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Old January 1, 2010, 11:02 AM   #1
troy_mclure
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no firearms workplace rules

who works at a place that doesnt allow firearms on company property?

how does your situational awareness, and activities change during this time?

my work does not allow firearms on company property, mainly because of coast guard/DOT regulations.

i work on boats, and oil rigs in the gulf of Mexico, so when i show up for work ill be out for weeks, to months. i dont have to deal with the day to day hassle. but i often have to travel from .5-8hrs in a van to various ports.

im not a big fan of being unarmed in many of the places we stop for gas/food.

recently a van from another similar company was held up, and 8 guys robbed.

we have been stopping at better places, but in some areas there is only 1 place to stop, and shady is an understatement.
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Old January 1, 2010, 11:21 AM   #2
stephen426
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I guess one thing to do is limit your losses by carrying less cash. Credit cards can be cancelled and replaced very quickly. If you need to carry cash, there are many types of hidden pouches you can buy that would fit the bill (pun intended ). Situational awareness is always important and simply being aware can often prevent an attack since bad guys prefer easy targets. Direct eye contact and an air of confidence should keep all but the most determined bad guys away, especially if there are a lot of you guys. Are there any markings on the vans that would indicate they are transporting people to boats and oil rigs? Maybe the bad guys are catching on since they know you guys aren't allowed to carry weapons. In that case, I would suggest that the company use unmarked vans. Good luck!
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Old January 1, 2010, 11:32 AM   #3
mrnkc130
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My work also does not allow us to carry. Its not too bad for me because i work in a "hardened" building with doors you have to badge in and security portals, we also have our own police just down stairs that are armed. I still think it would be pretty easy for someone to gain access if they really wanted too but the company police would be on them within seconds, plus as long as i dont die i would probably get a hell of a settlement if i was shot, and if i did at least my family would, that eases some of the anxiety for me.
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Old January 1, 2010, 11:53 AM   #4
Ian0351
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I work in a psychiatric hospital which has a very strict no weapons policy... even folding pocket knives are verboten on the treatment floor. The crappy thing is when I'm walking to my car at 2330 and find former patients smoking meth in the back lot, relegating me to strictly hand to hand defensive measures... fortunately my considerable verbal skills(which is why I do what I do) are usually sufficient. They always seem to show up in the 30 minutes when security teams are changing over.
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Old January 1, 2010, 12:57 PM   #5
besafe2
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My current position is in an airport. Kinda says it all
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Old January 1, 2010, 12:59 PM   #6
glennv
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I'm a public high school teacher. Only the students are allowed to carry.
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Old January 1, 2010, 01:16 PM   #7
mnhntr
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Not supposed to but
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Old January 1, 2010, 01:27 PM   #8
smince
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I can have one in my vehicle, but not in the building.

I've gotten really good with my knives. I'd rather have a good blade than many pocket pistols on the market anyway.
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Old January 1, 2010, 01:43 PM   #9
Avenger
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My company does not permit firearms in or on company owned property. They don't actually own the parking lot we use, so...
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Old January 1, 2010, 02:31 PM   #10
hoytinak
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My work place has a no firearms on company property policy and all enterances are 30.06 (TX legal no carry sign) posted. There is armed security (which is my job there) and they are allowed to search any person/vehicle on company property. Every delivery truck gets searched, we've found many of truck drivers carrying and they have to clear it and leave with us while they make their delivery. As a CHL holder myself it sucks telling another CHL holder that they can't come inside our gate with a CCW.
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Old January 1, 2010, 03:45 PM   #11
Croz
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I work for a software company, and we have a "no weapons" policy as part of our "violence prevention program." So if someone decides to do the disgruntled employee thing, they apparently won't do it in our offices because we have a "no guns" policy and they could be fired for shooting people.

Not sure how that deters former employees, enraged spouses of a cheating employee, or just the general nutjob, since they can't be threatened with a firing for committing murder, but smarter people than I have apparently decided it does.

However, Florida law says they can't prevent me from having one in the car.

