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Old June 8, 2009, 03:04 AM   #1
cloud8a
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Shady situation during trip to Lubbock, Texas

Me and the family drove out to Lubbock. 6 hours. I do not have a CCW permit but in Texas you can carry in your car. I put my XD-40 under my seat. We arrived at the hotel about 11pm. We had food from Taco Villa so I cased the parking area seeing some suspicious looking folks at the hotel entrance. I wanted us to eat in peace so we parked out deep in the lot and ate. after we were done I decided that if something bad was going to happen I wanted it to happen at the entrance in the light. So I drove to the entrance parked the car. There was a white male standing there. He was jerking his head around and tugging at his pants. I sat there for a minute and watched him then I told my wife I am going in to get our room keys. Reminded her that our pistol was under my seat if needed. I went inside and got the keys. When I came out my wife had the Springfield in her lap and my son was shaking. she said that when I walked inside the white male cased our car and then got picked up by another car and dove around the parking lot and got dropped off back at the entrance (drug deal). she said that when the guy started casing the car she reached down and got the gun and told my son what was going on.

I later informed the desk clerk that they needed to check what was going on. I told my wife that telling the kids what is happening and scaring them was unnecessary. She was ****** off that the guy had the you know whats to case our car when he did not know there were some federal hydra-shoks waiting for him to do something stupid.
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Old June 8, 2009, 10:03 AM   #2
doh_312
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I trust your wife has enough experience to handle your XD properly if needed?

I'm glad nothing more happened. I have found, since I got my permit, that situations like that happen all the time. It is those kinda moments where something just does not feel right, but the pistol at your hip sure is a comfort.

Good on ya
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Old June 8, 2009, 10:12 AM   #3
Brian Pfleuger
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I have to say that I would not have left my wife and kid alone in the car with a suspicious character just feet away.
"Honey, pop a cap in that guy if he gets frisky, I'll be back in a few."

I would not stay at a hotel that had drug deals happening in the parking lot.

Plus, I don't understand eating in the car when you're at the hotel where you're staying.
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Old June 8, 2009, 10:34 AM   #4
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+1 on what peetzakilla said. I feel lilke avoidance should always be the preference. The gun is there when avoidance is no longer an option on the table imo. But in reference to the point about her telling your son had she needed to shoot wouldn't you have wanted him to know something in advance so he could get to safety instead of your wife having to bark orders to him and fire a gun at the same time? Of course I don't know his age.
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Old June 8, 2009, 10:43 AM   #5
KingEdward
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not to monday morning quarterback but...

after eating in the car, I probably would have swapped places with the wife.

Had her drop me off at the office near the door. (and I would be carrying the XD)

I would have picked up the room keys while she had the car running / doors locked.

Then gotten in car and headed to room.

Remember, you can conceal a gun numerous ways.

Fast food bag, newspaper folded up, any number of ways to not look odd
in a motel office.
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Old June 8, 2009, 11:10 AM   #6
David Armstrong
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I'm not sure how one can determine that someone else is "casing their car". Sounds far more like the guy was making sure it wasn't the cops (assuming he was a doper) or was just looking while waiting for his partner to show up. And to echo others, why get the food and eat it in the parking lot? Get the key, get into the room, then go get food and bring it back to the room.
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Old June 8, 2009, 11:14 AM   #7
sakeneko
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Actually, guys, I'm not sure there *was* a good way to handle this. Frankly, I'd have been tempted to simply leave and find another hotel, even if that meant forfeiting a night's deposit, but not everybody can afford to do that. I'm also a bit more paranoid about "bad neighborhoods" than most of you; I'm female and was single into my forties.

However, leaving his wife in the car *WITH CHILDREN* meant he had to leave the pistol there. Yeah, I'd happily ignore the rules about concealed carry in an emergency (and this qualified), and I certainly don't think of myself as needing protection from my husband. (While he's bigger and a better shot than I am, I did fine by myself for 45 years on that count.) Kids do need protection, though, and that pistol was the only thing they had.

I think he made the best of a bad set of choices. And fortunately, the drug dealer wasn't interested in shooting once he figured out that you guys weren't undercover cops or another gang watching him.

<sigh> Cr*p like that shouldn't happen.
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Old June 8, 2009, 11:21 AM   #8
Brian Pfleuger
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I certainly don't think of myself as needing protection from my husband.
The people who buy pizzas from me don't NEED me to make pizzas for them either, I do it because it's my job. (Same with protecting the wife.)
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Old June 8, 2009, 11:38 AM   #9
sakeneko
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ROFL, peetzakilla! My husband says the same; he definitely *likes* to protect. And I don't mind; it's nice having him there. :-)

However, *if* we're in a situation that's genuinely dangerous, he's not just protecting me; the same's true the other way around. We are both players, not victims, when a bad guy shows up. In some cases, my part to play is going to be get in the car quickly so I don't distract my husband. In some cases, it may be to take out a bad guy who is watching my husband and making the foolish mistake of thinking I'm not a player because I'm an overweight middle-aged female who doesn't look dangerous. <EVIL grin> This would be even more important if we had children, because children (young ones, in any event) cannot protect themselves and depend upon their parents.

