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Old August 29, 2009, 09:05 AM   #1
.284
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That's a 200 lb. doe....not!

Have you ever noticed that hunter's pack the pounds on their kills?

Here in Michigan, or Saskatchewan South (as I will call it for this thread), we like our whitetail hunting. We talk about it, brag about it, and lie about it. I always here about the "cow" doe that someone just couldn't let walk another day in the woods or the darn near 300 lb. buck.

I will admit that before I integrated a scale in my hanging system, I too over estimated the hanging weight of deer that I had taken. I was usually about twenty pounds heavy from actual. I did better than most. The average hanging weight of a doe here is about 105 lbs. The average "eyeballed" weight is 150 lbs.

Just wondering if this is a Michigan problem, a whitetail only problem, or does this happen in your neck of the woods too? And if so, what other animals and do you have a funny story too?
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Old August 29, 2009, 09:10 AM   #2
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Are you saying 300lb bucks and 200lb doe's are....not out there? Define your weight definitions....live weight or gutted.
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Old August 29, 2009, 09:34 AM   #3
.284
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Sure I know that there are 300 lb. Bucks and 200 lb. does. I'm talking about weighing a gutted deer on a scale. I have just wistnessed many guys standing over their dead deer professing it to be 150lbs. (or more) dressed and I know from weighing it's no more than 110 lbs. at best.
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Old August 29, 2009, 09:39 AM   #4
Brian Pfleuger
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It's a hunting problem.... I've never talked to a hunter that hasn't killed 200+ pound bucks, 150-200 pound does, 25 pound turkeys.... fisherman with 10+ pound Bass, 5 foot Pike.... you name it....


Part of the problem is that the estimates in their head are based on the "facts" about a deer that was shot by Joe Redneck who said "Dang Johnny! This here id da biggest doe I ever saw! She's a hun-dird and fidtee.... easy"..... so, the guy shoots a doe the next day or next year and says "Well, I'llllllll be! This here doe is biggern that one Joe Redneck shot, DANG! his was over one-fiddy, dis here deer mus' be 175!"

Truth is, Joe Rednecks deer was 100 pounds.... and the new one is 125....


All that said, here in central NY we do have pretty big deer. Actually measured weights from around the Ithaca area show that a 130+ pound doe is not unusual and the bucks can be anywhere over 150, maybe pushing 200 for a REAL bruiser. (this is from the weigh station records that I saw... I'll have to ask the dude in charge to see where the averages came out)
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Old August 29, 2009, 10:03 AM   #5
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Some hunters have picked up a few pointers from the "Fishermen"....notice how they sit way back on the rump of a deer holding the rack as far forward to the camera lens as possible? (You'd never catch me doing this )
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Old August 29, 2009, 10:18 AM   #6
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Slightly off topic, but...

... the animal attack scene and its aftermath in the movie, "Tropic Thunder," have some very funny bearing on this.
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Old August 29, 2009, 10:36 AM   #7
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"Well, I'llllllll be! This here doe is biggern *that'n* Joe Redneck shot, DANG! his was over one-fiddy, dis here deer mus' be 175!"
Peet, I had to fix yer misspellin'...
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Old August 29, 2009, 11:07 AM   #8
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bottom of canyon

i remember a little buck killed at the bottom of a canyon that went well over 300 by the time we got him to the rim.
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Old August 29, 2009, 11:22 AM   #9
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I never over estimate my game or fish.
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Old August 29, 2009, 11:57 AM   #10
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When I lived in Nevada, they called it "ground shrinkage", the 30" 4-point 300 lbs buck had shrunk to 24" 3X4 and only weighed 150 lbs by the time the hunter reached it. It brings out lines like "That buck was sooooo faarrr away that I had to hold 4 feet over his back, and it had dried up and lost 100 lbs by the time I reached it".
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Old August 29, 2009, 11:58 AM   #11
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It's a guy thing

Ask any guy how big his johnson is and see if you get an accurate answer,ask his girl and you'll get a different answer. So if you can't get an accurate rating on something you see every, what makes you think you could judge a deer. Remember, size does make a good story no matter what it is.
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Old August 29, 2009, 12:07 PM   #12
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Shrinkage starts for me as soon as I put the sights on it. From 220 pounds walking through the brush to about 75 pounds in my sights. From 75 yards away when I first see it to over 300 yards away when I squeeze the trigger. Fortunately they are never 220 when I have to lift them to hang them in the tree or 300 yards away when I have to go get them. I blame it on that little German fellow that messed up time and gravity with his relative theory.
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Old August 29, 2009, 03:16 PM   #13
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These girls visit us nearly daily and, I doubt either tops 200# -



And, I doubt this guy does either -



This one might -



And, at the time this picture was taken - this guy weighed 249# -



I put him on an exercise program (with me) and he's trimmed down to 230#.

Lest I give the impression I live in the woods - I bought this property in 1975 and it was the north edge of town - now, I'm told the geographic center of town is about two miles east of me. We have some 15 acres of wooded open space behind us that will never be developed - we also have coyotes, bear, foxes, and raccoons to share that space with.

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Old August 29, 2009, 04:13 PM   #14
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Witnesses Cause Shrinkage

It has been scientifically proven that witnesses cause shrinkage with any type of game.

A perfect example is the doe I took two years ago weighed 180 pounds, field dressed and hung on a scale.

