Pinned flash hider--status while building?

glockopop · November 19, 2009, 02:20 AM

I've seen uppers, barrels, and rifles before that are 14.5" with a pinned 1.5" flash hider that are considered 16" barrels because the flash hider is permanently attached for a total length of 16". My question is, if I were to do this myself, would the gun technically be illegal after it's been cut but before the flash hider's been pinned? If so, would I have to send it somewhere and get that done?

Willie Lowman · November 19, 2009, 12:08 PM

If the barrel is not on the rifle, it is just a barrel.

However possessing a short barrel and a gun that it could go on with no NFA paperwork is constructive possession (illegal).

While I think you could do what you are talking about legally, it seems you are treading on dangerous ground.

I would just buy a upper that has the 14.5" barrel and hider pinned on and sell the old 16" upper you are looking to cut.

espnazi · November 19, 2009, 02:00 PM

Wait isn't the legal length 18 inches?

robfromga · November 19, 2009, 02:10 PM

^^^

Not on a rifle, 16"

HiBC · November 22, 2009, 08:32 AM

If you do it yourself1)realize "blind pin" has a whole other definition to the BATF than it does to a machinist. found that out by calling the BATF office of firearms technology.

After you lock it on with a blind pin,you must weld over the end of the pin,then dress it off so the weld can't be seen,to prevent "drilling it out"

I'm not suggesting it makes sense,I'm just reporting.

Don't forget to stack all the parts on the barrel,like the gas block/sight,or anything else that won't go over the muzzle device.

Just me,but I cannot comprehend the advantage of a 14 in bbl if you have to stick a pickle on it and make it 16

Chipperman · November 27, 2009, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Wait isn't the legal length 18 inches?

That's for Shotgun

LukeA · November 27, 2009, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Wait isn't the legal length 18 inches?

It used to be (for rifles), but then the powers that be decided a few million M1 carbines with 16 in. barrels were worth more to the government as cash after being sold to the public, and that that would be much easier if they weren't NFA items, so they changed the law.

RAnb · November 28, 2009, 10:20 AM

Quote:

However possessing a short barrel and a gun that it could go on with no NFA paperwork is constructive possession (illegal).

Not always. I have never read about anyone being convicted for merely owning Thompson Center pistol and rifle barrels without a registered SBR.

Ranb

Willie Lowman · November 28, 2009, 04:03 PM

If you own a Thompson/Center rifle and have some pistol barrels but no pistol you are guilty of this thought crime.

I don't think they have gone after anyone with a T/C on this issue but that doesn't change the fact that people have been arrested for having a stock or vertical grip that could go on a SP 89 or AR15 pistol.

The feds are not kicking in doors to measure barrels. However, every once in a while someone gets popped for this BS

It is a retarded law. I am not going to argue about it in this tread.

Bill DeShivs · November 28, 2009, 06:15 PM

"It used to be (for rifles), but then the powers that be decided a few million M1 carbines with 16 in. barrels were worth more to the government as cash after being sold to the public, and that that would be much easier if they weren't NFA items, so they changed the law."

I have heard this for 35 years, but I have never seen GI carbine with less than a 16" barrel. LukeA, can you shed any light?

LukeA · November 28, 2009, 08:38 PM

The way I understand it is that the NFA originally had jurisdiction over both rifle and shotgun barrels of less than 18 inches. M1 carbines have 16 in barrels, and would have been NFA items, and as such would have been very difficult to sell as surplus, so the NFA was amended so M1 carbines were removed from NFA jurisdiction. I don't really know more than that, and I can't easily verify it either.

Technosavant · December 7, 2009, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Just me,but I cannot comprehend the advantage of a 14 in bbl if you have to stick a pickle on it and make it 16

Because usually a 16" bbl isn't naked- there's a flash suppressor or compensator on there anyway, so overall length is closer to 17-18". With a 14.5" bbl and a pinned muzzle device, it takes the overall length down an inch and a half, giving slightly better maneuverability in short quarters. On the AR-15 it also eases things for the carbine length gas system, as the 16" bbl and the short gas system tends to result in rather strong ejection.