As I said, the situation cloud8a faced wasn't good. Other than perhaps driving off and finding another place to stay, though, I can't think of any better way of handling the situation he faced than what he did. His wife wasn't one of the children; she was the other adult. Leaving her the pistol so she could protect herself and the kids in a reasonably secure place (a locked car) for a few minutes made sense.

Or so it seems to me. I'm sure if I'm missing something, there are people her who can correct it. ;-)
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Old June 8, 2009, 11:55 AM   #10
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I think he made the best of a bad set of choices.
He made totally POOR choices. It's a lesson of what not to do and an example of how carrying a gun is sometimes not a good idea for some folks.

WAs 15th Law of Reality: In the ordinary course of affairs, if you would not be somewhere unarmed, you should not be there just because you are armed.

The gun doesnt make you invulnerable so you shouldnt act like it does.

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Old June 8, 2009, 12:47 PM   #11
sakeneko
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Quote:
Quote:
I think he made the best of a bad set of choices.
He made totally POOR choices. It's a lesson of what not to do and an example of how carrying a gun is sometimes not a good idea for some folks.

WAs 15th Law of Reality: In the ordinary course of affairs, if you would not be somewhere unarmed, you should not be there just because you are armed.

The gun doesnt make you invulnerable so you shouldnt act like it does.
Said with considerable confidence, but absolutely no information content. Okay, confident guy, what *should* he have done? Not have gone to Lubbock and stayed in a motel with his family? Or left and gone somewhere else? Or something else entirely?

I don't know if you're aware of this, but you sounded like an arrogant know-it-all in your post. I am aware that you might not have intended to; online message boards don't allow nonverbal signals and things can get taken wrong. But you should *not* criticize someone's choices unless you are prepared to suggest a better set of alternatives. You did not do that.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:03 PM   #12
cloud8a
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It was 11pm and we had spent 6 hours in a car with 3 kids.

My wife wanted to eat in the car because it had been years since she had Taco Villa and she did not want to eat it after we spent half an hour unloading the car. I do not have a problem eating in the parking lot. The possible threat was at the main entrance not out in the parking lot. I could watch the main entrance from where I was.

I did cancel my reservation for the next night and got a refund (we prepaid) and stayed at a much nicer hotel across town. We are not poor and we are not rich (but we used to be poor) so since we got our res. through Expedia we were in a tight place on a refund until I could get them on the phone the next morning.

I am not sending my wife in by herself to handle the desk business. The rooms were in my name with my card. I did not need extra confusion.

She knows how to use my XD, she has shot it on many occasion. She has no fear when it comes to protecting the family. Her responsibility to do so is the same as mine, and she knows that and more than willingly accepts that role.

all the kids were strapped in the back seat in a car seat or seat belt. they were as out of the way as they could have been. The kids knowing something that could make them act hysterical or unpredictable before the fact I feel is not a good Idea. I would rather they be ignorant of the situation and be in a "What just happened" after the fact. I don't want the kids grabbing my wife's arms and legs and screaming in terror before a situation.

It would have done no good for me to have the gun in the hotel lobby while the BG is breaking the drivers side window and driving off with my entire family out to the west Texas desert.

We did not know where another hotel was at that late moment. And we were not going to drive around Lubbock looking for the right one just because some jackwad was standing at this one acting funny. THAT I WHY I HAVE A GUN. If I left a location every time someone was acting strange I would have a hard time getting things done. THAT IS WHY I HAVE A GUN. so I can do my business around the sometimes American strange and shady and be secure in the fact that if strange and shady turns dangerous I have the tool to protect my life and the life of my family.

Last edited by cloud8a; June 8, 2009 at 01:09 PM.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:07 PM   #13
wickedrider
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I'm not sure how one can determine that someone else is "casing their car". Sounds far more like the guy was making sure it wasn't the cops (assuming he was a doper) or was just looking while waiting for his partner to show up. And to echo others, why get the food and eat it in the parking lot? Get the key, get into the room, then go get food and bring it back to the room.
Ditto
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:16 PM   #14
Wildalaska
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Said with considerable confidence, but absolutely no information content.
Really? I need to explain the obvious to you?

Quote:
Okay, confident guy, what *should* he have done?
Again, you don't know? OK I'm sure I will be able to educate you later on.

Quote:
I don't know if you're aware of this, but you sounded like an arrogant know-it-all in your post.
When you have been her longer than a week, you will know that I don't sound like one, I am one. And proud of it. Es ist nichts schrecklicher als eine tätige Unwissenheit. Try thinking outside the box you may learn something.

