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Old May 24, 2009, 12:43 AM   #1
Blue Steel
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Armed Citizen: Oklahoma Pharmacist Defends Employees from Robbers

[Note by Antipitas: For those of you that are just coming into this thread, there are several accounts (links) of where to get all the information you will need in order to make informed comments. The latest recap of this information can be found here. (That's post #757 on page 31) - Read at least the linked post before you post any comments]


By Johnny Johnson, The Daily Oklahoman

Jerome Ersland was back at work Thursday filling prescriptions and hoping that by taking the life of a 16-year-old boy two days earlier, he had saved others.

Rubbing an oversized bandage on his left forearm, where he said he was grazed by a robber’s bullet, Ersland related details of a highly organized hit on the Reliable Discount Pharmacy.

"I just regret anybody would get killed,” Ersland said. "But if I wouldn’t have been here, there would have been three people killed — the other pharmacist and the two techs.”

He also recalls the angry voices of people who gathered outside the pharmacy Tuesday night, shouting that he was a racist who unnecessarily took a life of the Seeworth Academy charter school student, Antwun Parker.

AN ORGANIZED HIT

After the pharmacy near SW 59 and Pennsylvania was robbed two years ago, the owner installed new security measures to try to make sure his employees would never again be forced to a back room and pistol-whipped.

"We have a very good security system,” Ersland said, motioning to the magnetic door locks that won’t let anyone in or out of the store without permission. "The door locks, and the robbers knew that. They had cased it because they knew exactly what time to hit us when we’d have all of our narcotics out and our money out.”

About 10 minutes before 6 p.m. two robbers wearing ski masks waited for someone to leave the pharmacy and then grabbed the open door and threw down a board to stop the door from closing. The robbers came in cursing and yelling, ordering employees to give them money and drugs, Ersland said.

Two women who were working behind the counter ran for a back room where they would be safe, but Ersland said he couldn’t run. A veteran with disabilities from wounds he received in Operation Desert Storm, Ersland wears a cumbersome back brace and just had his latest back surgery six weeks ago.

"All of a sudden, they started shooting,” he said. "They were attempting to kill me, but they didn’t know I had a gun. They said, ‘You’re gonna die.’ That’s when one of them shot at me, and that’s when he got my hand.”

Ersland said he was thrown against a wall, but managed to go for the semiautomatic in his pocket.

"And that’s when I started defending myself,” he said. "The first shot got him in the head, and that slowed him down so I could get my other gun.”

But as one robber hit the floor, Ersland said, a bullet from the other robber whizzed past his ear. The pharmacist said he then got his second gun from a nearby drawer, a Taurus Judge. After he had the big gun, Ersland said, the second robber ran.

But as he started to chase after the second robber he looked back to see the 16-year-old he had shot in the head getting up again. Ersland said he then emptied the Kel-Tec .380 into the boy’s chest."

"I went after the other guy, but he was real fast and I’m crippled,” Ersland said.

AFTER THE GUNFIRE

When he went back in the pharmacy, Ersland said, he called police. "I asked if the girls were all right, and they were in the back crying,” he said. "I was glad to know they were alive. We were lucky and I’m glad I defended us, because I feel that a person has a right to defend themselves at their home or at their work. People deserve to be safe and not be afraid of people that want to take money when they don’t work for it.”

That’s what the Second Amendment and the state’s concealed carry license are for, he said.

"Fortunately, God made them miss me, except for this minor scratch,” Ersland said.

"I was able to return fire and protect the girls’ lives. God was helping me.”


Last edited by Al Norris; July 10, 2009 at 09:21 AM. Reason: inserted updated information
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Old May 24, 2009, 12:57 AM   #2
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Hero

Well done sir, you are a great man. Take the race haters in stride and take comfort in the fact that you and those around you are still alive. I lost a friend of mine to a gas station robbery back in 80'. He was 17 and was shot execution style with a sawed off shotgun by two career criminals. They took him into the back room and put him on his knees.
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Old May 24, 2009, 01:17 AM   #3
Kyo
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thats not racism. you shoot at me I don't care if your black your gonna get shot back.
What i can't believe is that even one to the head with a .380 didn't drop someone for good. Those are supposed to be effective right? At least a mag to the chest worked.
Good guts right there.
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Old May 24, 2009, 03:22 AM   #4
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What i can't believe is that even one to the head with a .380 didn't drop someone for good.
There's a suprising amount of your head that isn't filled with anything critical to immediate survival. Look at some anatomy charts.

The brain only makes up about half of your head, and you can even live without fairly large parts of your brain.
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Old May 24, 2009, 05:31 AM   #5
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When the BG's showed a gun(s) and discharged it they gave up all rights to life and consideration of their humanity.

They were a lethal threat and were treated as such.Would it have been better for innocents to be executed?? Hopefully others will understand that.

The Pharmacist is a hero.The people protesting are idiots.
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Old May 24, 2009, 07:23 AM   #6
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Typical response after a shooting--

Read the article-The paper offers up pharmacist to be grilled by public opinion for shooting a youth and puts the family all in the headlines after the shooting.

