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Old April 6, 2009, 03:14 AM   #1
Dingoboyx
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The top 10 worst pistols?

I was just reading Juggernaught Red's thread on the Jennings J.22 and it was mentioned this is in the list of the 10 worst pistols

Just wondering how come it is so bad? and what other pistols come in the worst 10? And why are they so bad?

Two reasons for this question/thread

1/ In case I already have one
2/ So I can avoid getting stuck with one if one crosses my path some day

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Old April 6, 2009, 04:53 AM   #2
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1. Lorcin/9mm.

I don't know if they are made in any other caliber but I do know that this particular one is worthy of being dismantled and burried, tossed in the river, etc. A friend of mine purchased one, fired 3 standard 9mm rounds through it and it seized up.
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Old April 6, 2009, 05:18 AM   #3
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Japanese Type 94

The Type 94 used the same 8x22mm Nambu (.315 inch) ammunition as the Type 14 and was easier to load, having a much stronger firing mechanism to reduce misfires. The gun became notorious for a design flaw that allowed it to be fired with a round in the chamber by pressing a projecting sear on the left-hand side of the receiver. Some officers told stories of slipping and falling in the mud, inadvertently triggering the pistol and injuring themselves. How often this resulted in accidental discharge is a matter of debate, but the gun was a commercial failure, and is frequently described as the "worst service pistol ever issued" by knowledgeable authors such as Ian V. Hogg

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_94_8_mm_Pistol

Unlikely you will ever be stuck with one unless you want to.
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Old April 6, 2009, 06:58 AM   #4
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The older Type 14 Nambu was more ugly, however:

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Old April 6, 2009, 07:10 AM   #5
Dingoboyx
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^^^^^^^^^

Geeeeeeeeeeeeeeez

Thats one UGLY gun :barf:

Did they shoot any better than they look?

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Old April 6, 2009, 07:11 AM   #6
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I don't know about the Jennings but the Hi Point 9mm should have been close to the top of that list.
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Old April 6, 2009, 07:26 AM   #7
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Skip on the Jennings for sure. I removed machine marks on too many that I sold, just to get them to feed. Finally quit stocking them. If you get one that works, that are good little tackle box guns...no big loss if it falls out of the boat.
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Old April 6, 2009, 07:35 AM   #8
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Quote:
Just wondering how come it is so bad?
There's a number of reasons why the Jennings is a very bad pistol. The main reason is that it's made from inferior materials... a "pot metal" pistol made not from forged or even cast steel like many/most handguns, but zinc and alloys. Cheap to manufacture.

Next is that it's a cheap design with inherent weak points... shoot one enough and you'll break something. The trigger bar is a thin, stamped piece and sits right under the grip panel. It's an oft-broken piece.

Another problem is typical of most small pistols... with a short barrel, a tiny grip, microscopic sights and a horribly short sighting plane, it's a mother effer to shoot accurately. Some of this is due to the nature of a small pistol, some of it is because of the lack of precision in the design. Either way, it's not at all what you'd call accurate.

The problem that is most obvious is that it jams a lot. Could be the design of the "feed ramp" or the cheap magazines or the wildy varying nature of different .22LR rounds, but add them all up and most of these pistols jam often. Some of them can also fire out of battery if the round doesn't seat fully. When that happens, the case head of the .22 round bursts and shrapnel flies.

It shouldn't be carried anywhere with a round in the chamber. It's striker fired and not well-built, so an unexpected discharge is highly possible, The safety mechanism is a black plastic lever. If you have one of these, you should only chamber a round when standing at the firing line or staring down a threat.

All of these are valid reasons why many folks think these are the worst pistols ever built. Personally, I do NOT agree that they are the worst. Fact is, almost everyone around here has heard of one and many folks have owned one. A lot of folks have shot them! That means that they made a zillion of them. The fact that they made a zillion doesn't make them good pistols, but it does put them in the public's consciousness. If they only made 30 of them, nobody would know that they are of low quality.

What I'm saying is that I'm sure there are many worse handguns out there, but not many of them have sold as many as the Jennings.

I write this from the perspective of someone who owns one. Bought mine new in the early 90s. For FIFTY NINE DOLLARS. Nickel finish, black grips, it's a very nice looking little pistol. Mine has seen at least a thousand rounds and hasn't yet broken anything. Yes, it jams, but it's not 2 or 3 per magazine... it's more like one jam per 3 or 4 magazines. For the $59 I paid for it, it works awfully damn well. It's no target pistol, but I can hit things with it.

