Us customs trying to change definition of switchblade to include pretty much anything

greywalker · June 11, 2009, 05:15 AM

Apparently, the US customs people are trying to rewrite the definition of a switchblade knife, which is used in the majority of states knife laws as the de-facto definition, to include any assisted opening knife, and ANY KNIFE THAT CAN BE OPENED WITH ONE HAND- thus including any easy opener, ie over 80% of the pocket knives sold in the us, and even a few swiss army knives.... If it potentially can be opened with one hand its a no-no under these rules, no matter how it is done, ie if one customs guy can manage it with a weird trick, its a switchblade... they have refused to extend the period for comments beyond 30 days, so the comment period expires this month.... so guys, if this is'nt stopped, and you carry a modern pocket knife, welcome to being a felon in most states...... (sorry, I have no link, but google it for more info )

OGHITMAN187 · June 11, 2009, 05:33 AM

WOW, that sucks. That's basically every blade under the sun that isn't a fixed blade. Just when I thought laws couldn't get dumber, here they go trying to get stupid.:barf:When you OUTLAW weapons the only people who will have weapons are OUTLAWS, cant they figure that out.

Dingoboyx · June 11, 2009, 05:42 AM

soon, you will only be allowed a pocket knife if it has a plastic blade and no longer than a 1" blade.... :barf:

Here in Oz, switch blades are a no-no and I believe 3" or 4" is the maximum length of blade allowed..... thanks big brother!

I know getting on aeroplanes these days, you cant even take your pocket knife at all.... in fact, my SWMBO has lost a couple of pairs of hairdressing scizzors at the airport check in, they are dangerous weapons, hairdressing scizzors! Last time I went on a flight, I had to snap the nail file off of my fingernail 'nippers'.... evidently the 3/4" nail file attached to the nippers could also be used to bring down the plane :barf:

I knew things like this are bad over here in Oz, I can't believe they are pulling this BS on you guys in the US now (well, I can believe it if it is California we are talkin' about), but in the rest of (the real USA) I find it amazing.

You guys need to watch out your laws regarding guns & knives dont get overbaring like over here.... keep your eyes and ears peeled for your 'protective/over protective' political groups pulling all this BS behind your backs!

Dingoboyx · June 11, 2009, 05:49 AM

But you step into any kitchen in the world, and you will find steak/carving knives, electric (battery) carving knives & carvung forks..... cleavers and saws 'designed' to cut meat..... with blades up to 10"+ long...... in dive shops..... huge sharp sheathed knives, speer guns (oh no, they are banned already) ...... Hardware/tool shops that sell chisels, screwdrivers, machete's, pitch forks (chainsaws)..... these all must be ok? (for now)!

Just don't take them on a plane I guess??! :barf:

BlueTrain · June 11, 2009, 07:31 AM

The law can always be written in such a way that it cannot be obeyed.

5whiskey · June 11, 2009, 09:31 AM

I'll look for link, would someone else help. First man to post it wins? I want to contact my congress people concerning this and a link would help

CortJestir · June 11, 2009, 09:41 AM

Very disconcerting, to say the least.

Here's an article I found using a quick Google search. The article includes a link to the actual 63-page proposal. The proposal itself is a PDF, FYI.

5whiskey · June 11, 2009, 09:53 AM

http://www.akti.org/PDFS/U.S.CustomsProposedRuling.pdf

Here's the proposal, I was busy reading it.

Quote:

and ANY KNIFE THAT CAN BE OPENED WITH ONE HAND- thus including any easy opener, ie over 80% of the pocket knives sold in the us, and even a few swiss army knives.... If it potentially can be opened with one hand its a no-no under these rules, no matter how it is done, ie if one customs guy can manage it with a weird trick, its a switchblade...

I'm not seeing that in the proposal. All I'm seeing is where they are doing a 180 on spring assisted knives. I haven't read it word for word all the way through, but I haven't found the portion that rules a thumb knuckle a "switchblade button".

johnwilliamson062 · June 11, 2009, 10:00 AM

is there to be an exception for those with physical disabilities?

Doyle · June 11, 2009, 12:16 PM

Remember guys, Customs and Border Patrol ONLY has the power to create regulations with regards to IMPORTATION. It has absolutely no power over anything that doesn't cross the border.

maestro pistolero · June 11, 2009, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Remember guys, Customs and Border Patrol ONLY has the power to create regulations with regards to IMPORTATION. It has absolutely no power over anything that doesn't cross the border.

Sorry, but I take little or no comfort from that fact. As soon as the item is demonized in the press, it's a short ride to demonize the American made items. Besides, what is the Customs and Border Patrol doing making policy? Aren't they law ENFORCEMENT rather than legislators?

And how is it they feel that they have the luxury of resources to create a whole new class of contraband, when they haven't begun to scratch the surface of already dangerous items flowing wholesale in to the country? Boys, can we worry about the problems we have yet to solve, before we artificially create new ones?

Stiofan · June 11, 2009, 12:38 PM

That's right Doyle. Characterizing a change like this by Customs would not make anyone carrying such a knife "a felon".