Why the h*ll would a pharmacist want to shoot a 16 yr old in the first place unless he were in danger??

http://www.koco.com/news/19543055/detail.html


"Police said detectives are still investigating the case and will likely have no further comment. Any new information will probably come after police forward te case to the district attorney, who will decide whether to file charges."

“For a wrong cause, we can accept any responsibility,” said Parker’s sister, Brittany Baldwin. “We can own up to that. But for him to lay my brother in the ground was absolutely wrong.

What total crap--
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Old May 24, 2009, 12:26 PM   #7
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But as he started to chase after the second robber he looked back to see the 16-year-old he had shot in the head getting up again. Ersland said he then emptied the Kel-Tec .380 into the boy’s chest."
No comment on this one? Was he going for the gun? Was he up? Could the pharmacist have subdued him without this additional use of deadly force? Was the threat over?

If he was shot on the ground, with a gun no where near him, would you all still be applauding? Could he in fact have been acting with an animus and have simply executed this young man?

As we dont have all the facts here, could it be that the protesters were right? Do they know something the press isnt telling us?

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Old May 24, 2009, 12:26 PM   #8
Kyo
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there's another article talking about "my brother didn't intend to rob that store" man people are so in denial these days about others.
Would I shoot someone again if they got back up during a robbery? Yes. I would. Do I care if they have a gun? No, the fact that they got up is enough to put them back down
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Old May 24, 2009, 12:40 PM   #9
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No, the fact that they got up is enough to put them back down
Really...so a badly wounded robber is attempting to get up. He is not a threat, so you just shoot him anyway?

Leave your Hollywood world folks, one is not judge, jury and executioner. The justifiable use of deadly force is over when the threat is removed. That is an objective question was well as subjective. The guy bleeding out on the floor struggling to get up with his gun 12 feet away is not a threat necessitating you stand over him and pump rounds into his chest.

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Old May 24, 2009, 12:55 PM   #10
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if he is trying to get back up after i shot him(and he shot at me) i am assuming he is still a threat, and going to continue the attack. im not going to wait to see if he goes for his gun, or charges me to get mine.
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Old May 24, 2009, 01:30 PM   #11
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That’s what the Second Amendment ....... (is) for, he said.

NOPE
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Old May 24, 2009, 01:53 PM   #12
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Let's see, SC Highway Patrolman Mark Hunter Coates was killed by a .22 by a downed suspect he had shot multiple times with a .357 magnum. Coates was shot while radioing in the battle with the suspect. The suspect started trying to get up and Coates kept telling him to stay down and unrealized by Coates, the suspect's moving around was him drawing his .22 that he then used to shoot Coates.

Coates didn't think he was going for a gun, apparently, and just thought the suspect was trying to get up.
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Old May 24, 2009, 02:05 PM   #13
garryc
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Well if I'm on his jury he'd walk.

Is he trained to evaluate a dynamic situation like this? Nope

Would a reasonable man consider the robber a threat? Yes

Did he believe the man was still armed? Maybe
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Old May 24, 2009, 02:08 PM   #14
Kyo
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ok alaska, you go ahead and wait for the guy to get up to see what he does next, im gonna stick with "hollywood" aka common sense, and not take chances. Dude already attacked me multiple times. You gonna wait for him to get up to see what he does? Who's thought is more movie like?
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Old May 24, 2009, 02:11 PM   #15
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Coates didn't think he was going for a gun, apparently, and just thought the suspect was trying to get up.
Yup, and this guy isn't in great condition to be bending down to check on the criminal's well being anyway. I don't know what I would have done, maybe stepped on his chest and told him to stay down. But, I don't have the physical liabilities this man has. I also don't know that I wouldn't have done the same thing. And the idiots outside the pharmacy shouting racism are the true racists.

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Well if I'm on his jury he'd walk.
Same here.
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Old May 24, 2009, 02:55 PM   #16
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The guy bleeding out on the floor struggling to get up with his gun 12 feet away is not a threat necessitating you stand over him and pump rounds into his chest.
Twelve feet away? Where did you read that? And why wouldn't you expect that he might have another weapon, anyway?
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Old May 24, 2009, 03:52 PM   #17
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People who are shot can still kill you!!

If this individual were making purposeful movements and had just shot me do you think I would still consider him a threat? Could he be carrying another weapon? Absolutely!!

Was this inidividual in a panic/shock state who was just shot and saw the person he shot in the head still moving--- possibly to shoot him again now guilty because he considered the shooter still a threat?? I think not.

First shot a head shot? Look at some Pharmacy counters they are chest high and all you can see are head and shoulders.That may have been all he could see.

What would you do if you had been shot and the threat is still moving?Decide this in a matter of tenths of a seconds.I may have done the same thing.

Don't Monday morning quarterback. Put yourself in the shoes this person who just got shot--

If I am on a jury this guy walks. The shooter started the whole chain of events.Once you cross that line and may still be a threat your fair game.
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Old May 24, 2009, 04:35 PM   #18
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Don't Monday morning quarterback. Put yourself in the shoes this person who just got shot--
Im not Monday morning quarterbacking. Im asking questions based on a paucity of the evidence, whilst some here are automatically assuming a good shoot based on the same paucity.