Other employees, not me of course, may decide to carry in deep concealment, figuring if they save their own life, they will risk getting fired over it. Just saying...
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Old January 1, 2010, 04:06 PM   #12
Glenn Dee
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The company I work for hs a strict NO FIREARMS policy. No firearms on company property, or in company owned vehicals. Violation of this policy MAY result in termination. The emphisis is on MAY terminate... Or they MAY do nothing. I drive a company owned vehical, so I'm not allowed to have any firearms in my possesion.

We provide service 24 hrs a day, 7 days a week. And we go into some pretty rough area's at all hours. In fact at one location one mechanic and helper was robbed of everything down to their skivies.

Having said all that... Of course I dont carry any firearms on my person or in my truck.
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Old January 1, 2010, 04:09 PM   #13
Glenn Dee
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I dont think these "NO FIREARMS POLICIES" have anything to do with safety. I truely believe that the employers are just reducing their exposure to lawsuits. Thats fine... I wonder how long they would last if people injured by criminal violence in the work place sued the employer's for failing to protect them, and not allowing them to protect themselves.
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Old January 1, 2010, 10:11 PM   #14
Sefner
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glennv
I'm a public high school teacher. Only the students are allowed to carry.
Haha I see what you did there.
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Old January 1, 2010, 10:14 PM   #15
Lokpyrite
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Yeah, it's pure "Don't sue us" rules, and I certainly hope folks sue their butts off the next time someone goes postal.
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Old January 1, 2010, 10:21 PM   #16
sonick808
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i work in a building peripheral to a large data center. Rumor has it there is a policy, but i've not been made aware of it.
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Old January 1, 2010, 11:58 PM   #17
Hook686
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Quote:
I dont think these "NO FIREARMS POLICIES" have anything to do with safety. I truely believe that the employers are just reducing their exposure to lawsuits. Thats fine... I wonder how long they would last if people injured by criminal violence in the work place sued the employer's for failing to protect them, and not allowing them to protect themselves.
Does the employer have a duty to protect an employee from a 'nut job' ?
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Old January 2, 2010, 09:37 AM   #18
w_houle
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Florida law says they can't prevent me from having one in the car.
So does Kansas, but that doesn't help me when I go on post.
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Old January 2, 2010, 10:03 AM   #19
youp
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Most places I work have a no firearms policy. Some even have a no ammunition policy. I generally can find one or two rounds for something in my vehicle, I give it a fairly thorough looking through when I hit those jobs. Some places will ban you for life at all of their plants if you are found with ammo or firearms.

Some jobs I stay away from. It is not too hard to tell a construction worker. And if the job is 6 or 7 days a week, all the bad guys know when pay day is and they probably know your take home pay too.
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Old January 2, 2010, 11:00 AM   #20
Croz
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Quote:
I don't think these "NO FIREARMS POLICIES" have anything to do with safety. I truly believe that the employers are just reducing their exposure to lawsuits.
I agree completely. They have nothing to do with safety, it's just the standard boilerplate crap that employers put in employee policy manuals. But the irony still exists, since my employer has the 'no weapons' policy as part of their violence prevention program.

And an employer has no obligation to protect me from nutjobs normally. That's my job. But when they prohibit me from protecting myself through a weapons ban, does that mean they take that responsibility on themselves, since they prevent me from doing it?
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Old January 2, 2010, 11:36 AM   #21
J.Netto
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Where I work, I am not allowed to have a Firearm on me while on company time. They also have a company " Policy " that states I am not even allowed to have a firearm locked in my car, while working.

But, Kentucky state law says I can have a firearm in my car, and no company policy shall keep me from doing so. So, yes - I keep a handgun secured in the car, while working.

I feel like this - Basically, since they are telling me I am not allowed to carry while working - to me, that means they are telling me they will protect me, and will not put me in harms way. Yeah right!

If anything ever happens, and I live through it......Lawsuit!

The only time I'm disarmed is when I'm working. And I just don't think it's fair.