Skans · December 7, 2009, 03:57 PM

I'm just currious - other than "looks", is there any real reason to have a 14" barrel over a 16" barrel?

November 19, 2009, 02:20 AM	#1
glockopop Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2005 Location: Southern Indiana Posts: 922	Pinned flash hider--status while building? I've seen uppers, barrels, and rifles before that are 14.5" with a pinned 1.5" flash hider that are considered 16" barrels because the flash hider is permanently attached for a total length of 16". My question is, if I were to do this myself, would the gun technically be illegal after it's been cut but before the flash hider's been pinned? If so, would I have to send it somewhere and get that done? __________________ I've only got two hands, but I've been known to carry three Glocks. RZA

November 19, 2009, 12:08 PM	#2
Willie Lowman Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2009 Location: Uh-Hi-O Posts: 1,947	If the barrel is not on the rifle, it is just a barrel. However possessing a short barrel and a gun that it could go on with no NFA paperwork is constructive possession (illegal). While I think you could do what you are talking about legally, it seems you are treading on dangerous ground. I would just buy a upper that has the 14.5" barrel and hider pinned on and sell the old 16" upper you are looking to cut. __________________ "No, it's not a silencer. This little doodad is my own invention. I call it a loudener." --Sledge Hammer

November 28, 2009, 06:15 PM	#10
Bill DeShivs Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 6,479	"It used to be (for rifles), but then the powers that be decided a few million M1 carbines with 16 in. barrels were worth more to the government as cash after being sold to the public, and that that would be much easier if they weren't NFA items, so they changed the law." I have heard this for 35 years, but I have never seen GI carbine with less than a 16" barrel. LukeA, can you shed any light? __________________ Bill DeShivs www.billdeshivs.com

November 19, 2009, 02:00 PM	#3
espnazi Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Posts: 256	Wait isn't the legal length 18 inches?

November 19, 2009, 02:10 PM	#4
robfromga Senior Member Join Date: January 9, 2009 Location: Augusta, Ga Posts: 240	^^^ Not on a rifle, 16"

November 22, 2009, 08:32 AM	#5
HiBC Senior Member Join Date: November 13, 2006 Posts: 3,053	If you do it yourself1)realize "blind pin" has a whole other definition to the BATF than it does to a machinist. found that out by calling the BATF office of firearms technology. After you lock it on with a blind pin,you must weld over the end of the pin,then dress it off so the weld can't be seen,to prevent "drilling it out" I'm not suggesting it makes sense,I'm just reporting. Don't forget to stack all the parts on the barrel,like the gas block/sight,or anything else that won't go over the muzzle device. Just me,but I cannot comprehend the advantage of a 14 in bbl if you have to stick a pickle on it and make it 16

November 28, 2009, 04:03 PM	#9
Willie Lowman Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2009 Location: Uh-Hi-O Posts: 1,947	If you own a Thompson/Center rifle and have some pistol barrels but no pistol you are guilty of this thought crime. I don't think they have gone after anyone with a T/C on this issue but that doesn't change the fact that people have been arrested for having a stock or vertical grip that could go on a SP 89 or AR15 pistol. The feds are not kicking in doors to measure barrels. However, every once in a while someone gets popped for this BS It is a retarded law. I am not going to argue about it in this tread.

November 28, 2009, 08:38 PM	#11
LukeA Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2009 Posts: 542	The way I understand it is that the NFA originally had jurisdiction over both rifle and shotgun barrels of less than 18 inches. M1 carbines have 16 in barrels, and would have been NFA items, and as such would have been very difficult to sell as surplus, so the NFA was amended so M1 carbines were removed from NFA jurisdiction. I don't really know more than that, and I can't easily verify it either.

December 7, 2009, 03:57 PM	#13
Skans Senior Member Join Date: November 20, 2008 Posts: 6,362	I'm just currious - other than "looks", is there any real reason to have a 14" barrel over a 16" barrel?