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Old May 30, 2009, 06:11 PM   #376
Winterhawk56
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Reloading Supplies

I do think everyone is hording the primers, powder and brass but I have also noted that bullets are almost impossible to get.

Last edited by Winterhawk56; May 31, 2009 at 10:33 PM.
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Old May 31, 2009, 10:44 AM   #377
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The "Smoking Gun"? self inflicted wounds to the Gun Industry?

http://www.klewtv.com/news/37309514.html

8% of their employees were let go before 1-20-2209 during the height of the primer shortage!

and federal did the same in November of 08!

http://www.startribune.com/business/33942554.html

they got our attention by making a political statement to all owners of guns who reload.

We are their puppets?

Quote:

What is clear is that every gun seller — not to mention every advocacy group for gun ownership that depends on dues-paying members — has an incentive to stoke the concern that can prompt a gun sale. Political uncertainty, gun dealers say, is great for business. … “Clinton was the best gun salesman the gun manufacturers ever had,” said Rick Gray, owner of the Accuracy Gun Shop in Las Vegas. “Obama’s going to be right up there with him"
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Old May 31, 2009, 10:54 AM   #378
tiberius10721
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I sincerely believe that we are shipping ammunition out of the country to mexico ,china and god knows who else.this stinks of conspiracy!over a period of a few months we have practically been disarmed!
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Old May 31, 2009, 11:02 AM   #379
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I buy all my once-fired brass at Walmart. Well, actually it comes in a kit with bullet, powder, primer and brass. You take the round, put it in a gun, and manufacture your own once-fired brass and then reload that.



That made my day..........


Quote:
I sincerely believe that we are shipping ammunition out of the country to mexico ,china and god knows who else.this stinks of conspiracy!over a period of a few months we have practically been disarmed!
Speaking of China, where are they in all this. Seams they would have reverse engineered American made primers at his point and flooded the market with cheap knock off Primers by now. Where are the Chinese when you need them.........
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Old May 31, 2009, 11:42 AM   #380
James R. Burke
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I have about what I need for awhile. I could use bullets, and have noticed they are alittle hard to come by now. I placed a order for my wife thru Cabelas, and for the heck of it ordered 50 new winchester 30-06 cases. Three days later they where at my door. I was a litttle surprized thought they would be b.o. but the lady I was talking to said they had them in stock.
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Old May 31, 2009, 01:53 PM   #381
tiberius10721
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Speaking of China, where are they in all this. Seams they would have reverse engineered American made primers at his point and flooded the market with cheap knock off Primers by now. Where are the Chinese when you need them..

in reply to this I think its cheaper for other countries to get materials like brass,copper,gunpowder and lead from the united states than to make their own bullets.our trade deficits are so large it wouldnt suprise me to see america trading munitions for loans from other countries!do I sound paranoid "you damn right I do!"
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Old June 1, 2009, 10:47 PM   #382
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For 5 minutes today Midwayusa had CCI #500 Small pistol primers in stock. That shows that CCI primers are coming back on the market and when they do they are selling out quickly. Of course I don't know How many they received ( The total population of primers received in shipment), but they were selling at a decent price for today's new world order at $29.99 per 1,000.
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Old June 1, 2009, 10:48 PM   #383
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Here is my view of it, with 145,000 in one country and 35,000 troops in another and 5 years of war, that's about 180,000 men under arms, if each use 10 bullets a day that's 1,800,000 needed each day or 657,000,000 each year or 3 billion 285 million over the last 5 years (3,285,000,000). Now, lets see how many one of these plaines or choppers use 5 or 10,000 per mission. Well the point is that I don't think we can make enough bullets a day to keep this up. Now if we were using 7.62x39 china would be happy to sell us all we need. Geee I wonder why we keep losing these wars. Since there are only two (2) plants in the US that make gun powder (1 in NY and 1 in FL) I find it interesting that there is any gun powder on the shelves.
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Old June 2, 2009, 07:08 AM   #384
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There exists the very real possibility that the “shortage” of components caused by the “demand” factor is right now an unstated and unwritten policy of a thoroughly anti-gun administration using the “demand” side of the equation to their advantage. Think about it for a minute. We all pretty much agree with the supply-demand theory of economics. We know the “supply” is limited and we know that “demand” is the reason. But what exactly does the “demand” pie chart look like!!!! No one is considering this side of the equation from a truly knowledgeable position. This data is known by someone and don’t let anyone tell you otherwise. It’s just a sad fact that neither you nor I will ever see it. I’ll bet my hard-earned (soon to be worthless) yankee dollars that if you could see the actual distribution of “demand” across the 3 most mentioned purchasers of ammo (the Feds, the police and the consumer) the largest increase in “demand” will be from the Feds by leaps and bounds. Yes, the consumer is panic buying, yes the police are too, BUT…..with trillions of bucks now at their command, the anti-gun Obama-ites will write contract after contract after contract to “soak” up and store away any and all “supply” that America's increasingly anemic industrial base is capable of producing. Guys, I hope and pray I’m wrong…….but don’t look for an increase in “supply” stemming from a slackening of “demand” on the consumer side (I've already quit buying) because if it does happen as many want to believe, Obama just ain’t going to allow it (can you say... time for a new follow-on contract or modification or extension, ad infinitum). Someone out there PLEASE stick a pin in my balloon and put me out of my misery over this ammo mess by showing me (if you can) where all this “demand” is truly going.
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Old June 2, 2009, 09:24 AM   #385
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A Black Helicopter just flew over my house.
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Old June 2, 2009, 10:00 AM   #386
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Demand

