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Old June 2, 2010, 11:16 PM   #51
Kmar40
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I guess you don't realize by Chinese disposable junk, I'm talking about the NEF also? Are you one of those that thinks that is made in the US?

I've forgot more about firearms 20 years ago than you'll ever know. Spent the day qualifying other instructors today. I'll be qualing the teams tomorrow and doing force on force with simunitions and paint guns.

You're right. I would NEVER pay $200 for Chinese junk when a Mossberg is about $25 more and a Remington is less than $50 more.

There are times when buying a cheaper gun (even a cheap gun) makes sense. But to save $20 isn't one of them.
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Old June 2, 2010, 11:51 PM   #52
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You had me at "I forgot....."
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Old June 2, 2010, 11:58 PM   #53
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jmortimer


Don't wast your time , it's (them ) TOTALLY useless .


.

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Old June 3, 2010, 02:44 PM   #54
jlv08
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I am amazed at how some folks here are such "experts" on what is cheap and disposable in the realm of firearms.

I know some hunters who are very happy with the NEF shotgun and have heard no compaints.

I have a 20 ga. Partner Pump Compact that looks as good as the day I bought it and hasn't given me one minute of grief.

Am I to expect with the "expert" comments made here that my gun is going to all of a sudden fall apart?

And based on what objective experience do the "experts" base their claims?

I frequent a gun shop and presented these arguments to the owner and he admmitted that he was skeptical at first with the NEF pumps but that was alleviated when they started flying off the shelves with not one return.

I had an early version of the Hawk gun and GAVE it away to a friend with out really running it thru some paces and he still has it.

That was roughly seven years ago and the gun still looks good and he loves it.

Disposable? Cheap? Junk?

I doubt that the NEF bashers have the "expertise" they claim based soley on the total lack of objectivity and knee jerking that is evedent in some of the comments made

Sounds kinda like the stuff I hear from liberal gun grabbers who are trying to take our guns away.
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Old June 3, 2010, 06:52 PM   #55
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Kmar40, "You're right. I would NEVER pay $200 for Chinese junk when a Mossberg is about $25 more and a Remington is less than $50 more.

There are times when buying a cheaper gun (even a cheap gun) makes sense. But to save $20 isn't one of them."

The NEF is built to the same specs as the Remington 870. Hell even the parts interchange. I took a look at a friends new Remmy and Id have to say that if it were'nt for the names stamped on the side. I would have sworn they were the same gun. With the exception of my NEF weighing a little more and atleast it feels like it's built like a tank.

ps
Can anyone tell me why the NEF kicks a Heck of alot harder than the Remmy?
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Old June 3, 2010, 07:00 PM   #56
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Quote:
and atleast it feels like it's built like a tank.
Why would you want that?

I prefer MY shotguns to feel like a lithe wand in my hands, able to move magically towards its intended targets
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Old June 3, 2010, 07:26 PM   #57
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Quote:
ps
Can anyone tell me why the NEF kicks a Heck of alot harder than the Remmy?


Maybe because of the stock's drop??
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Old June 3, 2010, 10:00 PM   #58
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As per the above post, my gun shop (Has over 2,000 guns in stock) owed me $200.00 in "credit" and my gun sales guy said why not get a $200.00 Pardner Protector - He said they had sold hundreds and never had a single one returned for any reason. So I said why not try it out and what a great gun Remington/Marlin/H&R has given us. All the great owner reviews were right on.
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Old June 3, 2010, 10:38 PM   #59
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"knight0334 :
ps
Can anyone tell me why the NEF kicks a Heck of alot harder than the Remmy?

Maybe because of the stock's drop??"



Oh ok. Thanks for the info. I know because my NEF is heaiber than my friends 870. My NEF kicks a HECK of alot harder with 3in mags.. Whew!!!!!!!!!
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Old June 3, 2010, 10:41 PM   #60
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"oneounceload
and atleast it feels like it's built like a tank.

Why would you want that?

I prefer MY shotguns to feel like a lithe wand in my hands, able to move magically towards its intended targets"


Dunno it just doesnt feel excuse me "as Cheaply made" as the lighter gun. Mine is for defense not hunting. If I want to frail the badguy upside the head it better be good enough for that too.
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Old June 4, 2010, 02:53 PM   #61
jlv08
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Simunitions? Paintball guns? Forgot more about firearms than one would know at present?:barf: Hmmmm....I detect Mall ninja with a bad memory.
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Old June 4, 2010, 10:38 PM   #62
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Why would you want that?

