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Old May 13, 2010, 12:56 AM   #1
Plaz
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The best 44 rem mag powder

I am just starting to load 44 rem mag. Will some of you please tell me which you think are the best powders to use and why?
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Old May 13, 2010, 01:07 AM   #2
dmazur
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An excerpt from the Hodgdon web site -

Quote:
H110 is the spherical powder that screams "no wimps, please!" It delivers top velocities with top accuracy in the 44 Magnum, 454 Casull, 475 Linebaugh and the 460 and 500 S&W magnums. Silhouette shooters claim it is the most accurate 44 powder they have ever used.
I can't say it is the best powder I've used as it is the only powder I've used in .44 Magnum. It works for me.

You do have to be aware that it requires a firm roll crimp for proper ignition. It also works better with magnum primers (especially in low temperatures), and reducing loads more than 3% can be dangerous. It is used for "full house" loads.

If you want milder loads for plinking with a .44 Magnum, you need a different powder.
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Old May 13, 2010, 02:34 AM   #3
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What for? and Why?

Thanks for asking our advice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plaz
The best 44 rem mag powder
I am just starting to load 44 rem mag. Will some of you please tell me which you think are the best powders to use and why?
For mild loads, fast powders like Bullseye, Unique, etc. Or bulky powders like Trail Boss which fill the case well.

Wild loads require a long burn time to keep pressure steady. Slow powder like H110.

Dmazur has it exactly right.

H110 and other slow powders deliver maximum velocities and energies, but are not suitable for mild loadings. Unpredictable pressure spikes (and when I say unpredictable, I mean that even experts in internal ballistics have not been able to definitively explain it, though they are getting closer) which have not been able to be reproduced reliably. These spikes are sometimes enough to destroy guns. The slow-burning powders need reliable ignition and need to run at their full design pressures to ensure the burn is right. The crimp and a full load guarantee that. The slowness of the burn rate means that the pressure is extended for a long time behind the bullet for the full length of the barrel. This gives the highest total energies available from the cartridge.

If you want lower velocities (handy for practice, training, familiarization and just plain shooting for fun) a charge of powder that starts the bullet on its way and then quits pushing when the velocity you want has been achieved is in order. A fast powder that produces the pressure required to expand the cartridge case to get a good seal of brass against the chamber, then quits when the job is done.

In either case, you need a threshold pressure to seal the chamber and that pressure to drop off when the bullet has reached your intended velocity. You choose a powder that delivers within that range.

Other factors include how easy it is to measure out, how much space it occupies in the case (if it overfills, pick another, denser powder), how much it costs, whether you can find any for sale.

Most loads that work have been worked out by scientists (at the powder manufacturer's labs) and by loaders and ballisticians all over the world.

Load development. It ain't rocket science, but it is nearly as much fun and a lot less expensive.

Lost Sheep.

Edit:
Pick your bullet. Decide on the velocity you want. Go to (several) the loading manuals and find powders they list which include that velocity in their performance range. Be aware of the guns used to produce the test data. Remember, no powders are forgiving of loads above maximum. Slow powders are not forgiving of reduced loads. Fast powders are a little forgiving of light loads, but lots of empty volume in a cartridge case can make for erratic velocities (depending on where the powder is inside the case when the primer ignites).

Caveats and disclaimers:

I do not know you, so if my advice seems over-obvious, please take into account my ignorance of your experience level. Also, others of all experience levels are reading.

Remember, only believe half of what you see and one quarter of what you hear. That goes double for what you get from the internet. Even this post.

Do your own independent, confirming research when ANYONE gives you new facts on the web.

Also remember, even the idiotic stuff might have a kernel of truth buried in there somewhere.

I am not a ballistician, just a hobbyist. The foregoing ballistic information is what I have read, heard and observed (but not in carefully controlled lab conditions, just out at the range). So, take everything I say with a grain of salt. However, I believe all of it to be true.

Last edited by Lost Sheep; May 13, 2010 at 02:54 AM.
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Old May 13, 2010, 02:57 AM   #4
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I haven't owned a .44 Magnum for a long time. As I aged, it became a little too much for me.

One tip that I do remember is using .44 Special for any lighter loads. That is, I either loaded true "magnum" .44 Magnum loads, or I loaded .44 Special for light loads, plinking, practice, etc. The reason was that I found that .44 Special data is very developed, whereas "light magnum" loads were often a real pain in the neck. Also, if the load data label gets blurred or falls off, then at least you know what to expect.

