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Old September 16, 2009, 06:47 PM   #26
hogdogs
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dragon, on the flip side, there is just a little euro blood in our wild hogs. Our oldest feral stock was the smaller black spanish hogs from as early as DeLeon. the modern domestic breeds we see evidence of here in the deep south is Hampshire (white shoulder band), Duroc (very red) and some that throw a bluish colored hue to the hair and the black breeds.
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Old September 16, 2009, 06:52 PM   #27
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with the dogs, we usually get on more than trying to spot them to shoot them... It is the fact that it is so thick where the hogs live that make the dogs useful. Then we have to head in like banshees through it.
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Old September 16, 2009, 07:02 PM   #28
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hogdogs.... the tusks?

Also, according to my son (has a degree in genetics and biochemistry) a hog is a hog is a hog.... but he has no answer about the tusks. I guess it's because the wild hogs have to work harder for their food???? I know when dad and I raised a few hogs years ago... none ever had tusks.

On all those breeds you talked about........ a looong time ago when I was in high school in ag class I knew all the hog breeds and what were the pros and cons of each.
I do remember as 2damn was referring that some were larders, some for bacon, etc.

ANd on eating meat.... I tried a lot... and I've never found anything better than good pork prepared properly. About the only meat that you don't have to season to death to make it taste good......................
even if they were run off the cliff in the bible.
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Old September 16, 2009, 07:02 PM   #29
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Stew

I actually love pig's feet stew with white rice.
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Old September 16, 2009, 07:33 PM   #30
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With our farm pigs, we would "break the teeth and dock the tails" at a few days old...
I strongly feel genetics plays a large role in "cutters" We run into pockets with long thin daggers, long thick cutters, short thin razor blades and short fat teeth...
As the feral hogs develop long snouts just a few generations after becoming feral, it may lend it self to teeth growth, The tusks and wetters are both continuous growth so possibly the sort wide skull of a barnyard pig may not lend itself as well to fast tusk growth. Google "feral hog skull" and select images for decent view.
This is only my redneck guessing opinion and not backed in science as far as I know.
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Old September 16, 2009, 07:59 PM   #31
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I read someplace once that if dogs were left to do their own mate selection and man stayed totally out of the picture, over time they would slowly become what most of us would call a mongrel or a mut. If I remember correctly this would be a dog of medium build, 40 to 60 pounds, and it would have relatively short hair, mostly brown in color.

Now I don't know if this was correct but the theory was that this is in general the most adaptive configeration for the average dog. In truth not a whole lot different from a coyote.

If that's even close to correct, and if we were to allow the same to happen to the hogs, are we going to get something that is almost a exact copy of a European boar? Or is there some other ancestor that will muddle the picture?

And as the European boar seems to thrive even in the cold regions, surviving snow and the like, does that mean that if allowed without a infusion of new blood that eventually we would have such all over North America?

I know from hunting Ossabaw Island, which is in Savannah harbor off the Georgia coast that if left with no new blood, which on the island they have not had for generations, they start to look & behave very different.

The hogs up there would sort of graze or browse the grass at times, almost like a deer or goat. And they would build very large nests, not the little things we find in the woods here but big things. And they were almost all black with long legs and long hair and no fat and......well you get the picture.
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Old September 16, 2009, 08:03 PM   #32
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bswiv, There are already huntable populations in Ohio and michigan...
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Old September 16, 2009, 08:06 PM   #33
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This stuff is just fascinating. I almost wish we had them in NY. ALMOST...

I remember as a kid visiting my family in Italy, and there was a large pig in a cinder block pen. Being a 7 year old kid I naturally wanted to feed it, but there was nothing around except dirt and the pen. So I broke off a clump of mortar that was sticking out between the blocks and tossed it into the pen, more just to interact with it than anything else.

And would you believe that the pig actually ATE the piece of cement?? Chomp chomp chomp!! And then looked at me as if to ask "got any more?"

That sure left an impression on me...three decades later it's still fresh in my memory.
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Old September 16, 2009, 08:15 PM   #34
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With enough Ketchup, a person could eat about anything. Having lived on a farm watching hogs fight over the contents of a fresh cow pie, the thought of where those feet have been is more powerful than my appetite.
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Old September 16, 2009, 08:25 PM   #35
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Never had pigs feet. Couldn't ever get passed the fat and the hoof (big friggin' toenail), along with a little hair.

