The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Hunt

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old September 10, 2009, 10:48 AM   #26
Art Eatman
Staff Lead
 
Join Date: November 13, 1998
Location: Terlingua, TX, USA
Posts: 22,035
Back in my younger and healthier daze, I figured that inside of 500 yards with my '06, whatever was out there belonged to me. I killed just as many whitetail with my .243, but I wasn't as ambitious about distance.

For mulies, my own preference is for a bit more Thump! than a .243. So, anything above a .243 for bullet weight, up to an '06, oughta do just fine for any deer in the lower 48.

FWIW...
__________________
You're from BATFE? Come right in! I use all your fine products!
Art Eatman is offline  
Old September 17, 2009, 07:17 PM   #27
James R. Burke
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 3, 2009
Location: U.P. of Mich/Quinnesec
Posts: 1,897
Just myself I have lived and hunted whitetail in Michigan all my life. My favorite all time set up is the Ruger No. 1 A light sporter in 30-06 with a Leupold 3x9x40mm limited century scope, using my loads. Laupa brass, CCI-large rifle primer, Nosler Partition 165 grain bullet, with IMR-4350 at 3097 f.p.s. five shot average. It will shoot 3/4" at 100 yards all day long if I do my part. My wife has the exact same set up only in a .243 same weight scope etc, except for the caliber. She only takes well placed shots or lets them walk using a much differnt load of course, but she is using the Nosler 100 grain partition. Her first time out she shot at two deer and dropped them both right were they stood. But my favorite is no doubt the 30-06 for deer. That is just me, for deer there are alot of great calibers, 30-30., .270, 7mm mag, and the list goes on. I guess it comes down to what you like, and can handle the best. Shot placement is key no matter what you have, and being a good sportsperson leaving some walk away is the hardest thing to do but the right thing to do.
James R. Burke is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 08:47 AM   #28
JKump
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 30, 1998
Location: Middle Georgia
Posts: 422
I've killed plenty of deer with no complaints with the 308.
__________________
Live everyday as if it is your last! Because someday you will be right.

"Everyone has a game plan until they get punched in the mouth".
JKump is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 08:59 AM   #29
GeauxTide
Senior Member
 
Join Date: April 20, 2009
Location: Helena, AL
Posts: 3,038
Hmmmmmm....

Being a respectable Rifle Loony, I own a 260, 6.5-06, 280, 7mmRM, 308, 30-06, and 338-06. My current choices are: Woods - 260 Ruger SS Compact. Fields - 280 Ruger SS Hawkeye. For your purposes, and come to the point, I haven't seen any difference in killing power between the 7mmRM, 308, or 30-06, using standard soft points. Get the 308 in a 24" barrel.
GeauxTide is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 09:40 AM   #30
A_Gamehog
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 9, 2009
Location: Central Oregun
Posts: 556
30-06 or .270

270 or a 30-06 would do quite nicely on any deer anywhere.

If I only had the money for one it would be the 30-06 though. 1903-A3

with a 3lb Timmney trigger. 3X9 Nikon scope good for anything to 400 yards.

Just my 2 cents...
__________________
"Happiness is knowing the Barred Owl is Eating the Spotted Owl and environmentalists are watching Nature take it's course"
A_Gamehog is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 10:14 AM   #31
Christchild
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 19, 2009
Location: Loadbenchville, Bolt 02770
Posts: 537
.270 Winchester

.270 Winchester is my #1 pick, but .243 Win., .257 Roberts, .25/06 Rem., .260 Rem., 7mm-08, .308 Win. 30/06 Sprg. are ALL suitable and highly effective Deer Cartridges.

I personally tend to stay away from most Magnum, Short Magnum or Super Short Magnum because of the "Barrel Burner" aspect, as I've heard quite a bit on that (most hunters never burn barrels, though), along with the extra recoil, and cost.

Always consider the fact that You're hunting WhiteTail and Mule Deer (not widebeest, buffalo and lion), and unless You're making very long shots most of the time, any of the above Cartridges are fantastic.

I agree with a previous poster, a 3x-9x scope is sufficient also.