I guess this falls into the "common sense" category, but I thought that I might mention it.
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Old May 13, 2010, 05:10 AM   #5
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Only one true powder

Plaz, I've been loading 44 magnums for about 25 years, both for pistol, and rifle. I,ve tried everything when it comes to powder, some claiming to be the best for magnum full house loads, and some for light loads, other powders claim to be better for lead bullets, while others claim to be only good with jacketed. To make a long story short, if you use IMR 4227 you will never look back, this powder will be great no matter what you require. Best of luck with it.
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Old May 13, 2010, 05:41 AM   #6
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I`m very interested in more responses to Plaz`s question being headed in the same direction. I`ve never in the past ( before starting to handload ) used .44 Spec. in .44 Mag. revolvers because the commercial loadings tended to be dirty and both foul the large .44 Mag chambers resulting in problems extracting the longer Mag. rounds when used, as well as a pain to clean if lead bullets.

Not trying to hijack the thread, but "True" Magnum loads are a bit much for for me for range work, so what would be the cleanest powder if loading .44 Spec. or light .44 Mag. loads.
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Old May 13, 2010, 06:14 AM   #7
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I have found the best consistancy and long range accuracy (out to 250 yds) with 2400 powder. It doesn't have to be a max load, just consistant.
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Old May 13, 2010, 06:27 AM   #8
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I personally use H110 for the hot loads, Trail Boss for the weak loads (44 special level loads in mag case), and Unique for "in between". Lots of folks like 2400 in that cartridge as well, though I haven't tried it myself.

If you're going with only one powder, I would go with Unique or 2400.

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Old May 13, 2010, 06:42 AM   #9
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2400
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Old May 13, 2010, 08:17 AM   #10
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A Personal Quirk

For HP loads, I prefer H-110/296 because I don't like the smell of 2400, even though 2400 has a slight edge in accuracy. Cast bullets for fun shooting are pushed by Unique.
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Old May 13, 2010, 08:52 AM   #11
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i like h110,because i like heavy feeling loads-it seems like i could shoot it all day,last time my hand was red for a few hours after.im sure the hot loads will fade as time goes on.but you cant do mild loads with h110 as others have said.i only have used magnum primers for h110.for lighter loads i have been using blue dot and have used winchester and remington large pistol primers and that seems to be fine.i would like to try magnum primers with blue dot,but will have to start back up again-as magnum primers are hotter.
have not tried 2400 but mabe next time around.(like a kid in a candy store)
im getting to the point where i would like to just have a few powders that i can use for all my pistol reloading needs! 9mm,40,45,44mag.
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Old May 13, 2010, 09:34 AM   #12
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As mentioned by a couple of people, I think it really depends on what kind of load you want. I tend to load a lot of these three, all with 250 grain cast SWC:

7.5 gr 231 (or HP-38) for about 800 fps
10 gr Power Pistol for about 1050 fps
24 gr 296 (or H-110) for about 1350 fps

All three are very accurate in all my .44 mag revolvers. The Power Pistol load is a great midrange load that almost does everything I want. However, I find myself shooting quite a bit of the 231 load lately.

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Old May 13, 2010, 09:51 AM   #13
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Like most here, I use WW296, H110, and 2400 for the 44 Mag.. plinking loads I like 7.5-8 grs. of Unique, good target load..
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Old May 13, 2010, 09:56 AM   #14
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Everyone who shoots a .44, has a personal preference. That's to be expected.

For me, I went through a few cans of H110, when I "discovered" IMR4227. There are a number of reasons I've taken to this powder.

When using H110 (or W296 - same exact powder) or when using H4227 (not the same powder as IMR4227!), you must use a magnum primer for reliable and efficient ignition. When using IMR4227, I only need to use a standard LP primer.

For me and my guns, IMR4227 appears to be more accurate than 110/297. The "felt" recoil is less, even at maximum loads. This might be because IMR4227 is a slower burning powder than 110/296 and uses lower pressures to achieve near the same velocities... Or it just might be me.

When not using "full house" loads, I've taken to shooting with Alliant 2400. The benefit here are loads that can be from the very mild to near "full house." As with IMR4227, you do not need to use LP magnum primers.

Finally, when just shooting lead for fun, or when introducing a newcomer to .44's, I like Trail Boss. Extremely mild loads. Fills the case, so no chance of overcharging. Did I mention, it's fun to shoot?
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Old May 13, 2010, 10:57 AM   #15
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I've tried a lot of powders for the 44 mag. For performance loads my favs are W296/H110, LilGun, Ramshot Enforcer.
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Old May 13, 2010, 03:36 PM   #16
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I like 2400.
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Old May 13, 2010, 05:17 PM   #17
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I've used a lot of different powders for the .44 mag .....Hodgdon powders Longshot, Universal and LilGun all were ok / but a little dirty ....especially LilGun.