IMO, it's not the worst pistol ever, but it might be one of the single most popular, most common of all the cheap pistols made. The design is now produced by Jimenez and is still sold. Best I can tell, no changes have been made. And if you run a web search, you'll find a whole forum of enthusiasts of this pistol!
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Old April 6, 2009, 07:49 AM   #9
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Kel-tec P40. It was NOT a better P11.

S&W 59. Early first model I bought would not even feed fmj ammo.

Polish P64. The Soviet/Russian, E. German, Bulgarian and even the Chinese Makarovs, PA63, RK59, R61 and CZ82 are all better formats for the 9x18mm Mak ctg.

AMT Hardballer. Two I handled were jam-a-matics.

F.I.E. Never met one I liked except for a Colt Jr Clone in .25

L.E.S. Rogak P18. This was a monsterous sight to behold, or hold.

Helwan 9mm - Arab copy of an earlier Beretta

All cited from personal experience. All jammers except the P40, it would not even fire a ctg to jam.
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Old April 6, 2009, 11:44 AM   #10
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My personal worst is the CZ 52. I had to wear gloves as it would cut my middle finger firing it. It also shot 1' low at 15 yards for some reason.
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Old April 6, 2009, 12:11 PM   #11
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Quote:
Polish P64. The Soviet/Russian, E. German, Bulgarian and even the Chinese Makarovs, PA63, RK59, R61 and CZ82 are all better formats for the 9x18mm Mak ctg.
Hmmm! Many of us are very fond of our small, sturdy and reliable P-64s. It would never occur to me that anyone would put it on a list of "worst pistols."
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Old April 6, 2009, 12:16 PM   #12
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Grendel p12:barf:
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Old April 6, 2009, 12:26 PM   #13
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Quote:
The older Type 14 Nambu was more ugly, however:
Really? Are you sure? I am not sure but the Type 14 at least had no issues with the sear.

The type 14 came out in 1915 originally - I can forgive designers that long go.

The type 94 in 1934 - no excuse for this design at this late date in history.







What a choice.
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Old April 6, 2009, 12:37 PM   #14
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Hmmm! Many of us are very fond of our small, sturdy and reliable P-64s. It would never occur to me that anyone would put it on a list of "worst pistols."
I have handled two. Neither were too relaible. In all fairness, I think the mags were the worst feature and contributed to most of the problems.
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Old April 6, 2009, 12:38 PM   #15
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CZ-52 is definitely up there. I shot one at 21' once, there were 5 targets stapled up. Managed to hit every target once (put 5 rounds through it).
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Old April 6, 2009, 05:52 PM   #16
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RG 22. What a piece of dung.
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Old April 7, 2009, 04:30 AM   #17
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worst pistols

cz52 had one jammed no matter what

p3at jammed ever clip brand new
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Old April 7, 2009, 06:18 AM   #18
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Oh, and how could I forget.

























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Old April 7, 2009, 07:21 AM   #19
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My AMT Hardballer that I traded a Taurus 357 for was a jam-amatic when I first got it ten years ago.
I worked on it and got it to feed and shoot reliably.
Nothing to write home about, but I did like it better than the 3" Taurus.
The Taurus slung lead slivers sideways where the cylinder met the barrel.
Shooters next to me were in danger.
Recently I put an old barrel from my spare parts into it. Fitted it up nicely.
The original barrel was let me say "loose".
Interestingly the replacement is a 4 land and groove RH twist.
I forget where it came from. Maybe an old Auto Ordinance barrel?
Worked on the front bushing, smoothed out the trigger, new/old hammer from spare parts. Got lucky the original thumb safety worked fine.
The AMT shoots quite well now. 3 inches at 25 yards from a bench, with my 180 grain semi wad cutter loads, 4.9 grains of Clays.
Reliable too, with metal form stainless, 7 round mags.
The magazine release holes in the frame are .030" low from standard, so the magazines aren't tight when installed. They do feed well, why I don't know.
The adjustable sights work well. I've got them set for a bullsaye hold at 25 yards.
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Old April 7, 2009, 07:36 AM   #20
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Quote:
There's a number of reasons why the Jennings is a very bad pistol. The main reason is that it's made from inferior materials... a "pot metal" pistol made not from forged or even cast steel like many/most handguns, but zinc and alloys. Cheap to manufacture.

