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Old January 27, 2010, 04:02 PM   #76
SPUSCG
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I was talking to someone who used to train police. They would be taught on the range to shoot center of mass on a paper target, so they stare at the x ring and shoot there. then they'd do live drills with those laundry detergent like rounds. During actual fireing on a live target the ahnd got hit a lot. After review it wa sdetermined that officers shoot at what there focused on, mentally they see a gun, and focus on the gun, and shoot at that, since its the center of their vision. It takes a lot of live training to train yourself to take eyes off the gun and onto the target, and most trainings on paper, not actual people.
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Old January 28, 2010, 02:01 AM   #77
Lost Sheep
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Shoot the basketball.

The actual center of mass on most human beings is right around hip level. That is simple physics.

The place I have been taught to shoot game animals is "in the basketball". This alludes to the thoracic cavity wherein the lungs, heart, and other organs are located, which, if hit, will bleed profusely and leave a good blood trail to follow and probably result in a swift and relatively humane death. Even if the first shot is not a one-shot kill, shoulder bones or foreleg bones, are sometimes broken, or spine disrupted, resulting in a slow-moving animal or a paralyzed one, for a safe and humane kill shot (or, in the case of a human, cessation of hostilities, medical attention, apprehension and prosecution). The "basketball" refers to the fact that in most deer-sized animals that mass of crucial organs is about the size and shape of a basketball. Shoot for the center of the basketball, and even of you are a bit off, you still hit something worth hitting.

If you are facing a human front-on, that "basketball" (more like a flattened soccer ball or oblate spheroid with the short axis pointed straight ahead) is where most of us have been discussing, pretty much right through the sternum, but if you are shooting at a person who is presenting his side to you, or from a low or high angle, you are well advised to picture that interior 3 dimensional mass and shoot for the center of that, not a two-dimensional target superimposed on your opponent.

Does picturing a 3-dimensional target help anyone focus better?

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Old January 28, 2010, 11:45 AM   #78
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Quote:
The actual center of mass on most human beings is right around hip level. That is simple physics.
We are ignoring the appendages.

It is not a physics problem.
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Old January 28, 2010, 08:45 PM   #79
biohazurd
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In most situations i would aim for center mass, but in a situation with a BUG of a smaller caliber .380-.22lr, at extremely short ranges I train with the crumpled weaver stance making shots to the face area, Eyes, nose, ect. to incapacitate the attacker and allow my self to escape to cover.
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Old January 29, 2010, 06:09 PM   #80
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Does everyone shoot center mass?
Yup.

Over and over, Til it stops being a threat or I run out of ammo. Under stress, I want the biggest target available.
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Old January 29, 2010, 07:33 PM   #81
Lawyer Daggit
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Problem with hand or limb shots are as follows:

You are deviating from training- this is a problem in a high stress situation and could be a problem afterward- Courts and Superiors may ask lots of questions about WHY.

Secondly bullet may miss a smaller target like a hand or limb or pass through it, ricochet and injure an innocent person.

Based on what I have read- and I have read widely in this area, and discussed it with an ex Aust SAS soldier, the preferred course seems to be a double tap to the chest and if there is still any sign of threat (esp in case the perp is wearing body armour and perhaps a bit stunned from the double impact but not really incapacitated) a slower more carefully aimed shot to the head aiming between the top of the top lip and the bottom of the nose- which would take out the brain stem.

The ex SAS soldier stressed the reason for this being that a handgun round, particularly one firing mil spec ammo does not have the stopping power to engage in any sort of 'fancy' shooting, esp in a high stress or CQB situation.
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Old January 30, 2010, 10:51 AM   #82
brickeyee
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more carefully aimed shot to the head aiming between the top of the top lip and the bottom of the nose- which would take out the brain stem.
Pretty tough with a handgun.

At Gunsite they taught to aim for the triangle formed by the two eyes and the tip of the nose.

This is a relatively open area in the skull, and penetration is liable to be better.

You do not need to hit the brain stem as long as you can get a bullet into the brain and produce some trauma, and driving a typical handgun caliber that precisely is not as high a probability event as a rifle round.


The CNS does not react well to trauma.

It took the army shooting cats in the head with a BB gun years ago to determine that respiration often stops following brain trauma, but that if artificial respiration is used to support the victim the brain could recover and breathing resume.

Before that research victims who stopped breathing after head injury were often considered dead on the spot.
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Old January 30, 2010, 12:07 PM   #83
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I was always taught to shoot center mass, in the army they taught us that if your enemy was wearing kevlar to drop it down and pop 2 in the pelvic region. In a home situation im aiming for your hat, Or any part avail. I mean hell, 3 9mm rounds to the shin and your not goin anywhere.

And FYI in "Harlem Nights" i believe it was the pinky toe, thats why she didn't go down.
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Last edited by SpookBoy; January 30, 2010 at 12:16 PM.
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