But the most consistent I've found is Hodgdon TiteGroup in terms of accuracy and cleanliness.

You can drop it down to about 9.0gr to about 1150 fps for a 240gr jacketed bullet so its relatively light ( not quite a .44 spl ) - but I like my full power loads at around 9.6 - 9.8 gr.

For a real .44 spl load / use a 200gr jacketed bullet ...and between 5.0 and 5.4 gr of TiteGroup for a load around 850 - 900 fps which is a real soft shooting load. I don't load many .44 spl because I have trouble finding 200gr bullets / and I don't like to shoot lead bullets ( especiall at indoor ranges ).
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Old May 13, 2010, 07:30 PM   #18
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When I am looking at powders, there are several factors that matter to me. As the application changes (e.g., holes in paper vs holes in animals), then how I prioritize changes as well. The factors include:
  1. Accuracy
  2. Meters well in a powder measure
  3. Burns cleanly
  4. Energy/velocity
  5. Consistency, "forgiving"
  6. Cost per hundred rounds.
People have mentioned some of my favorite powders already. But just to add a different dimension to the discussion, I've also looked at the powder cost per hundred rounds.

This table compares powders for 240 grain lead bullets in .44 Rem Mag, using only published MAXIMUM loads by the major powder manufacturers, and current powder prices on PowderValleyInc.com. Some powders didn't have a 240 grain load, so I included the load for the next larger size lead bullet.

I get disappointed in Hodgdon because the smallest lead bullet they list for H110 is 325 grains -- they stopped publishing lighter lead bullets a while ago. I have an H110 load I use for my 240's, but I am not going to list it because I worked it up myself and it is both hot and unpublished.

Anyway, here is the list in ascending cost order. Remember, these are MAXIMUM loads:

Cost/100 = $0.96 Alliant Promo ---> 6.5 grains; 905 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.06 Alliant Bullseye ---> 6 grains; 894 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.14 Alliant Red Dot ---> 6.5 grains; 905 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.20 Hodgdon Clays ---> 6.2 grains; 940 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.23 Alliant Green Dot ---> 7 grains; 901 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.23 Alliant Unique ---> 7 grains; 899 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.66 Winchester AutoComp ---> 8 grains; 996 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.76 IMR 700-X ---> 9.5 grains; 1185 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.78 IMR Trail Boss ---> 7.3 grains; 917 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.86 Hodgdon Titegroup ---> 10 grains; 1288 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.08 Hodgdon Universal ---> 10.2 grains; 1276 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.12 Hodgdon HP-38 ---> 11 grains; 1334 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.28 Winchester 231 ---> 11 grains; 1334 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.54 IMR 800-X ---> 13.4 grains; 1395 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.60 Ramshot Enforcer ---> 12.3 grains; 1222 fps. (255 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.60 Ramshot True Blue ---> 12.3 grains; 1222 fps. (255 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.76 IMR SR 7625 ---> 10.7 grains; 1190 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $3.09 Vihtavuori N320 ---> 9.6 grains; 1014 fps. (248 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $3.38 Accurate No. 7 ---> 16.3 grains; 1341 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $3.79 Alliant 2400 ---> 20 grains; 1390 fps. (250 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $4.18 Accurate No. 9 ---> 20.2 grains; 1426 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $4.83 Hodgdon H110 ---> 22 grains; 1368 fps. (325 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $4.93 Winchester 296 ---> 22 grains; 1368 fps. (325 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $5.26 IMR 4227 ---> 22 grains; 1310 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $6.77 Accurate 5744 ---> 24 grains; 1446 fps. (240 gr lead)
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Old May 13, 2010, 08:02 PM   #19
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H110 because it gives top velocity. It's a 44Mag right? It's not you're Granny's 25Auto. Balls to the wall.

I also like the fact of using magnum primers with this powder. They are ALWAYS in stock where I buy them.
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Old May 13, 2010, 08:42 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumping Frog


When I am looking at powders, there are several factors that matter to me. As the application changes (e.g., holes in paper vs holes in animals), then how I prioritize changes as well. The factors include:

1. Accuracy
2. Meters well in a powder measure
3. Burns cleanly
4. Energy/velocity
5. Consistency, "forgiving"
6. Cost per hundred rounds.

People have mentioned some of my favorite powders already. But just to add a different dimension to the discussion, I've also looked at the powder cost per hundred rounds.

This table compares powders for 240 grain lead bullets in .44 Rem Mag, using only published MAXIMUM loads by the major powder manufacturers, and current powder prices on PowderValleyInc.com. Some powders didn't have a 240 grain load, so I included the load for the next larger size lead bullet.

