken for another shooter and get shot (in my opinion). If it is a single gun man, I don't think it would be hard to find the guy since you can determine what direction the gunfire is coming from. Walmart does not have that many wide open spaces and I believe that it is possible to get pretty close to someone without being seen. There is very little true cover, but there is plenty of concealment. I have a laser on my Kahr PM9 that is pretty close to point of aim. I would hope to come up behind the shooter and pop him in the back of the head if possible. It is obviously not ideal to go up against someone packing an automatic weapon when armed only with a small handgun. I am not Rambo, but I certainly would not wait for the cops to show up if my wife and baby were in there.
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Old May 16, 2010, 03:02 PM   #11
animal
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I send my screeching liberal psychobabbling sister in law in to talk to him, help him get in touch with his feelings, and the issues he has that caused him to act out… if it doesn’t work, no great loss.

You didn’t say anything about in-law jokes …

btw, that wasn’t my wife, just some chick playing her on TV.
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Old May 16, 2010, 03:03 PM   #12
SigP6Carry
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The reason I personally dismiss this thread is the rhetoric and language used by the OP.

He doesn't seem to be talking about a plausible terrorist activity, he seems to be talking about a Bruce Willis movie. He also claims that most people would do nothing and run or use a "tactical phone," which seems to indicate that he considers people who wouldn't run in guns blazing would be wusses.

If I were in that situation, I doubt that I would transplant myself into it. If I'm outside of a wal-mart to pickup a loved one and people start running out and there was a madman in their shooting, I wouldn't go in. If I was in the store and someone started shooting, I would go after the shooter, but that would be because I was already in the line of danger and could effectively deploy a means of stopping him without placing myself or others in more danger.
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Old May 16, 2010, 03:09 PM   #13
45ACPShooter
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I don't know what the deal is with people thinking because you have a CCW that you need to be like a police officer or hero and save the day in the event of something like this. As horrible as these events are, it's not your responsibility to take down the shooter. I carry to protect my family and myself, I'm not a police officer. When it comes down to it, it's up to other people to take care of their own safety as cold as that may sound.

Not even looking at it from a tactical perspective of someone armed with a handgun trying to shoot someone armed with a rifle or shotgun maybe wearing body armor there's too many other factors to be concerned about such as legal aspects after the shooting. What's to stop arriving police on the seen to think you're the active shooter if they hear gunshots and then see you running around armed? What if you miss and accidentally hit a bystander? The list goes on, your weapon should only be used as a last resort and if there's anyway for you or your family to escape without using it, I suggest you do so.
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Old May 16, 2010, 03:17 PM   #14
kodiakbeer
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Well, the OP does say the wife is trapped in the store. As unlikely as the scenario is, were it to happen, yeah, I'd go in. That may not be smart or tactical or legally defensible in some states, but I'd go in. I suspect most of you would do the same - the wife is on the phone, you hear the shooting - you're going in.
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Old May 16, 2010, 03:20 PM   #15
animal
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If this thing is going to be taken seriously, cops weren’t swarming the place yet, and if I knew that my wife was inside …

I’m no hero, and I don’t play one on TV, but it wouldn’t matter whether I was armed or not
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Old May 16, 2010, 03:21 PM   #16
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its really hard to say what someone would do in any situation, until they have been there. a handgun vs and automatic weapon is a tough situation for even the best of shooters. if i were to insinuate myself into that situation, anything within 15 yards is a reasonable range for shooting accurately with a handgun. however you will have to be aware of what is going on, and on the scene intelligence is going to be valuable. where is the shooter in relationship to the entrance? can he see the front door move if you were to enter? where are the victims in relationship to the door? are these people going to call out to you if you go in? are you going to be able to tell them to keep quiet without being too loud? how frightened are those still in the store? are they going to possibly mistake you for a second shooter?

and the big question, can you pull the trigger and take another persons life? can you do it silently? or are you going to fall back on the concept of fair play and offer some sort of warning? are you an accurate enough shooter to hit a small moving target on the first shot?
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Old May 16, 2010, 03:23 PM   #17
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For the life of me, I can't see anything productive coming out of this, and thus far, (with the exception of stephen426's post,) it's been a waste of bandwidth.

Closed, before a mere brush fire becomes an all-out wildfire.
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