I was raised on just about everything else, tho... Squirrel, rabbit, raccoon, shrimp, crawfish, crabs (hardshell and softshell), oysters, fish of ALL kind, wild pork (meat!), venison... You name it...just no pig feet.
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Old September 16, 2009, 09:24 PM   #36
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Going farther south than hogdogs;

Our original stock was also from the Spaniards in the 1500's. Later the domestics were brought over, many escaped and inter-bred. In the late 1800's sport hunting for them started and the stories begin to pile up. Imported Russian boars, Razorbacks (may be the same thing) but size and ugly disposition seem to underscore the imports.

Interbreeding is definitely in a hogs gameplan so you never know what you will run into. I have developed one that applies to weapon kills in MY area and may well not apply to your area or if you use dogs and time.

I'm headed out Sat. morn. with dogs.
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Old September 16, 2009, 09:24 PM   #37
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http://www.cambridge.org/us/books/kiple/hogs.htm

Weight- and cholesterol-conscious consumers in Europe and North America have had an impact on the pork industry (Bichard and Bruce 1989). Consumer demand calls for leaner cuts, including substantial fat trimming, in supermarket meat cases. There is also a strong motivation to develop hog breeds with less fat in their muscle tissue, which normally has 5 to 7 percent fat. Pork fat is higher in unsaturated fatty acids than beef, veal, or lamb fat. On the average, one 85-gram serving of pork contains about 79 milligrams of cholesterol.

I prefer the feral hog that hasn't been engineered to have low fat in the muscle tissue.
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Old September 17, 2009, 05:59 AM   #38
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Quote:
2old... No actually farm pigs are intentionally fattened for higher weight on the sale barn scale and juicier meat. Wild swine is VERY lean and will dry out and toughen if over cooked even the least little bit...
Hardly any fat.

Not always. Some of the hogs in this area are very fat, especially in a year when there are lots of acorns and/or pecans. This hog was so fat that globules of the stuff came out when I washed him out with a hose. The bacon on this boar was 3" thick-all fat.
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Old September 17, 2009, 07:40 AM   #39
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Here's a good article on the differences between modern pork breeds and the old fashioned ones: http://www.cooksillustrated.com/imag...BuyingPork.pdf
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Old September 17, 2009, 04:06 PM   #40
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I'm glad this thread is still goin'.........

hogdogs you have quite a bit of knowledge about hogs...........

Mostly I just know I like to eat them very much.

On the posts concerning different looks in different parts of the country........... out in Cherokee lake here there is an island inhabited exclusively by a bunch of pot bellied Vietnamese pigs. Last time I heard about them they get fed pretty regularly by the boaters........ fishermen and campers. Obviously there has had to be inbreeding because I understand folks have counted as many as 40 as they pass by. They are pretty skittish and run off usually when someone beaches their boat.
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Old September 17, 2009, 05:44 PM   #41
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Always figured that was coyote food along with the gut sack!
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Old September 17, 2009, 05:57 PM   #42
hogdogs
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Likely as few as 2 or 3 created that population... A pot belly will grow some nasty long sharp tusks if allowed to. I seen a pet p-belly boar with 5 inch swords sticking out of his mouth...
I did a little pig farming as a boy. We bought 3 tri-color sows to add to our program and all we knew them as was "texas pigs"... The way they destroyed their young and behaved, I am positive we got suckered into buying wild pigs. The wild sows will kill their young under high stress.
The rest I learned first hand or researching to be a better trapper and hunter. Seen some odd things doing this, bullets, shot and even a 2.5-3 inch 4 blade broadhead in their shields...
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Old September 17, 2009, 06:11 PM   #43
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So they really do have a shield, huh? I have heard some people swear it was true, others say it was a myth, but I do recall seeing the pic you posted of it...

I am going to have to pull up lots of pics on google
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Old September 17, 2009, 06:18 PM   #44
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Scrap, I have posted a pic several times a buddy took if a cross section with a centerfire rifle round as a size reference... The shield is as thick as the round is tall It is tusk armor for boar on boar fights... Thus the reason we put 4 layer vests on our dogs... outer layers are heavy ballistic nylon and the inners are kevlar There is no blood in the tissue, it is ivory white. The arrow head could have been sharpened and reused... No rust etc.
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Old September 17, 2009, 06:25 PM   #45
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Yup, that's the pic I saw you post...amazing. Is it just on their sides, or also in front?
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Old September 17, 2009, 06:31 PM   #46
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Just from the spine to the bottom of the shoulder on the side...
Front "stick" is the "butcher's" point to insert the knife to dispatch a hog, I go in the "armpit" as my luck has put my fingers in their mouth too many times...
YES THEY CLAMP DOWN LIKE A BULLDOG!!!
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