I get disappointed in Hodgdon because the smallest lead bullet they list for H110 is 325 grains -- they stopped publishing lighter lead bullets a while ago. I have an H110 load I use for my 240's, but I am not going to list it because I worked it up myself and it is both hot and unpublished.

Anyway, here is the list in ascending cost order. Remember, these are MAXIMUM loads:

Cost/100 = $0.96 Alliant Promo ---> 6.5 grains; 905 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.06 Alliant Bullseye ---> 6 grains; 894 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.14 Alliant Red Dot ---> 6.5 grains; 905 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.20 Hodgdon Clays ---> 6.2 grains; 940 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.23 Alliant Green Dot ---> 7 grains; 901 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.23 Alliant Unique ---> 7 grains; 899 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.66 Winchester AutoComp ---> 8 grains; 996 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.76 IMR 700-X ---> 9.5 grains; 1185 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.78 IMR Trail Boss ---> 7.3 grains; 917 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $1.86 Hodgdon Titegroup ---> 10 grains; 1288 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.08 Hodgdon Universal ---> 10.2 grains; 1276 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.12 Hodgdon HP-38 ---> 11 grains; 1334 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.28 Winchester 231 ---> 11 grains; 1334 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.54 IMR 800-X ---> 13.4 grains; 1395 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.60 Ramshot Enforcer ---> 12.3 grains; 1222 fps. (255 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.60 Ramshot True Blue ---> 12.3 grains; 1222 fps. (255 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $2.76 IMR SR 7625 ---> 10.7 grains; 1190 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $3.09 Vihtavuori N320 ---> 9.6 grains; 1014 fps. (248 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $3.38 Accurate No. 7 ---> 16.3 grains; 1341 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $3.79 Alliant 2400 ---> 20 grains; 1390 fps. (250 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $4.18 Accurate No. 9 ---> 20.2 grains; 1426 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $4.83 Hodgdon H110 ---> 22 grains; 1368 fps. (325 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $4.93 Winchester 296 ---> 22 grains; 1368 fps. (325 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $5.26 IMR 4227 ---> 22 grains; 1310 fps. (240 gr lead)
Cost/100 = $6.77 Accurate 5744 ---> 24 grains; 1446 fps. (240 gr lead)
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Old May 14, 2010, 08:23 AM   #21
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Tagged. Thanks for the info. I just started reloading for .44 mag, too, and hoped I could do everything with one powder. Guess I'll need three, like 2400 or H110, Unique, and Trail Boss.
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Old May 14, 2010, 11:33 AM   #22
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I have just started to reload but I have found that I like the way Blue Dot performs. The speer book has it listed about middle of the road for data. So far I have had good results with 12.5 grns of it behind a 240 grn HP/XTP. I am shooting a 329 PD so the gun is very light, only 26 Oz empty. I find this load in that light of a gun very managable and fun to shoot. It is dirty, but it works well for me. I clean my guns after any way, so to me it is not a big deal
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Old May 14, 2010, 12:28 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by totaldla
Better check your table again.
You are right, somehow I duped the True Blue load. Here is the corrected info. I see where that puts Enforcer a little better than AA #9 in performance.

Cost/100 = $4.36 Ramshot Enforcer ---> 20.6 grains; 1428 fps. (255 gr lead)
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Old May 14, 2010, 12:45 PM   #24
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Those "max loads" for Alliant powders must be from their latest catalog where they use soft Speer swaged bullets and dialed everything back to prevent leading. With cast bullets, you can drive them much faster, and I'm looking at Alliant published data right now from a couple of years ago before they neutered it. For 240 grain lead gas checked bullets with an OAL of 1.6" (the data would be the same without the GC but you *might* get leading):
Code:
Bullseye         9.8gn  1175fps  34.4kpsi
Red Dot          8.8gn  1175fps  34.9kpsi
American Select  9.2gn  1180fps  33.8kpsi
Green Dot        9.5gn  1170fps  34.8kpsi
Unique          11.8gn  1255fps  35.0kpsi
Power Pistol    
Herco           12.5gn  1330fps  33.8kpsi
Blue Dot        16.6gn  1475fps  34.7kpsi
2400            20.6gn  1510fps  34.7kpsi
In my opinion, Herco is the sweet spot between price and performance with cast bullets.

Last edited by zxcvbob; May 14, 2010 at 12:56 PM.
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Old May 14, 2010, 12:52 PM   #25
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others have already said they use mag. primers with H110. Let me say that you must use mag. primers. only handload problem I've ever had was a squib .45 Colt that had a max charge of 110 with a standard primer. stuck halfway down the barrel. I know that is what caused it.
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