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Old June 8, 2009, 01:19 PM   #15
Wildalaska
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It was 11pm and we had spent 6 hours in a car with 3 kids.
Why didnt you just call 911. Or call the hotel lobby to ask them to do so. Or wait a few minutes?

Ask yourself this: Would you have acted the same way you did if you were unarmed?

Be honest

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Last edited by Wildalaska; June 8, 2009 at 01:47 PM.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:28 PM   #16
Wildalaska
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And we were not going to drive around Lubbock looking for the right one just because some jackwad was standing at this one acting funny. THAT I WHY I HAVE A GUN. If I left a location every time someone was acting strange I would have a hard time getting things done. THAT IS WHY I HAVE A GUN. so I can do my business around the sometimes American strange and shady and be secure in the fact that if strange and shady turns dangerous I have the tool to protect my life and the life of my family.
I didnt read that. let me respond.

Thats NOT why you have a gun. You have a gun because you want to protect yourself from unanticipated and deadly attacks. And if you are in that many situations where you cant get your biz done because folks are "strange and shady" you need to either move or do some soul searching..


And with all due respect, your placing yourself and your familiy in a potentially harmful situation just because of convenience smacks of poor decisionmaking. The gunwoobie doesnt render one invulnerable to social, financial, legal or psychological aftermaths.

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Old June 8, 2009, 01:30 PM   #17
cloud8a
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Wild Alaska

I am sure you walk around with a pair of night vision goggles in the survival bag you carry 24/7 and that you have been to every tactical training class in your vicinity and you carry a pocket size notebook in your front pocket so that you can 'Observe and Report'.

In my world I try to adapt to things the best I can. I do not call the cops every time to protect me when I feel a little scared inside. Nor do I think perfectly at all times like you clearly do. I keep my eyes and ears open and hope things do not get ugly. It is called being a free man.

Sounds to me you have a beed on the situation so lets hear how you would have. Maybe you would have just ran over to the guy and made a citizens arrest.
or you are just trying to inflame something.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:36 PM   #18
cloud8a
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""Thats NOT why you have a gun. You have a gun because you want to protect yourself from unanticipated and deadly attacks. And if you are in that many situations where you cant get your biz done because folks are "strange and shady" you need to either move or do some soul searching..""

I don't live in the wilderness dude. I live in a big city. Around millions of people. people cant always just up and move.

You know what? you don't know what you are talking about. I think you might be just trying to start a problem. That other language stuff you posted shows a level of immaturity. So looks like your just a little troublemaker.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:38 PM   #19
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Sounds to me you have a beed on the situation so lets hear how you would have. Maybe you would have just ran over to the guy and made a citizens arrest.
or you are just trying to inflame something.
I'm curious as to why you would post about this event if you are not interested in hearing that you may have done the wrong thing.

If you want "Adda boy! Good work!" regardless of anything, this is not the place you'll be finding it.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:41 PM   #20
cloud8a
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Of course I want to hear how I would have done things better. But come on, when describing how you would have done things differently don't fall just short of saying I was a reckless moron. There are ways to talk to people. Just because we are on a forum does not mean it is not polite conversation.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:46 PM   #21
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Would you have acted the same thing you did if you were unarmed?
While the grammar, and syntax, of this statement may be a bit hard to understand, the question is still valid.


Would you have acted in the same manner, and made the same decisions, if you had been unarmed ?

If not then some introspection is in order.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:47 PM   #22
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Of course I want to hear how I would have done things better. But come on, when describing how you would have done things differently don't fall just short of saying I was a reckless moron. There are ways to talk to people. Just because we are on a forum does not mean it is not polite conversation.
Please advise where anybody called you a "moron". But in point of fact, your actions were totally wrong, and if being told that upsets you, or if having your justifications exposed as reckless upsets you, o well.

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Old June 8, 2009, 01:55 PM   #23
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This is one fight I dont want to get in the middle of, however, I am curious Mr. Alaska, what you would have done differently?

Not that it makes a difference, no one was there but the OP and we cannot accurately armchair-quarterback the situation. We cant take into account how long they've been on the road, the restless kids in the back who are probably whinning, the tired wife, the tired driver, etc.

I do respect you opinion Mr. Alaska, so I would like to know what you'd have done.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:56 PM   #24
cloud8a
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No I would not have changed anything if unarmed. Does that prove that I am the right kind of gun owner in your opinion?

As of yet all wildalaska has done is said I made POOR decisions. Now it is time for a detailed description of everything I did wrong and how to correct it.
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Old June 8, 2009, 01:57 PM   #25
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Stay away from cheap motels. The density of questionables is high. I've noticed this. Hotels/motels are one of the things that have a non-linear price/quality curve. It's flat at the top and really steep at the bottom.
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