I prefer MY shotguns to feel like a lithe wand in my hands, able to move magically towards its intended targets
The military spec 590A1 with 20" heavy barrel is no wand in your hand either. The Protector and 590A1 are defense shotguns not designed for shooting small flying targets. I like the extra weight and added durability.


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Old June 5, 2010, 07:40 AM   #63
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A standard weight 12 gauge target gun, designed for those little clay discs, typically weigh between 8 and 10 pounds, yet because they are properly balanced, they move like a wand.

Why would you, especially in a defense scenario, want something that moves slow and awkwardly, as opposed to one that moves like my previously-mentioned wand?

It is a lot easier to "cheaply make" an awkward, unbalanced gun than it is to make one that is light and balanced.........
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Old June 5, 2010, 09:06 AM   #64
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Stock Fitter's Bible.......explains how to fix that.

http://www.stockfitting.com/
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Old June 5, 2010, 09:26 AM   #65
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A standard weight 12 gauge target gun, designed for those little clay discs, typically weigh between 8 and 10 pounds, yet because they are properly balanced, they move like a wand.

Why would you, especially in a defense scenario, want something that moves slow and awkwardly, as opposed to one that moves like my previously-mentioned wand?

It is a lot easier to "cheaply make" an awkward, unbalanced gun than it is to make one that is light and balanced.......
The 590A1 20" barrel is awkwardly balance when fully loaded because of the lightweight aluminum receiver, heavy wall barrel, extra barrel ring with bayonet lug and 8 shells in the tube, it's very front heavy. You are the one saying that the Protector is unbalanced because you have never picked one up. It's heavy but the extra weight is from the receiver and the solid stock. It's weight is centered and it's pretty well balanced when fully loaded for a defense gun.

Balance is not the first concern with a defense shotgun. Extra ammo, flashlight, sling can be much more important. You have decide what your own needs are with a defense gun and what is important.

The 870 18.5" & 20" barrel shotguns with factory tube extension when fully loaded isn't balanced either.

You are thinking like a wing shooter.


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Last edited by MAX100; June 5, 2010 at 09:37 AM.
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Old June 6, 2010, 09:46 AM   #66
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My defensive shotgun(s) are NOT "lithe wands" that "magically point " them selves to there intended targets!

I gotta admit, oneounce, and with all due respect, that statement took the cake!

I do not own any shotguns that I could refer to as "lithe wands" and find that kind of description a little over the top and almost feminine in nature.

I use deliberate movements to point and aim my shotguns and do so with out sprinkling a speck of fairy dust in the process and my guns are purpose built to be heavy handling defensive loads, and be a club if the perp is still upright and bleeding. God forbid!

The pot metal remark is another statemnnt made that even adds more to the idiocy of the remarks made towards the NEF as I and others on this board who own these NEF pardners have yet to find ANY pot metal on the shotgun you so disparage as cheap Chinese junk.

Just to add, the fact that They are produced in China is not an issue to me.

I have a set of bolt cutters, Chinese made, that work flawlessly. Do I say. 'Dang! This thing is made in China, I can't use this!" NO! I cut bolts like they are butter! "Pot metal" never cut so good!

I feel like those folks who trash members in here with these statements are lacking any objective experience, hate the Chinese, loathe those who buy NEF shotguns, and take great joy at trashing posters who discuss these shotguns on this forum.

I have said this before, I DARE YOU TO ASK ANY NEF OWNER IF THEY THINK THEIR GUN IS POT METAL JUNK! I dare you to ask any one on this forum if their gun fails to feed. I dare you to ask if the owners of the NEF have rusting finishes or chambers that needed reaming or ammo feeding issues with different brands or ANY brand for that manner. WELL?????? How "bout it gents?