I work (won't name any names) in a major retail chain that sells both ammo and guns. Over the last two months the demand has definitely exceeded the supply coming in. In the past we would sell maybe 250 to 300 boxes of pistol ammunition a week TOTAL. Now, we can get in 400 or 500 boxes of ONE CALIBER and sell through that in a matter of less than one full operating day.

So, my take on this entire situation is that it is mostly self inflicted. Whenever every person who comes in buys 10 boxes of every caliber on the shelf my cases do not last long. And then the next guy comes in and sees an empty shelf, which causes him to buy 10 boxes on the next time in. I can honestly say that I do not believe there is any behind the scenes foil cap government conspiracy going on here. I find that most of the people on this board are fairly well grounded on their opinions and see things big picture. But I can not tell you how overall un-educated the majority of people are on ammo regulations. I still hear them tell me they are buying ten boxes and will be sending their buddy in for more because "Obama has ALREADY passed a law that will raise the price 500%." Or the expiring primer issue, or because it is all being outlawed. That is where the problem comes from, millions of casual gun owners who believe everything they see in emails and NRA propaganda.

The silver lining is that when this thing does pass, we WILL see prices come down. Simply because every Bubba in the USA who normally shoots maybe 4 or 5 boxes a year will have about a lifetime supply sitting in his house. Ammo sales will come down to a crawl, and if the current administration is going to hit us it will be then, not now.
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Old June 2, 2009, 10:26 AM   #387
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"There exists the very real possibility that the “shortage” of components caused by the “demand” factor is right now an unstated and unwritten policy of a thoroughly anti-gun administration using the “demand” side of the equation to their advantage."

Uhm... right.

And NO one from any of the PRIVATE corporations that have been affected by a nefarious and sinister gubmint's machinations has said word one about it, whether in public or anonymously...

And why would that be?

Adminstration officials administer lie detector tests to every employee in these companies every day to make sure they're not telling stories?

Every employee at these companies has been spirited away to some secret island (the same one where they keep all the passengers from the 9-11 flights) and replaced with computerized clones loyal to the administration?

The National Rifle Association isn't addressing these nefarious plots why? Because Wayne La Pierre and Obama secretly cut a deal of some kind?

And, did you know that we're not actually fighting two overseas wars right now? Our troops AREN'T in Iraq or Afghanistan, they're providing security on that secret island. As such, they're not using any ammo at all, so they're sitting on billions and billions of rounds of ammunition that has been shipped to the island to keep it out of the hands of consumers. All of our military men and women are in on it, too!

I still maintain a few contacts inside the industry, complements of my days as associate editor of American Rifleman magazine. Not as many as I once had, but people with long-term management careers with these companies.