I prefer .270 Win over 30/06 Sprg. The 30/06 has ALOT over the .270... .308" bullets are more available in more Brands/Styles/Weights than ANY other caliber, and any company that makes brass, makes 30-06, and a wide range of bullet weights is useful.
Comparing .277" bullets and .308" bullets, the .308" is larger diameter, and if You compared a 150 grain .277" bullet to a 150 grain .308" bullet, at the same velocity, the .308" will transfer more energy due to the diameter, more "knock down" power... BUT, "Knock Down" power (foot pounds of energy) are not the only aspect in a bullets killing power. Bullet construction/performance and shot placement are #1.

The .270 Win. is generally a 30/06 necked down to .270 caliber. Slightly less bullet diameter, in most cases less recoil (in similar rifle and bullet weight), in most cases Flatter Trajectory, and PLENTY killing power.

And, it's a Classic American cartridge.

I would LOVE to see a .270/08. I know someone did it as a wildcat, but I'd like to see that one commercialized, so guys like me can use the same bullets in a smaller cartridge (bigger and more potent than 6.8 SPC) for my son to use.
__________________
***If the Ignorant say to You, "The Soul dies like the Body", reply to them, "The Flower dies but the Seeds remain"...* That is a Law of God.
***Mighty Pleasant, don't You think...?
Christchild is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 11:12 AM   #32
mpd61
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 7, 2009
Location: Central Mass
Posts: 348
Want some factual cynicysm?

I would LOVE to see a .270/08. I know someone did it as a wildcat, but I'd like to see that one commercialized, so guys like me can use the same bullets in a smaller cartridge (bigger and more potent than 6.8 SPC) for my son to use.

With the .260 Remington on the left, and the 7mm-08 on the right, such a cartridge would be rather gay!
mpd61 is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 11:21 AM   #33
ZeroJunk
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 14, 2006
Location: Browns Summit NC
Posts: 2,461
270 Win
ZeroJunk is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 05:54 PM   #34
Christchild
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 19, 2009
Location: Loadbenchville, Bolt 02770
Posts: 537
I don't think it would be gay, Bro. It's got a close competitor on both sides, yes, but I'd bet my next crawfish boil, that it would quickly come alive if commercialized.

And like I said, it would let guys like me use the same bullets that are used in my .270 win. Plus, being a young boy, my son (along with many other son's) would think it was cool using the same bullets Dad uses...

Same camo....same boots....similar rifle....same bullets....sittin' in the same spot...see the deer at the same time.... Father and Son... That, is a Huntin' Buddy.
__________________
***If the Ignorant say to You, "The Soul dies like the Body", reply to them, "The Flower dies but the Seeds remain"...* That is a Law of God.
***Mighty Pleasant, don't You think...?

Last edited by Christchild; September 18, 2009 at 07:49 PM.
Christchild is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 06:06 PM   #35
fisherman66
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 22, 2005
Location: Rhome, TX
Posts: 4,641
Quote:
I would LOVE to see a .270/08. I know someone did it as a wildcat, but I'd like to see that one commercialized, so guys like me can use the same bullets in a smaller cartridge (bigger and more potent than 6.8 SPC) for my son to use.

With the .260 Remington on the left, and the 7mm-08 on the right, such a cartridge would be rather gay!
I have seen 270-.308 dies. I also watched a such chambered rifle sell yesterday.

I suppose our new guy is an expert on all things gay. I don't see how it can be any "gayer" than the long action equivalents.
__________________
la plus belle des ruses du diable est de vous persuader qu'il n'existe pas!
fisherman66 is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 07:14 PM   #36
Christchild
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 19, 2009
Location: Loadbenchville, Bolt 02770
Posts: 537
Fisherman66... At's a Roger!
__________________
***If the Ignorant say to You, "The Soul dies like the Body", reply to them, "The Flower dies but the Seeds remain"...* That is a Law of God.
***Mighty Pleasant, don't You think...?
Christchild is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 08:37 PM   #37
Snakum
Member
 
Join Date: August 26, 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 84
So it's official, then? The 30-06 is the "best" all around deer cartridge? I gotta git me one 'a them. Mebe a 7600?

