The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Dave McCracken Memorial Shotgun Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old March 12, 2010, 04:19 PM   #26
GunsAreGood
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 13, 2010
Posts: 300
oneounceload no problem at all. Like it has been said if you can get a replacement barrel for your Mossberg that would probably be good. You will already be familiar with the gun and be very proficient with all the controls. I would not give my 870 up for anything and do not suggest Mossberg over Remington's very much. Not because of quality or anything like that it is just personal preference so Mossberg fans save your breath or should I say fingers in this situation. If you are looking for a reason to buy another gun than I would suggest a 870. PJR
Quote:
I frequently read on the Internet about the guys who brag and boast how they humiliate guys with more expensive guns. Read about it often, rarely see it happen at the range.
I never said I humiliate guys with more expensive guns I was just saying that I will shoot as well or better than some guys with high end guns. I do not go out to the trap range and shoot better than everybody. A lot of the guys with high end shotguns are shooting many more clays than me. But there are some that are not. Yes expensive gear has its advantages but not enough to make you a great shooter by just owning it.
__________________
From my cold dead hands

If guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns
GunsAreGood is offline  
Old March 12, 2010, 05:55 PM   #27
dropthehammer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 26, 2009
Location: Suburb of Cleveland Ohio
Posts: 108
Bottom line is, you get what you pay for. A quality used over/under with screw in chokes will never lose value if well cared for. In most cases it will be worth more. Yes, the initial investment is more, but should your interests change, sell it and don't lose a dime. There are not alot of toys that hold their value as well as a quality used gun. Gotta warn you though, once you develop a taste for quality guns, its a hard habit to break. I know, I've been an addict for almost 30 years.
dropthehammer is offline  
Old March 12, 2010, 06:23 PM   #28
LanceOregon
Junior member
 
Join Date: May 10, 2008
Location: Oregon
Posts: 2,774
Quote:
They ( Mossberg 930 ) are below $500 and are every bit as good as any of the autoloders metioned so far....
That statement would even make a horse laugh.

LanceOregon is offline  
Old March 12, 2010, 07:30 PM   #29
REL1203
Member
 
Join Date: September 21, 2006
Location: Manassas, VA
Posts: 59
Quote:
That statement would even make a horse laugh.
Why is that?
REL1203 is offline  
Old March 12, 2010, 09:22 PM   #30
Smitty in CT
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 30, 2006
Location: Moodus, CT
Posts: 589
Quote:
Originally Posted by REL1203
Quote:
Originally Posted by LanceOregon
That statement would even make a horse laugh.
Why is that?
Either ignorance or "blind" brand loyalty, he's obviously never used one or he wouldn't make such rediculous comment...
__________________
Smitty

"The object of war is not to die for your country, but to make the other bastard die for his." -- Gen. George Patton
Smitty in CT is offline  
Old March 12, 2010, 10:02 PM   #31
Dr. Strangelove
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 1, 2008
Location: Athens, GA
Posts: 1,418
You're probably better spending some money on ammuntion and targets practicing than buying a new shotgun at this point.

At my range, most, if not all, members will gladly let you use their shotgun if you see one you may like. Try a few and see what tickles your fancy...
Dr. Strangelove is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 09:05 AM   #32
AZwarts
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 2, 2009
Posts: 112
What is wrong with using a pump? I use a pump all the time and I can can smoke them just as good ( when I hit them) as the other guys... All I use is a Remington 870
AZwarts is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 09:31 AM   #33
swmp9jrm
Member
 
Join Date: September 1, 2008
Posts: 95
If you're okay with a pump, try out the Browning BPS Trap. Reasonable price, Browning quality, 30" barrel, and nicely set up for trap.
swmp9jrm is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 12:33 PM   #34
zippy13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 23, 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 6,408
Quote:
Originally Posted by GunsAreGood
Quote:
I frequently read on the Internet about the guys who brag and boast how they humiliate guys with more expensive guns. Read about it often, rarely see it happen at the range.
I never said I humiliate guys with more expensive guns I was just saying that I will shoot as well or better than some guys with high end guns. I do not go out to the trap range and shoot better than everybody. A lot of the guys with high end shotguns are shooting many more clays than me. But there are some that are not. Yes expensive gear has its advantages but not enough to make you a great shooter by just owning it.
You didn't mention how your 870 skeet scores measure up. Most of the clay sports require a quick second shot, and pump guns are not well suited for a quick second shot. The OP wants to know about a skeet/trap gun. His experience is so limited he doesn't yet realize the two sports have different requirements typically calling for two different guns. He's going to be busy enough on the skeet field learning the fundamentals, unnecessarily shucking a pump shouldn't be part of the exercise. To recommend a pump gun for target work other than trap is a disservice.
zippy13 is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 01:38 PM   #35
salber01
Member
 
Join Date: October 18, 2005
Location: N E Kansas
Posts: 23
A $300 gun that fits you is much more important than a $1000 gun that doesn't. Since a shotgun has no rear sight you must be able to get your eye to align along the barrel properly. Your size and how you mount the gun are deciding factors in this, so finding a gun you can sight down the barrel comfortably is important.