Quote:
But when they prohibit me from protecting myself through a weapons ban, does that mean they take that responsibility on themselves, since they prevent me from doing it?
That's exactly what it should mean.
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Old January 2, 2010, 12:38 PM   #22
Hook686
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If anything ever happens, and I live through it......Lawsuit!
Well I figure if you got the money a lawyer might take the case, as they need to earn a living also. I wonder if a lawyer would take such a case on a contingency basis. Any thoughts ?
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Old January 5, 2010, 12:50 PM   #23
Daugherty16
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Just empty language

It's not about liability, it's about insurance costs, control, and politics. They put it in their manual, it makes the insurers happy, the managers think they're forcing the workplace to be "safer", and there are actually a large number of people (sheep - in denial) who think it will do exactly that.

We know the truth. No "policy" would stop a person deranged enough to shoot up a workplace, any more than a "No Guns" sign will stop a robber or rapist or murderer. Actually having a co-worker with a CCW would, to me, make the workplace more safe.

And while possible that a jury may find your employer deprived you of your right to self defense with firearms, thus took on liability and responsibility for your safety, that will be of little consolation to your survivors as they visit your grave. Remember that even the police do not have responsibility for your safety.

I work in a very "hard" building - the Javits Federal Building in NYC. FBI, Secret Service, FPS, ICE, lots of guns in the building with supposedly trained users. No CCW. Also i cross from CT (Resident CCW) into NY (no non-res permit issued) and into NYC (almost no permits issued, period, except to friends of the mayor) so i have to lock it in my truck safe, and go naked on public transportation. But i don't have to pass a magnetometer, so i could carry to my hearts content as long as it is deeply concealed. I won't, but the realization is that a disgruntled employee could pack an arsenal into a brief case and just waltz into the building. Head up to Social Security, say, and let 'er rip.

Despite there being hundreds, if not more, armed LEOs in the building, there is absolutely NOTHING they do under current access policy that could prevent such a tragedy. Except mop up the blood and pick up the larger pieces afterward. Even here, my security and defense is still my own responsibility, but they've totally disarmed me. Not being willing to violate state and federal law, i comply. Baaaa.
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Old January 5, 2010, 01:10 PM   #24
teeroux
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Quote:
Does the employer have a duty to protect an employee from a 'nut job' ?
If their policy prevents you from protecting yourself they derned well do.
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Old January 5, 2010, 02:25 PM   #25
raftman
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I work at a place with a strict "no guns" policy. Each entrance is marked and all that. If you do have a concealed-carry gun coming in to work, you must check it in to security. It's quite a hassle, and one has to come early and stay late just to get disarmed, which is why I don't bring a gun to work to begin with. I honor company policy because having a job is extremely important, I just wish the company had a more sensible policy.

We do have a security force of sorts, but they're not armed and seem to be more concerned with issuing warnings for parking where you shouldn't. I don't leave a gun locked in the car either, as the facility I work at is in a very bad part of town. In my department alone, I know of 4 instances of cars being stolen within the last 8 years or so and at least 3 break-ins within the last year alone (which by the way, also speaks to the effectiveness of our security). So I figure the odds of the gun getting stolen are too elevated to risk leaving it in the car. They can steal the stereo or the whole car, insurance will cover it, and I can replace it. At least they won't do much harm with a stolen stereo, a stolen gun on the other hand.

Last year, at one of our other branches, a crazed gunman barged in and shot a couple of people and then himself. It's tragic. It does seem to illustrate that to the crazy guy with evil on his mind and a rifle in his hands, the sign means nothing, it is to the people who aren't allowed to defend themselves from the crazy guy that the sign is of consequence.

How does working in such a place change my situational awareness? I don't know that it does. I don't think I'm more cautious, or more aware of my surroundings when I am not allowed to carry. I guess, that's because "Plan A" for a self-defense situation has always been to flee and get away from the attacker if at all possible. That is flight rather than fight. It's only for if evasion isn't possible, and fighting off the attacker isn't possible, that I have a CHL. So at work, I guess I only have Plan A as an option. Sucks I guess, but then I get in a car and drive just about every single day and don't think much about the dangers of that.
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