Actually, I'm thinking the 30-06 is probably one of the most versatile rounds, there are so many different factory loads for it you could hunt chucks long range, our little southeastern whitetails, big mulies out west, or black bear in New England. A 7600 in 30-06 with a good red dot system might be one of the best all around critter killers. I had one in .270 with an old Bushnell 6x on hi-rise mounts allowing use of the sights. Never hunted with it but I bet it would have been a great deer rifle for close snap shots or longer range shots with the scope. I liked the way the gun balanced and it was fast on target.
__________________
Malfunction drills? I run Glocks and AKs so I don't have to bother with that stuff.
Snakum is offline  
Old September 18, 2009, 10:32 PM   #38
Colorado Redneck
Senior Member
 
Join Date: January 6, 2008
Location: Northeast Colorado
Posts: 986
From the Utah Division of Wildlife Resources

Rocky Mountain mule deer stand three to three and a
half feet tall at the shoulder, with bucks (males) usually
weighing 125 to 250 pounds, though some may weigh as
much as 400 pounds. Does (females) usually weigh between
100 and 150 pounds.

It would seem that we are talking about shooting an animal that is about the same size as a human. So a canon wouldn't be necessary to do away with one.

My vote is for a 25-06 with the Nosler 110 gr. accubond loaded at 3160 fps.

Any thing from a 243 up to a 308 would be fine. Bullet selection is important.

The first mule deer I killed was a nice healthy 3 X 3 at about 200 paces (Dad stepped it off) with a 25-35 model 94 lever Winchester. Went right down. We lived in the boonies in NW Colorado and the staute of limitations has hopefully run out. But all i am saying is, it doesn't take a lot to bring down a deer.
Colorado Redneck is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 12:55 PM   #39
Deerhunter264
Member
 
Join Date: April 6, 2008
Posts: 82
i choose the .243 winchester. It is an accurate round and it is and easy shooting gun. It has hardly any recoil and it is big enough to kill any deer out ther. What is the point in shooting a deer which can be killed with a small easy shooting .243 with a 300 winchester or another big caliber like that. I think that a deer is not going to know the differencce between being shot by a .243 or 300 win mag if it is being shot in a avital area.
Deerhunter264 is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 12:56 PM   #40
Old Grump
Member in memoriam
 
Join Date: April 9, 2009
Location: Blue River Wisconsin, in
Posts: 3,144
Quote:
What would yall say is the best deer round out there?
Simple straightforward question designed perfectly to elicit many and varied opinions according to whats in the nimrods gun rack or tops on his wish list. However the correct answer is a round of boilermakers using Colt 45 malt liquor and a shot of Jack Daniels black. After 2 rounds he will follow you back to camp and if you can get 3 rounds in him the meat will be pre-marinated.
__________________
Good intentions will always be pleaded for any assumption of power. The Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern will, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters.
--Daniel Webster--
Old Grump is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 12:59 PM   #41
roy reali
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 23, 2005
Posts: 3,248
(D) None Of The Above

The best deer round is the round being used by the best deer hunter.
roy reali is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 02:43 PM   #42
Daryl
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 11, 2008
Posts: 2,350
Quote:
The best deer round is the round being used by the best deer hunter.
I'd have to disagree.

The correct answer is: It depends.

How do you hunt? If you hunt from a stand placed in heavy timber where shots are short, a handy little levergun in .357 mag, 30/30, .44 mag, or .45 Colt would work about as well as anything else. In addition, the pistol cartridges tend to not shoot as far, so hitting yonder farmhouse isn't as much of an issue. For that use, they'd be "the best" IMO, and I'd prefer open sights.

If you're hunting the Colorado Rockies, the 30/30 isn't going to do as well if you have to shoot across a canyon at a big mule deer buck. Forget the pistol cartridges for such a thing. In this country, the 30-06, .308, 7mm-08, 7mm mag, and others are the rule rather than the exception; and a good scope is not considered optional by most who hunt this kind of country.

Here in the Arizona desert, any of the above might do pretty well. Coues deer aren't hard to kill, and they can be hunted in some places where still hunting/stalking are good options. A light weight rifle is good, because you'll likely climb up in the higher country for a good vantage point to glass from. Most like cartridges that push bullets faster rather than slower, but big killing power isn't all that necessary.

Heck, even our desert mule deer only average about 140 lbs or so, and top out a little over 200 lbs. In this country, the .243 might work as well as the 7mm mag for most shots. The 7mm mag and similar cartridges will give the possibility of longer shots to hunters/shooters capable of it, but most of the time it's really not necessary.