A bit overly dramatic I think.

Dingoboyx · June 11, 2009, 01:17 PM

That means it would include carpet knives (triangular, reversable/replaceable blade) stanley knives (or plastic equivelant box/carton knives with segmented/snap off blades) and razor blade retractable window scrapers??

I used to have a switch combe (yup, for hair) it looked just like a knife.... got me in alot of poo too

JWT · June 11, 2009, 07:44 PM

Lots of chatter on some of the 'knife' sites about this today. Many suggesting a campaign to contact Senators and Representatives to oppose the proposed changes. As I understand it the reg. would apply only to the importation of certain knives, not necessarily the ownership of them???

My concern is that it's another example of Government control over another facet of it's citizens lives.

vranasaurus · June 11, 2009, 08:03 PM

How would changing the definition of a switchblade used by customs make possession a Felony? It could affect importation but certainly not possession.

Does customs have the authority to change the definition used in every single state statute? Which is where the possession of these knives is regulated outside of federal lands.

Doyle · June 11, 2009, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Does customs have the authority to change the definition used in every single state statute?

Nope, not at all. The ONLY authority they have is the ability to change the INTERPRETATION of what is classified a switchblade for the purposes of importation.

Webleymkv · June 11, 2009, 08:28 PM

Quote:

How would changing the definition of a switchblade used by customs make possession a Felony? It could affect importation but certainly not possession.

The worry is that many states base their definitions of a "switchblade" off of the U.S. Customs definition. If USC changes their definition, then those states my change theirs as well. Personally, I think banning switchblades at all is pretty dumb.

bikerbill · June 12, 2009, 04:31 PM

webley's right ... I wrote both my senators this morning after I got something in my email from a knife group I belong to ... I think this may not be as bad as it sounds, but it's the first step ... and states, especiall states like CA and MA, will use the regs as a basis for law ...

HarrySchell · June 12, 2009, 05:37 PM

Was there some event that triggered this brainstorm at Customs or did some nit come over from the UK to tell them how well the knife ban over there is working?

I can't seem to find out why this got onto someone's agenda, but maybe that is something we are not desired to know (?).

seed · June 12, 2009, 08:16 PM

http://www.kniferights.org/index.php...id=81&Itemid=1

ImprobableJoe · June 12, 2009, 09:28 PM

Does anyone have any information about the point of this? Who benefits from this?

June 11, 2009, 05:15 AM	#1
greywalker Member Join Date: June 28, 2008 Location: the midwest Posts: 82	Us customs trying to change definition of switchblade to include pretty much anything Apparently, the US customs people are trying to rewrite the definition of a switchblade knife, which is used in the majority of states knife laws as the de-facto definition, to include any assisted opening knife, and ANY KNIFE THAT CAN BE OPENED WITH ONE HAND- thus including any easy opener, ie over 80% of the pocket knives sold in the us, and even a few swiss army knives.... If it potentially can be opened with one hand its a no-no under these rules, no matter how it is done, ie if one customs guy can manage it with a weird trick, its a switchblade... they have refused to extend the period for comments beyond 30 days, so the comment period expires this month.... so guys, if this is'nt stopped, and you carry a modern pocket knife, welcome to being a felon in most states...... (sorry, I have no link, but google it for more info )

June 11, 2009, 05:42 AM	#3
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	Yeah soon, you will only be allowed a pocket knife if it has a plastic blade and no longer than a 1" blade.... :barf: Here in Oz, switch blades are a no-no and I believe 3" or 4" is the maximum length of blade allowed..... thanks big brother! I know getting on aeroplanes these days, you cant even take your pocket knife at all.... in fact, my SWMBO has lost a couple of pairs of hairdressing scizzors at the airport check in, they are dangerous weapons, hairdressing scizzors! Last time I went on a flight, I had to snap the nail file off of my fingernail 'nippers'.... evidently the 3/4" nail file attached to the nippers could also be used to bring down the plane :barf: I knew things like this are bad over here in Oz, I can't believe they are pulling this BS on you guys in the US now (well, I can believe it if it is California we are talkin' about), but in the rest of (the real USA) I find it amazing. You guys need to watch out your laws regarding guns & knives dont get overbaring like over here.... keep your eyes and ears peeled for your 'protective/over protective' political groups pulling all this BS behind your backs! __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs Last edited by Al Norris; June 11, 2009 at 11:31 AM. Reason: Corrected invective.

June 11, 2009, 05:49 AM	#4
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	Oh yeah.... But you step into any kitchen in the world, and you will find steak/carving knives, electric (battery) carving knives & carvung forks..... cleavers and saws 'designed' to cut meat..... with blades up to 10"+ long...... in dive shops..... huge sharp sheathed knives, speer guns (oh no, they are banned already) ...... Hardware/tool shops that sell chisels, screwdrivers, machete's, pitch forks (chainsaws)..... these all must be ok? (for now)! Just don't take them on a plane I guess??! :barf: __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs

June 11, 2009, 07:31 AM	#5
BlueTrain Senior Member Join Date: September 26, 2005 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 5,809	The law can always be written in such a way that it cannot be obeyed. __________________ Shoot low, sheriff. They're riding Shetlands! Underneath the starry flag, civilize 'em with a Krag, and return us to our own beloved homes! Buy War Bonds.