Their take on all of these rumors (ranging from Obama to the UN causing these problems?)

A nice, hearty laugh, combined with an explanation about how they have NEVER seen consumer demand for product this high for this extended period a time.

The only correlary to this is what happened in the months just before World War II started for the United States when companies began to change over to a war-time footing.

These conspiracy theories are moderately amusing to read, but like most conspiracy theories, they take a known even and wrap it in imagination, invention, and sinister intention to arrive at something that just doesn't make any sense, doesn't have a bit of support, and has no basis in reality.
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Old June 2, 2009, 02:29 PM   #388
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I'm not spinning conspiracy theories. I'm just telling anyone who will listen that it is a fact that no one (former insiders, current insiders, NRA, Gov't contract buyers or whoever) is credably addressing the "demand side of this equation with real numbers . The blame gamers are simply laying this whole mess on the ammo buying public. I don't have the numbers and you don't have the numbers. Until someone with the numbers stands up and makes them known we will remain in the dark. As I said, I hope that I am wrong. I pray that I am wrong. Time will tell. If this unprecedented "demand" is caused more by us poor goobers, it won't last 'cause us poor goobers will run out of money. But if this situation just keeps on like a bad toothache, you need to considered what I said. Time will tell.
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Old June 2, 2009, 02:34 PM   #389
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Old June 2, 2009, 04:20 PM   #390
James R. Burke
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I know alot or retialers big and small. Ma and Pa shops, and by name the people that work at Wal-Mart etc. Small town so you get to know most folks. I hear the same from all of them. They get a shipment in, and it is bought out has fast as they can sell it. Most of them have been good with the prices. I know the guys that work at Wal-Mart they get pallets in of 22 rimfire set them on the floor and there gone. I believe they have a limit on how much you can buy. Like one guy told me he is seeing people who never buy ammo just buying has fast as they get it in. The small shops I go two, and we are on a first name basis same thing. They are having a harder time getting it but when they do it is gone. Most of them have put limits on the amount you can buy at one time. There saying the folks who use to buy 300 or 500 primers are now wanting to buy 5,000 at a time. They just cant keep up. I E-Mailed Hodgon asking about powder. They said they are running and making powder has fast as they can. They said there worried when this ends the small shops wont be selling much because everyone is going to have alot of powder, and it might cause some shops to go under. We have been thru a few wars before. So is it the War factor? Is it hoarding? Is it some type of plot? I had a shop hold one pound of Varget for me when they were unloading the truck. I had my son in law pick it up, and he said that was the only one left. If they would not have held it for me it would have been gone. That was in a two hour period. So draw your own conclusion, I believe I know what it is. Just my thoughts.
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Old June 2, 2009, 04:34 PM   #391
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Wideners got Federal SP Natch primers in today and was sold out in minutes.

Powder valley has upgraded Federal SPM and LPM, CCI #34 and #41 primers to "out of stock".
That is from not showing them at all and would seem to indicate some are on the way.

This will start to break soon and with so much bought (and not shot) a point in the supply/demand balance will shift.

Once it does I expect prices to start to pull back the eventually plunge by year's end or early Spring.

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Old June 2, 2009, 07:04 PM   #392
James R. Burke
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Wulfmann is correct. There will be a point like I said before that folks will have enough or be broke doing it.
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Old June 4, 2009, 04:33 PM   #393
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Natchez has CCI SP primers in stock since this morning. Still in stock as of 5:30p.

http://www.natchezss.com/product.cfm...0014&src=tpCtg
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Old June 4, 2009, 09:30 PM   #394
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Finally got a projected arrival date of June 30th for my Cabela's backorder of primers placed back in April. My brand new Dillon 650 is just sitting idle for now. I ordered it with .223 dies, but all I have been able to get so far is large and small pistol primers. Not ready to spend the couple $100 yet on any more caliber conversions until I get everything I need. Still scavenging Wally world for factory ammo.
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Old June 5, 2009, 08:34 PM   #395
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Found some Winchester large pistol primers at Fin Feather Fur in Ohio $39.95/1000 which I think is HIGH but I'll take what I can get.
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Old June 5, 2009, 08:42 PM   #396
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I have to admit.. I'm hoarding brass like a mofo... but it's all once fired stuff... so not really