I'm still deciding whether to use the 7mm mag or my .243 this year. If I use the 7mm mag, it'll be because it's lighter to carry. I haven't shot a deer with my .243 in several years, so I'm tempted to take it instead. It's a fun little rifle to shoot, and it's very accurate as well.

The best? It depends on your likes, dislikes, needs, and capabilities. There is no "one size fits all" answer to this one.

Daryl

Last edited by Daryl; September 19, 2009 at 02:49 PM.
Daryl is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 03:22 PM   #43
rbb50
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 2, 2008
Location: Deep in the Heart of Texas
Posts: 169
Look at the ballistics and energy from a 7mm-08 and I believe you will find just as I did it beats the 30-06 and passes it at about 250 yards and beats the 243 hands down along with being the best over all rifle for any north American game

Even the 7mm mag is just a slight above it and is not even worth it when comparing recoil and muzzle blast anyway just to get that extra 200-300fps along with the extra weight a 7mm mag has along with what I call 19 inch cases LOL

As far as accuracy goes the 7mm-08 is fantastic in that area also.

How ever I was looking at some 7mm WSMs and they seem promising with that shorter bolt throw but I would still have that hit by a truck recoil and a giant muzzle blast so I will stick with that 7mm-08 for now
rbb50 is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 04:09 PM   #44
mpd61
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 7, 2009
Location: Central Mass
Posts: 348
Fisherman66 and Christboy,

I have seen 270-.308 dies. I also watched a such chambered rifle sell yesterday.

I suppose our new guy is an expert on all things gay. I don't see how it can be any "gayer" than the long action equivalents.

Thank you for recognizing me as the self appointed "Gay Cartridge Expert". In the original context, your analogy of one rifle sale and an existing set of dies does not make .270/08 some future commercial success. In addition the .260 Rem and 7mm-08 ARE short action calibers that arguably do EVERYTHING better than some new and "gay" .270 short wildcat cartridge squeezed in between! Can't you just buy some "new" 270 Short mag and load it down?
What the heck, it sounds so darn "queer"
:barf:
mpd61 is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 04:26 PM   #45
fisherman66
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 22, 2005
Location: Rhome, TX
Posts: 4,641
Quote:
In the original context, your analogy of one rifle sale and an existing set of dies does not make .270/08 some future commercial success. In addition the .260 Rem and 7mm-08 ARE short action calibers that arguably do EVERYTHING better than some new and "gay" .270 short wildcat cartridge squeezed in between! Can't you just buy some "new" 270 Short mag and load it down?
I made no analogy. The 7mm-08 is a ballistic twin (the twin with the stunted growth) to the 7x57. Does that make the 7mm-08 gay? Really, it isn't an argument I'd ever bother to bring up if it weren't for your twink semantics.
__________________
la plus belle des ruses du diable est de vous persuader qu'il n'existe pas!
fisherman66 is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 05:35 PM   #46
Daryl
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 11, 2008
Posts: 2,350
Quote:
Look at the ballistics and energy from a 7mm-08 and I believe you will find just as I did it beats the 30-06 and passes it at about 250 yards and beats the 243 hands down along with being the best over all rifle for any north American game

Even the 7mm mag is just a slight above it and is not even worth it when comparing recoil and muzzle blast anyway just to get that extra 200-300fps along with the extra weight a 7mm mag has along with what I call 19 inch cases LOL
Now those are some interesting statements, purely based on opinion, and likely intended at a bit of promoting one's own preferences.

Quote:
Look at the ballistics and energy from a 7mm-08 and I believe you will find just as I did it beats the 30-06 and passes it at about 250 yards
Passes the 30-06 with....what? Energy? Not a chance. Trajectory? What loads are you comparing? Your information is lacking, and erronious from what I've read. Have you done extensive testing of your own to show this to be true? As bullets get heavier, the differences greatly widen between the 7mm mag and 7mm-08.

Does this mean that the 7mm-08 isn't a good choice? Nope; it just means you might want to stop bad-mouthing the others.