This past year, I took a doe that weighed only 120 on the scale. She looked Identical to the doe two years ago, maybe even a tad bit bigger. The only difference is this past year I had a witness help me drag her out and hang her. After we skinned her and compared the hides (I tan), she was actually bigger than the previous years deer. Again, witnesses.

The only time a witness should be allowed anywhere near a deer (or fish) is after it has been cleaned and process and placed in the freezer.
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Old August 29, 2009, 04:54 PM   #15
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The only time a witness should be allowed anywhere near a deer (or fish) is after it has been cleaned and process and placed in the freezer.
A-dern-men!!!! You would be surprised how bad folks miscalculate the weight of a dog caught hog and post the pic on a hoggin' forum only to be told by the vets they are off by 50% or more One example was a hog guessed to be 250 but wasn't over 100#... But I give leeway cuz you are one tired pup after trudging thru the woods half the night, then you have to wrassle a mad hog and several gung ho dogs only to tie it up and drag or tote it to the truck... with all them dogs now leashed up and tangling in the brush and briars... Any hog feels like a 400# slob boar!
I always figure we drug the hunert pounds of hair off as we made way to the truck...
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Old August 29, 2009, 05:12 PM   #16
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The problem is not only the weight "estimate" but also the distance. I am just love the "I shot that 250 lb Connecticut white tail at 300 yards while he was on the run". I have done a great deal of prarrie dog shooting in South Dakota and I can tell you for certain that the 500 yd shot was actually closer to 350 yds by actual measurement. I think it is human nature to "boast" a bit.
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Old August 29, 2009, 07:39 PM   #17
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i remember a little buck killed at the bottom of a canyon that went well over 300 by the time we got him to the rim.
Reminds me of a 800 pound blacktail I shot in Washington state years ago.
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Old August 29, 2009, 09:09 PM   #18
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There are a couple of corallaries to the weight issue: 1)Is the distance issue. There is a law of hunting physics that establishes 150 yards "field" = 75 yards reality. 300 yards "field" = 130 yards actual, etc. 2) Is the distance between the event and the telling. The longer ago it was, the further the shot and the bigger the animal.
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Old August 29, 2009, 09:37 PM   #19
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OJ, y'all sure use small deer feeders on Colorado...or are those full-sized feeders and you have 800 lb bucks?
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Old August 29, 2009, 10:30 PM   #20
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Have you ever noticed that hunter's pack the pounds on their kills?
Well, I can understand how they can double in weight by the time you get 'em carried out.

You sound new at deer hunting. Wait 'till you hear how far away they were killed.

And don't start drinking with fishermen, either.
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Old August 29, 2009, 11:37 PM   #21
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Double Naught Spy
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Join Date: January 8, 2001
Posts: 5,612 OJ, y'all sure use small deer feeders on Colorado...or are those full-sized feeders and you have 800 lb bucks?
Dunno - these have visited us for years and reproduce every year - we've had only one larger buck who had the bad luck of crossing heavy traffic below the hill and not making it - The fauns are really about the size of our foxes.
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Old August 31, 2009, 08:47 AM   #22
.284
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Nnobby45

Not new to deer hunting, 23 years and going strong.

Not new to hunting/fishing lies either
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Old August 31, 2009, 09:19 AM   #23
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It's a hunting problem.... I've never talked to a hunter that hasn't killed 200+ pound bucks, 150-200 pound does, 25 pound turkeys.... fisherman with 10+ pound Bass, 5 foot Pike.... you name it....
The biggest deer I've ever shot, a buck, was probably 125ish based on comparison with the actual weight of my buddy's deer that was an honest 150. Deer are small where I live and it's rare anyone gets one much larger than 150lbs (does tend to run in the 80-120lb range). I shot that one at 20yds though (how many people brag about how close they were...).

Biggest fish of any species I've caught was right around 5lbs.

I don't care about size, I'm happy enough just to get time to hunt and fish and have a place to do either.

Chris
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Old August 31, 2009, 10:03 AM   #24
COYOTE JLR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SavageSniper
Quote:
i remember a little buck killed at the bottom of a canyon that went well over 300 by the time we got him to the rim.
Reminds me of a 800 pound blacktail I shot in Washington state years ago.
I got a kick out of this. You've gotta pick your shots carefully around here. I remember two years ago I got a call from my buddy just as I was getting off of a long day at work, and he's all excited about this big buck that he'd just got (an honest 150#s before being dressed, which is pretty damn decent for a blacktail around here).

Well anyway, he asks if I'd wanna come help him pack it out, and being the good friend I am say "Sure man. I'd love to." So I head back and find him out in the hills and he points down into this ravine about half a mile away and says "there it is." The little bugger yoinked his shot and blew out the poor critters legs and let it run for half a mile before bleeding out. :barf:

By the time we climbed back up to the top of that hill, which is as big as most anything you'll find in the Harz Mountains in Germany, I swear to you that the darn deer gained another 200#s after we gutted it out from pure malevolence.

So I would contest that the shrinkage principal doesn't always come into effect when there are witnesses. I was a witness to my friends hunting adventure and I went right along with him when he said his deer was 275#s and I made up for it by then telling everybody about his atrocity of a shot and the 38 others he took to kill the deer.
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Old August 31, 2009, 01:18 PM   #25
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I can live with slight stretching of the truth.

The guy that told me he killed a Roosevelt elk cow that was 1,000 lbs, I had to call BS to his face. Might have seemed that big getting her out, but it wasn't.

Trouble is, once you call BS, they have to get more adamant about it so they don't get humiliated.
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