If you have a problem with Chairman Mao, go wizz on his grave, that will do as much good than trying to rain on the parade of those of us who own the NEF Pardner Pump and are happy that they do what they intend to do

Oh, by the way, you didn't you hear me trash the wonderful new offering from Remington, the 887 Nitro, aptly name due to the fact it could blow up in your face and as far as the newer Express's go, I won't go there as there are two many posters who are stuck with these non feeding rusting hulks. I was and got rid of it.

I firmly believe that the altruism arguing point against a prediposed bias is non productive and does no one any good so I''ll respond only to those post about the NEF Pardner Pump positively and try not to get side tracked by the pot metal, wand wielding detractors of who bash this well made gun by NEF.

Pot metal.... sheeeees!!!
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Old June 6, 2010, 11:00 AM   #67
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My defensive shotgun(s) are NOT "lithe wands" that "magically point " them selves to there intended targets!

I gotta admit, oneounce, and with all due respect, that statement took the cake!

I do not own any shotguns that I could refer to as "lithe wands" and find that kind of description a little over the top and almost feminine in nature.
So sorry to offend your feminine side........you obviously prefer to "manhandle" your guns.....I still have to point mine as well - I just don't need to use as much effort and can therefore better concentrate on my intended target, something you want to try - it really does help......

But if you prefer to wield something that handles like a pig on a shovel, far be it from me to dissuade you..............
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Old June 6, 2010, 10:11 PM   #68
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Oneounce I, I repeat, I was Not offended by your retort. My shotguns are tools and I for dang sure don't eat tea and crumpets while shooting.

And as far a shotgunning goes, I may not be an ace but I can hold my own pretty well.

And tell me, Have you got the guts to ask those who own the NEF if they are junk?

Mr. McCracken has a posted challenge for those who bash the 870.


How about you? I'd love to see you post an inquiry to those who own these shotguns and present an objective observation as to if they are junk.

I have other Chinese weapons (SKS, Tokarevs) as well as Soviet Bloc rifles that are tough as nails and belie the statement that they are all potmetal junk. I'm sure your claims aren't based on ANY reasonable objective thought.

Folks like them and are getting good service out of them and that's the facts.

But having said that I assume that the fact the NEF is much better quality to todays Express rust buckets that couldn't feed oats to a drunk donkey have you NEF haters in a dither.

I'm not trying to convince anyone to buy these guns, They seem to be selling very well on their own merit.

I've reponded to the OP about the merits of the gun.

But folks like you and that other nasty mouth individual, Kmar40, who posted a nasty remark at me weren't having none of that.

And to compare a field grade gun to one that handles like a "lithe wand" is ludicrous.

The NEF Pardner is not in the same class of the Berretta or the Benelli nor was it meant to be.

It's a field grade shotgun in pump configuaton.

It it makes you feel good, bash away!, Call me names! Throw mud at me and call my little Partner Compact 20 ga. pot metal junk.

Call everyone a Commie for buying one!

It won't matter, people will by them and NEF will keep making them.

And there is nothing you can do about it!

One things for sure, the game I've taken don't know the difference and are just as dead !

Come on, give me your A game, oneounce. I'm sure you aren't through bashing or belittling those of us NEF owners!

I bet it makes you feel real good to put your head on the pillow at night and say that you really bashed an NEF owner today!

Oh, as I'm concerned for your safety, please unload your wand so it doesn't discharge accidently while you are sleeping.
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Old June 6, 2010, 10:26 PM   #69
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Well I can't speak to the Pardner, but I had an 88 that I just abused the heck out of. Got it cheap, before it was over it had an 18 inch tube and the PGO that I tell so many people to stay away from. Dropped it, threw it the back of the truck and ran as many shells thru it as I could stand. As far as I remember it never had a problem.
As an aside, tho' I've never owned a chinese shotgun (I think), anyone who states that all chicom weapons are "junk" must have very little experience with them. I've owned porbably 2 dozen of different flavors. They are seldom pretty, never sexy, but I've never seen one that wasn't 100%reliable.
Seems like there's an awful lot of nastiness on this board anymore. I expect that among the handgun crowd, but I thought shotgunners were a bit more polite.
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Old June 6, 2010, 10:38 PM   #70
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What's with all the yelling? I bought my first shotgun a month or so ago. I considered the NEF pardner briefly, but working in manufacturing makes me shy away from anything Chinese made. Sometimes you don't have a choice. Sometimes you do. I chose a Mossberg 500. Truth be told I have nothing to compare it to.
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Old June 7, 2010, 07:36 AM   #71
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jlv - if you like your chinese 870 clone, good for you. My comments about its handling apply equally to the other guns mentioned in this thread as well - when all tricked out and loaded up, they handle like pigs on shovels. Since it seems that SD/HD is the primary use for these, again, why would you not want it to handle exquisitely well? If there was ever a time for a gun to handle like my aforementioned wand, it would be in a high-stress situation where you are fearing for your life