Quote:
and beats the 243 hands down along with being the best over all rifle for any north American game
Beats the .243 hands down...how? Looking up my .243 load in my ballistic's chart, and comparing it to the fastest 120 grain load for the 7mm-08 looks like this:

7mm-08 120 gr spitzer
MV=3000 fps Muzzle energy=2398 ft/lbs POI= -1.5 inches
200 yards
velocity = 2549 fps energy=1730 ft/lbs, POI = 0.0
500 yards
Velocity = 1949 fps, energy = 1012 ft/lbs, POI = -40.9 inches

.243 Win 100 gr spitzer
MV = 3250 fps, energy = 2418 ft/lbs, POI = -1.5 inches
200 yards
Velocity = 2793 fps, energy = 1732 ft/lbs, POI = 0.0 inches
500 yards
Velocity = 2129 fps, energy = 1006 ft/lbs, POI = -33.9 inches.

My load uses a 100 grain bullet pushed to 3250 fps using IMR-7828SSC, and the actual bullet I use has a higher BC. For the purposes of this comparison, I used same make/bullet styles.

BTW-that 120 gr bullet gave the BEST trajectory and energy figures for the 7mm-08.

As weight goes up in the 7-08, the trajectory drops more throughout the spectrum, and the energy goes down at the muzzle, but gets a little higher (50 ft/lbs) at 500 yards than the 120 grain bullet in the same caliber/cartridge.

That being the case, I'd say they're about equal in that comparison. If there's a difference, it's slightly in favor of the .243 Win. Granted, most factory loaded .243 ammo isn't loaded to top velocities, but neither are they for the 7mm-08.

Daryl
Daryl is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 05:51 PM   #47
roy reali
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 23, 2005
Posts: 3,248
Numbers don't kill deer.
roy reali is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 06:02 PM   #48
Breadslinger
Member
 
Join Date: May 7, 2008
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 49
From coast to coast, many deer at varying distances under a multitude of circumstances, one cartridge has done it all...the .270 Winchester. Does this make it the perfect choice? Beats me, but its my choice and I tend to stick with what works.
__________________
I'm Out.
Breadslinger is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 06:34 PM   #49
mapsjanhere
Senior Member
 
Join Date: August 6, 2009
Location: Albuquerque
Posts: 2,336
7x65R in a single shot.
mapsjanhere is offline  
Old September 19, 2009, 06:51 PM   #50
rbb50
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 2, 2008
Location: Deep in the Heart of Texas
Posts: 169
So what your saying Daryl is you some how shoot a 175 grain bullet out of that 243 you have also.

I would like to see the specs on that LOL

7mm goes from 100 grain to 175 grain bullets which makes it perfect for me

And no I'm not bad mouthing anyone and made my statements knowing after 50 years of shooting every caliber there is the 7mm-08 is the best one I have ever found for myself

Doesn't mean that would hold true for anyone else.

I have my own data and it does show exactly what I said.

Does not beat the 30-06 hands down but it does pass it and has a slight more energy at longer ranges due to the ballistic coefficient of the 7mm bullet

Does not mean the 30-06 or the 243 is not a good caliber either way and only that I like the 7mm-08 more.

Look in the high powered rifle silhouette competitions and you will find a big percentage of the shooters shooting that 7mm-08

At least they were back when I was in them

I load my own and do a lot of math to do that if you want to take a look at it here

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/...d.php?t=318179

Does not matter what you are reloading for there are math equations all over the internet as a way to make that caliber accurate as can be.

A lot of people just look at that muzzle velocity those factories always advertise and think yep that must be really good going that fast

I look at the science part of it all and know it does not matter what caliber I use I can make it accurate to the max

Friends of mine that shoot the 30-06 always tell me they have to use that 150-180 grain bullet size because the others are just not accurate even when they reload

Then I teach them the math and they find out that 30-06 can shoot anything from a 100 grain to a 200 grain bullet very accurately after all

After they shoot my 7mm-08 they instantly want one for themselves also LOL

Roy is correct... Numbers will never kill a deer at all LOL

Those 270s are bad to the bone also and I hear sometimes, "Ar'nt those things just an old has been caliber"? I'm like HUHHHHHH who told you that them 270s are bad to the bone.

Last edited by rbb50; September 19, 2009 at 07:09 PM.
rbb50 is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:36 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2013 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.14518 seconds with 7 queries