So...white war veteran shoots young black armed robber. ALL of the facts arent out...some black folks scream rascism and say Bad shoot. Some white folks say good shoot. Is there a difference?

Let me ask again: if this guy stood over this shot kid and pumped rounds into his chest why he was struggling to get up, with out more, you would all consider that a good shoot? If thats what happened.? "Cuz under the law, thats manslaughter or CNH and a prosecutor worth hlf his salt could get a conviction.

I wish Mas Ayoob would pop on and give us some insight, I'd love to hear from an expert

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Old May 24, 2009, 04:45 PM   #19
Kyo
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The kid wasn't in front of him. As he started to chase the other one, the first one got up. Thats the story anyway.
But lets entertain the thought. What if this guy was right in front of the kid when he was getting up? Is he wrong to empty his gun into him? How do we know that the kid wasn't reaching for something as he was getting up. How do we know he wasn't going for his weapon again?
If you get back up, you are in the fight. If you are down, you are still in the fight. You are in the fight until your dead.
Let me say something very obvious. If the pharmacist was black this wouldn't be an issue. The problem everyone is having is that the kid was black, and 16. Well, he's still the ARMED robber. Age doesn't matter, and race doesn't either. The family of the kid want people to feel sorry for him? Seriously? He chose this. He chose to walk in and shoot a gun at innocent people. The pharmacist didn't decide he was going to kill some kid today, the kid decided to kill people in that store today. Lets really get into perspective here. The kid died cause he tried to kill others. If the family wants to be ******, be ****** at the idiot 16 year old who decided it was ok to rob, shoot, and attack people. If that guy was my dad I would press charges against the family for slander.
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Old May 24, 2009, 04:54 PM   #20
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If you are down, you are still in the fight. You are in the fight until your dead.
really? So whenever a police officer is forced to shoot a person, he should then walk over to the downed person and fire one last shot into the perp to make sure they are dead?

Care to show me a statute or case law that supports that position?

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Old May 24, 2009, 05:04 PM   #21
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If you are going to play devils advocate, you need to keep in mind that this gentleman was crippled (as per his description of his condition). I would think that this would make the 16 yr old boy a little more of a threat to him.
In my mind, I picture the boy getting up maybe to run, maybe to attack (He did tell the guy that he was going to die).
From the looks of the device this guy is wearing and having back problems myself, I don't see where you could perceive a bad shoot scenario.

Crippled older war veteran vs. 16 yr old gun slinging robber (even if he is wounded)...It's kind of obvious.
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Old May 24, 2009, 05:21 PM   #22
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I don't know if Im for or against what the guy did to the kid trying to get up because I don't know the facts.

I will say this though. He has a back brace on, he had already been shot once, the guy that shot him was attempting to get back up. I don't think I would shoot him but I was not in the guys shoes so ill never know. The kid could have been getting up quickly scrambling. I have met a guy who goes around doing religous seminars because he was shot dead center of the forehead with a .38, managed to run away and get to a hospital, (this was in argentina) and made a full recovery amazingly quickly (2 months i think)
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Old May 24, 2009, 05:30 PM   #23
glock06
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The rascist suff is total garbage and a smokescreen to divert attention away from the wannabe killer.It's all total BS manufactored by idiots who see the world as owing them something--thus they can commit acts of evil and rationally be justified. The shooter made a choice to go in and try to shoot and kill another person. Should he be allowed to kill and maim and be given every consideration because he is a "victim" of society? He got what he deserved--rough justice instead.

Do you think the Pharmacist really cared if the shooter was purple or polka dotted??This man was responding to save his life after being shot and acting to save the lives of others.Unless there is a glaring crime here-- God can sort it out with the pharmacist in the next life.Only the Pharmacist knows what he was thinking! Give this guy the benefit of the doubt!

Again, if these events happened in a blur, I believe any rational person should believe this guy walks.
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Old May 24, 2009, 05:32 PM   #24
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The article does not say weather the kid still had the gun in his hand or not. We can sit here a pick it apart but none of us were there. I have to say from what the article said it is a good shoot. He saved three lives, The robbers shot unprovoked.

If we would of been one of the sheep in the heard we would be dead, because he carried "LEGALLY" he and his coworkers alive.

I wonder if the pharmacist would have died would the young black kid have been a racist? Or just misunderstood youth.
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Old May 24, 2009, 05:47 PM   #25
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This is for you Wild!

http://www.koco.com/news/19543055/detail.html

Quote:
Jerome Ersland said he shot Antwun Parker, 16, because he feared for his own life, but Parker’s family said that the Ersland didn’t need to shoot to kill.
Quote:
“For a wrong cause, we can accept any responsibility,” said Parker’s sister, Brittany Baldwin. “We can own up to that. But for him to lay my brother in the ground was absolutely wrong.”
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Last edited by Double Naught Spy; May 25, 2009 at 08:08 AM.
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