Next is that it's a cheap design with inherent weak points... shoot one enough and you'll break something. The trigger bar is a thin, stamped piece and sits right under the grip panel. It's an oft-broken piece.

Another problem is typical of most small pistols... with a short barrel, a tiny grip, microscopic sights and a horribly short sighting plane, it's a mother effer to shoot accurately. Some of this is due to the nature of a small pistol, some of it is because of the lack of precision in the design. Either way, it's not at all what you'd call accurate.

The problem that is most obvious is that it jams a lot. Could be the design of the "feed ramp" or the cheap magazines or the wildy varying nature of different .22LR rounds, but add them all up and most of these pistols jam often. Some of them can also fire out of battery if the round doesn't seat fully. When that happens, the case head of the .22 round bursts and shrapnel flies.

It shouldn't be carried anywhere with a round in the chamber. It's striker fired and not well-built, so an unexpected discharge is highly possible, The safety mechanism is a black plastic lever. If you have one of these, you should only chamber a round when standing at the firing line or staring down a threat.
I have a Jennings .22 (chrome with wood grips). I purchased it in 1989 new. I've put over a thousand rounds through it - more than most people typically put through this gun. Don't forget, it was never meant to be a range gun.

I have never broken any part on the gun. It functions reliably, so long as you keep it clean. It will jam when it gets dirty, but no more so than my Ruger Mark II. CCI Stingers work best in it, but cheap .22 ammo works ok for the most part. The magazine isn't all that sturdy and you need to be careful with it. The gun will "bite" the web of your hand since the grip is small.

I have carried my little Jennings .22 when I go on long motorcycle rides - toss it in my pocket or in with my sleeping bag and forget about it.

What can I say? The Jennings goes "bang" when I pull the trigger. What more do you really want for $70? Valuewise, I got way more than what I ever expected to get out of this gun. Personally I feel that those people who criticize the J-.22 have never really used it or put it to the test. They just don't like the fact that it's cheap, and that it's not made out of high quality steel forgings. They probably really hate the chrome one the most (bty, my J-22's chrome is still in excelent condition)

I also have a Lorcin .380. The PO had to have the extractor replaced twice, so I know that there is a potential problem with extractors on this gun. So far it's worked fine for me, but I hardly ever shoot it.
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Old April 7, 2009, 07:43 AM   #21
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Jimenez, the "Gang-Bangers" favorite... Our pawn-shops sell them like "hot-cakes".
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Old April 7, 2009, 09:01 AM   #22
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Just about anything AMT.
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Old April 7, 2009, 12:28 PM   #23
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Quote:
I have a Jennings .22 (chrome with wood grips). I purchased it in 1989 new. I've put over a thousand rounds through it - more than most people typically put through this gun. Don't forget, it was never meant to be a range gun.

I have never broken any part on the gun. It functions reliably, so long as you keep it clean. It will jam when it gets dirty, but no more so than my Ruger Mark II. CCI Stingers work best in it, but cheap .22 ammo works ok for the most part. The magazine isn't all that sturdy and you need to be careful with it. The gun will "bite" the web of your hand since the grip is small.

I have carried my little Jennings .22 when I go on long motorcycle rides - toss it in my pocket or in with my sleeping bag and forget about it.

What can I say? The Jennings goes "bang" when I pull the trigger. What more do you really want for $70? Valuewise, I got way more than what I ever expected to get out of this gun. Personally I feel that those people who criticize the J-.22 have never really used it or put it to the test. They just don't like the fact that it's cheap, and that it's not made out of high quality steel forgings. They probably really hate the chrome one the most (bty, my J-22's chrome is still in excelent condition)
Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.
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Old April 8, 2009, 12:36 AM   #24
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"Jimenez, the "Gang-Bangers" favorite... Our pawn-shops sell them like "hot-cakes"."

I see those Jimenez pistols here in Colorado, always wondered how good they were, but never plan on buying one. They have "Saturday Night Special" written all over them.
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Old April 8, 2009, 12:46 AM   #25
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Raven Arms.22 jammed every other shot.

Somewhere there's a web site that shows how to fix the problem with a pocket knife and a nail file. Not worth the effort.
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