Some of the big name guns now have shims or adjustable stocks on even there lower grade guns so this isn't necessarily an expensive thing anymore. For example Mossberg makes shims for the 500/590 stock to change the angle of the stock and these are available from places like ebay and brownells for $5-$15

http://www.archerymarket.com/store/p...-Spacer-Systm/

Last edited by salber01; March 13, 2010 at 05:27 PM.
salber01 is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 01:44 PM   #36
oneounceload
Junior member
 
Join Date: April 18, 2008
Location: N. Central Florida
Posts: 8,518
Zippy makes excellent points about second shots. I have seen a few folks who can work a pump like it's a semi, but those folks are few and far between on the courses I frequent.

Trap singles notwithstanding, a pump CAN be used for skeet, trap doubles, and sporting, although it is, IMO, not the best choice for being successful.

IMO, for sporting, where the two targets tend to be different from each other, I prefer the O/U so I can utilize two different chokes as necessary.

As also mentioned earlier - try as many as you can to see what feels right to you
oneounceload is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 04:26 PM   #37
Dave McC
Staff In Memoriam
 
Join Date: October 13, 1999
Location: Columbia, Md, USA
Posts: 8,812
Some good advice here, but let me ask.....

What are your goals?

If it's to end up in the Hall of Fame of either Trap or Skeet, a mission specific shotgun would be the best choice. Most folks like autos or O/Us for this.

Or, if you just want to have fun while getting better as a shotgunner, using a shotgun similar to your defensive tool so the "Chops" are the same and practice with one is practice with the other makes an awful lot of sense.

If you can splatter a pair of clays moving on different trajectories at different speeds with a 500 in very short time frames, hitting larger, slower, closer things that are dangerous with your 590 WHEN IT REALLY IS IMPORTANT TO DO SO becomes easier.

I use 870s for defense here. I also use them for fun. I've shot thousands of rounds from them at sundry fast things from clays to landfill rats and know the platform like my tongue knows my teeth.

And I have out shot folks with high end shotguns using an 870, just not consistently. And my standard clay shooter these days is a well broken in Beretta O/U.

BTW, the folks with the high end, mission specific gamer guns are rarely snobs.

Mostly, the possession of same doesn't indicate snobbery but commitment...

In your shoes, I'd get a new or used 500 with choke tubes and go wear it out.

HTH....
Dave McC is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 05:25 PM   #38
mwar410
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 25, 2008
Location: maine
Posts: 234
buy a good semi-auto, 1100 have been proven, the 390's are nice and alot of shooters prefer them over the 391's (the real 390's), and the 391's are good guns. The 391's had a few bad years, but for the most part they are the standard in competition (as far as semi's)
Skeet is a game of perfection. there is alot to combine if your planning to be competetive, why complicate your learning process with shucking a pump. Some shooters are naturals but alot of us are not.
You'll be buying all kinds of guns once you start shooting more so you mine as well start with a semi. If you could get a 391 for $699 I'd buy it, ( I own 2 now).
mwar410 is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 05:27 PM   #39
mwar410
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 25, 2008
Location: maine
Posts: 234
i'm starting to not like posting and having to explain everyone of my opinions.
mwar410 is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 05:31 PM   #40
GunsAreGood
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 13, 2010
Posts: 300
Oneounceload

Quote:
Zippy makes excellent points about second shots. I have seen a few folks who can work a pump like it's a semi, but those folks are few and far between on the courses I frequent.

Trap singles notwithstanding, a pump CAN be used for skeet, trap doubles, and sporting, although it is, IMO, not the best choice for being successful.
You and zippy are completely correct in saying this. I did not consider that he would be shooting skeet and Trap doubles. I only shoot trap with my 870 so that is why I can compete with some of the guys with high end shotguns because I do not need a second shot.

Quote:
I prefer the O/U so I can utilize two different chokes as necessary.
I agree with this as well.
__________________
From my cold dead hands

If guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns
GunsAreGood is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 08:42 PM   #41
zippy13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 23, 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 6,408
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave McC
BTW, the folks with the high end, mission specific gamer guns are rarely snobs.
Mostly, the possession of same doesn't indicate snobbery but commitment…
Well said. Some of the nicest folks I know shoot with mission specific gamer guns.

I've made no secret that my favorite shotgun sport is Skeet. I've tried them all, and keep coming back to Skeet. In support of the sport, I try to encourage new shooters. At my club we dedicated a field for Skeet introduction. It included such things as hold point references (illegal in tournaments) foot positions painted on the pavement and graphics of the recommended leads at each presentation. These are basics that can be hard to learn if self-taught. I've coached new shooters who catch-on quickly with the single targets, but crash and burn at the double presentations because they're awkward shucking the cob. Rather than learning to pump proficiently or get an O/U or auto, they frequently just give up in frustration. Another potential Skeet enthusiast is lost to poor equipment selection. This is why I discourage pump guns for new shooters.
zippy13 is offline  
Old March 13, 2010, 08:55 PM   #42
krimmie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 11, 2007
Location: S. Florida
Posts: 166
Anyone new to skeet can request all singles(at least where I shoot); when ready for doubles, go with doubles on report.
krimmie is offline  
Old March 14, 2010, 12:34 PM   #43
crghss
Junior member
 
Join Date: July 1, 2008
Location: South Florida
Posts: 537
Use your pump...