I am however buying copious quantities of bullets powder and primers as I come across them.
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Old June 5, 2009, 09:06 PM   #397
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Quote:
I'm not spinning conspiracy theories. I'm just telling anyone who will listen that it is a fact that no one (former insiders, current insiders, NRA, Gov't contract buyers or whoever) is credably addressing the "demand side of this equation with real numbers . The blame gamers are simply laying this whole mess on the ammo buying public. I don't have the numbers and you don't have the numbers. Until someone with the numbers stands up and makes them known we will remain in the dark. As I said, I hope that I am wrong. I pray that I am wrong. Time will tell. If this unprecedented "demand" is caused more by us poor goobers, it won't last 'cause us poor goobers will run out of money. But if this situation just keeps on like a bad toothache, you need to considered what I said. Time will tell.
I think you're right. I know that no one around me is hoarding ammo because it's not available to hoard. Walmart is getting ammo at a rate of 2 to 4 boxes of 50 per week! Now we all know that is not at all keeping up with their pre-election sales pace. There is more going on that we don't know.
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Old June 8, 2009, 09:23 AM   #398
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Midway had magnum small pistol primers this morning
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Old June 8, 2009, 12:11 PM   #399
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Nice guy in a brown truck just came to the door and handed me 5,000 primers! I'm doing my happy dance!
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Old June 8, 2009, 12:39 PM   #400
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"I'm just telling anyone who will listen that it is a fact that no one (former insiders, current insiders, NRA, Gov't contract buyers or whoever) is credably addressing the "demand side of this equation with real numbers"

What are you talking about?

Many news organizations, the major companies, and NRA are ALL saying that demand for firearms and accessories is through the roof, and has been for months to the point where they simply can't keep up.

In fact, this is a passage from today's issue of the Virginian-Pilot:

"Applications for concealed-carry permits statewide have jumped 42 percent from the same period last year, when the state issued a record number, according to the Virginia Supreme Court. In South Hampton Roads, this year's requests are running nearly 40 percent over last year's. Most are granted.

In May, the number of active concealed-weapons permits in Virginia reached 188,900,

according to the Virginia State Police. More people than ever are eligible to carry concealed handguns in the state.

Reported firearms sales by licensed dealers and gun shops in Virginia have also skyrocketed.

Dealers sold 60 percent more guns in November 2008 than they had in November 2007, according to State Police records. Sales by licensed dealers are on pace to break last year's record by more than 30 percent. The totals do not include private sales.
"

Those kinds of numbers are also being reported across the nation. It's a pretty good indication that people are buying a lot more.

Combine that with the fact that the US military makes virtually none of its ammo anymore, it's made under contract with the civilian manufacturers.

You'll also ignoring the fact that this situation started to develop MONTHS before the Obama administration even took office.

Many people first started seeing supply pinches as early as late last spring early last summer when it became painfully clear that the Republicans were going to lose, and lose big, in the November elections.

Let's see, last June was what... 5 months before the Presidential election, and almost 8 months before the Democrats took control of the White House?

How did Obama manage to pull that off when he wasn't even President Elect Obama yet?

You've also not given any indication OR proof of just how the administration could collude with the various manufacturers as a matter of administration policy.

So, your argument blames nefarious forces/policies in the administration, your argument has nothing but your own supposition to back it up, and your argument flies in the face of what industry, news, and other groups are reporting.

So what have we got, in a nutshell?

The ANTI-GUN ADMINISTRATION is CONSPIRING to deprive us of our primers and bullets, and were doing so BEFORE they even won the nomination.


I'm sorry, but that's a classic example of a conspiracy theory.


If, however, you actually have some hard and fast PROOF that the Obama administration is manipulating the commercial market in a way that would be both incredibly hard to hid and in a way that would be likely very illegal, I'm more than willing to entertain it.

And by proof I mean actually traceable documents, not a statement from someone on heard it from someone who heard it from someone who got it from a guy who works in a gun store and who was talking with an "industry rep."
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