Personally, I prefer O/U and SxS shotguns
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Old June 7, 2010, 10:00 AM   #72
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This thread has become almost like a bad odor that won't go away. Much like some of the M-500/R-870 debates we've had in the past, but with an added international flair. About the only meaningful info has been to avoid mixing plastics and certain solvents the length of replacement mag springs.

I first read the OP some time ago, and I found Ceorgian's, "I really wanna treat myself to another HD shotgun, and am on a budget" a sad commentary. He already has an 870 (of unspecified configuration, but assumed to be HD) and a Stoeger Coachgun. It is beyond me why anyone would want/need more than one or two HD shotguns. I suppose you could have multiple HD guns if you had them stowed at various different locations or several areas with one location. But, if that were the case, wouldn't you be best served having identical HD shotguns to maximize your training efforts?

I have several game specific shotguns for trap, skeet and clays. Yet no matter how many I have, I can only shoot one at a time. Perhaps with HD guns you can have one for daytime BG's and another for after dark.

I don't have a dog in this fight -- haven't owned a pump gun in 40+ years. But, I've watched far too many young men become frustrated with their entry level pump guns while at the trap and skeet fields. Why? It's not because there's anything wrong with the guns, but they suffer a lack of training. There seems to be a pervasive misunderstanding that testosterone levels have something to do with an instinctive ability to use a shotgun without any training.

I recall watching two young men with fresh M-500s shoot a round of skeet. From the first station, it was obvious from their stance they didn't know they way around a shotgun. One of them had to put the butt on his thigh to cycle the action. After a dismal round of awkward gun handling and missed targets, we tried to encourage them to try another 25 targets. Their comment was that they'd already shot a round of trap so they'd already had enough practice with their new guns. Is their awkwardness somehow going to magically vanish should there be an actual HD incident?

I'm with oneounceload on this one. Shotguns are best applied bringing down flying targets. True, they have overlapping uses; but, you can use a pistol or carbine for HD. When talking about flying targets, shotguns come to mind. For me, the fun and satisfaction from bringing down flying targets with a well balanced gun is way ahead of having a pig shoveler waiting in my closet for BGs/zombies.

IMHO, some of you are putting way too much emotion into worrying about who's got the better bottom dollar shotgun (or where it comes from) when how well you can use that shotgun is what matters. (Most of HD gun pics posted exhibit no wear.) Instead of adding to his collection of HD guns, I'd like to suggest that Georgian get some ammo and targets and treat himself (and applicable home partner) to some serious shooting/training.

BA/UU/R...
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Old June 7, 2010, 08:46 PM   #73
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Well right now I have 3 "HD" SG's. the 870 is at the front door, it's only mod is the mossy 18" barrel. That comes off and the 28" IM barrel goes on for the trap field. There's an old Savage 20ga pump at the back door loaded with feild loads, it's the wife's snake gun and the only one that has been used, in this family anyway, in it's intended "HD" role. And then there's the 311 at my bedside. Don't really need it, but it just seems strange not to have a side byside by the bedside (Say that 3 times fast). And then there's the remote possiblity that the ranch is attacked by rabid zombie bears riding giant android spiders in which case I want several so everyone can have one. So I can see where having several SG's could come in handy.
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Old June 7, 2010, 09:39 PM   #74
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OC,
Thanks for the reminder and reality check, my friend, there are still quite a few shotguns out there that serve their original multi-purpose role without being fitted out to only fight zombies.
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Old June 7, 2010, 11:54 PM   #75
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Nice post OkieCruffler


i.m.o. it's not the shotgun it's the person behind the trigger that makes the difference. long barrel , short barrel , semi , pump , single shot , side by side etc. , etc, so on and so forth.......PRACTICE
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