First off Skeet and Trap are two different animals that use different shotgun setups. Trap usually is "28-30 bbls w/ Full-Improved Modified chokes and heavier gun then skeet. Skeet uses "26-28 bbls with Cylinder or Skeet chokes. Skeet to me is a faster environment...field guns usually make good skeet guns.

I bring this up because most people shoot one or the other. Maybe now a days more people do crossover but in general heavy shooters stick to one. As someone mentioned what is your goal.

I'd use your current shotgun and see which you like the most Skeet or Trap. Then start planning on what you'd need. It can get expense once you start shooting a 100 clays a day. So see if your in it for the long haul before you start laying out money for a shotgun setup for just Trap/Skeet.

Before you all flame me about your Cousin's girlfriends Dad's best friend that use a 28 ga "24 XX-Full-choke. I'm talking generalities here just getting the guy started with basic information. If someone addressed the differences between the two earlier I'm sorry for the dredging it up.

I guess nobody uses Double-barrels (SxS) anymore. My skeet gun was a Double-barrel in 16 ga no choke. Killed a lot of Clays & Grouse with that thing.

Last edited by crghss; March 14, 2010 at 12:44 PM.
crghss is offline  
Old March 14, 2010, 01:26 PM   #44
oneounceload
Junior member
 
Join Date: April 18, 2008
Location: N. Central Florida
Posts: 8,518
While my friend Zippy is a dyed-in-the-wool Skeeter, I am not - I love Sporting Clays and FITASC (Just shot a tournament this morning). I shoot a 32" 12 gauge O/U if I want my best scores, and a 30" 20 gauge O/U for my next best scores. We have many shooters that shoot this monthly event, and O/Us and semis are what you see, not pumps or SxS.

Two quick shots are more readily accomplished in those sports with the semi or O/U.
oneounceload is offline  
Old March 14, 2010, 04:09 PM   #45
zippy13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 23, 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 6,408
1-oz
A 32-inch barreled O/U for FITASC !? -- Is that typical these days, or are you a memeber of BigJimP's longer barrel brigade?
zippy13 is offline  
Old March 14, 2010, 04:18 PM   #46
oneounceload
Junior member
 
Join Date: April 18, 2008
Location: N. Central Florida
Posts: 8,518
Zippy - I have also used it from a low gun mount for skeet - works great. Our FITASC can have some targets that take a long time in flight and can still be out there a ways......
oneounceload is offline  
Old March 14, 2010, 04:33 PM   #47
hogdogs
Staff In Memoriam
 
Join Date: October 31, 2007
Location: Western Florida panhandle
Posts: 11,071
The Maverick 88 with 18 inch cyl barrel is as good as any P or K gun on the field and better than any auto loader ever built...

They are just misunderstood, under rated or over looked by all them snob elmer fudd types...

Okay that was a sarcastic joke and not meant to be taken seriously...

It is these type of posts that get a poster called out as not knowing guns much at all...
Brent
hogdogs is offline  
Old March 14, 2010, 04:43 PM   #48
zippy13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 23, 2008
Location: SoCal
Posts: 6,408
Brent, I just heard via my cousin's girlfriend's dad's best friend that the M-88 with the 18-inch cyl bore barrel has been banned from competition because it gives the shooter an unfair advantage over the P and K gun shooters. I checked Snopes, but they have nothing, have you heard anything to substantiate this?
zippy13 is offline  
Old March 14, 2010, 04:59 PM   #49
noyes
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 27, 2008
Posts: 1,032
It's starting to sound like the gun does it all and all by it's self. ?

No quality practice needed. ?

No commitment needed, blame the gun or ammo. ?

No shooter technique needed. ?

No skill development desired. ?

Last edited by noyes; March 14, 2010 at 05:08 PM.
noyes is offline  
Old March 14, 2010, 06:33 PM   #50
hogdogs
Staff In Memoriam
 
Join Date: October 31, 2007
Location: Western Florida panhandle
Posts: 11,071
Noyes, that is not the case at all... For instance I put junior onto the BMX track at age 4, I was low budget compared to many but at least he was on a job specific bike.

Those who showed up with a "Huffy" didn't stand a chance against the real race bike riders.

Just no way they could compete. No matter the practice or determination, a 20 pound bike with cheap bearings and the sort couldn't hang with a sub 12 pound bike with the skinny tires inflated to 110 psi rolling on sealed "abec 12" grade bearings.

Junior was on a highly modified (extensive drilling and other lightening work) entry level racer but he was competing against kids on $4,000 bikes made of titanium with carbon fiber forks and rims.

He still pulled off a second place season for his age for the entire state of florida.

Job specific is very helpful for the person to attain the best possible performance for their level of commitment. For a true test, take a single shot break barrel NEF to a doubles match and let me know how you do.

It ain't all about the gun but it ain't all about the shooter either.

Brent
hogdogs is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.13072 seconds with 7 queries