June 11, 2009, 09:41 AM	#7
CortJestir Senior Member Join Date: July 7, 2008 Location: Southern CT Posts: 1,406	Very disconcerting, to say the least. Here's an article I found using a quick Google search. The article includes a link to the actual 63-page proposal. The proposal itself is a PDF, FYI. __________________ "They have men amongst them who know very well what they are about..." - Lord Hugh Percy, on the events of April 19, 1775 Do you know what you're about? Find out at an Appleseed near you.

June 11, 2009, 05:33 AM	#2
OGHITMAN187 Member Join Date: June 2, 2009 Location: Lakewood, California Posts: 49	WOW, that sucks. That's basically every blade under the sun that isn't a fixed blade. Just when I thought laws couldn't get dumber, here they go trying to get stupid.:barf:When you OUTLAW weapons the only people who will have weapons are OUTLAWS, cant they figure that out.

June 11, 2009, 09:31 AM	#6
5whiskey Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2005 Location: US Posts: 1,360	I'll look for link, would someone else help. First man to post it wins? I want to contact my congress people concerning this and a link would help

June 11, 2009, 10:00 AM	#9
johnwilliamson062 Senior Member Join Date: May 16, 2008 Posts: 6,108	is there to be an exception for those with physical disabilities? __________________ $0 of an NRA membership goes to legislative action or court battles. Not a dime. Only money contributed to the NRA-ILA or NRA-PVF. Of course, you could just donate to the Second Amendment Foundation I was feeling pretty good, then I looked around and realized I am not swimming or on fire.

June 11, 2009, 12:16 PM	#10
Doyle Senior Member Join Date: June 20, 2007 Location: Bradenton, Fl Posts: 4,128	Remember guys, Customs and Border Patrol ONLY has the power to create regulations with regards to IMPORTATION. It has absolutely no power over anything that doesn't cross the border.

June 11, 2009, 12:38 PM	#12
Stiofan Senior Member Join Date: January 17, 2006 Location: Panhandle, Idaho Posts: 686	That's right Doyle. Characterizing a change like this by Customs would not make anyone carrying such a knife "a felon". A bit overly dramatic I think.

June 11, 2009, 01:17 PM	#13
Dingoboyx Senior Member Join Date: March 7, 2009 Location: South East Queensland, Australia Posts: 1,513	Yikes That means it would include carpet knives (triangular, reversable/replaceable blade) stanley knives (or plastic equivelant box/carton knives with segmented/snap off blades) and razor blade retractable window scrapers?? I used to have a switch combe (yup, for hair) it looked just like a knife.... got me in alot of poo too __________________ Muzza If you cant blind them with brilliance, Baffle them with BS Be alert...... there is a shortage of LERTs

June 11, 2009, 07:44 PM	#14
JWT Senior Member Join Date: March 16, 2007 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 2,824	Lots of chatter on some of the 'knife' sites about this today. Many suggesting a campaign to contact Senators and Representatives to oppose the proposed changes. As I understand it the reg. would apply only to the importation of certain knives, not necessarily the ownership of them??? My concern is that it's another example of Government control over another facet of it's citizens lives.

June 11, 2009, 08:03 PM	#15
vranasaurus Senior Member Join Date: November 16, 2008 Posts: 1,145	How would changing the definition of a switchblade used by customs make possession a Felony? It could affect importation but certainly not possession. Does customs have the authority to change the definition used in every single state statute? Which is where the possession of these knives is regulated outside of federal lands.

June 12, 2009, 04:31 PM	#18
bikerbill Senior Member Join Date: September 19, 2007 Location: Lago Vista TX Posts: 2,145	webley's right ... I wrote both my senators this morning after I got something in my email from a knife group I belong to ... I think this may not be as bad as it sounds, but it's the first step ... and states, especiall states like CA and MA, will use the regs as a basis for law ... __________________ "The gun has been called the great equalizer ... It insures that the people are the equal of their government whenever that government forgets that it is servant and not master of the governed." --Ronald Reagan

June 12, 2009, 05:37 PM	#19
HarrySchell Senior Member Join Date: March 30, 2007 Location: South CA Posts: 505	Was there some event that triggered this brainstorm at Customs or did some nit come over from the UK to tell them how well the knife ban over there is working? I can't seem to find out why this got onto someone's agenda, but maybe that is something we are not desired to know (?). __________________ Loyalty to petrified opinions never yet broke a chain or freed a human soul in this world — and never will. — Mark Twain

June 12, 2009, 08:16 PM	#20
seed Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2004 Posts: 410	http://www.kniferights.org/index.php...id=81&Itemid=1

June 12, 2009, 09:28 PM	#21
ImprobableJoe Junior member Join Date: June 11, 2009 Posts: 87	Does anyone have any information about the point of this? Who benefits from this?