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Old March 17, 2009, 09:59 PM   #1
A/C Guy
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D.O.D. Reverses order to Destroy once fired brass.

http://www.jpfo.org/alerts03/alert20090317.htm
Quote:
Dear MSSA Friends,

I just received a phone call from the office of U.S. Senator Tester of Montana to inform me that at 5:15 (EST) today a letter cosigned by Senator Tester (D-MT) and Senator Baucus (D-MT) was faxed to the Department of Defense asking DoD to reverse its new policy requiring destruction of fired military cartridge brass. At 5:30, I am told, Tester's office received a fax back from DoD saying that the brass destruction policy IS reversed.

Others report to me that they are already seeing evidence of this on the Websites of entities that liquidate surplus DoD commodities.

Our thanks go out to Senator Tester and Senator Baucus, and their staff, for getting on this problem promptly and making the reversal happen

Staff for Tester and Baucus promise they will get me the documentation for this reversal tomorrow morning. I'll forward that when I get it.

Best wishes,

Gary Marbut, president
Montana Shooting Sports Association
http://www.mtssa.org
author, Gun Laws of Montana
http://www.mtpublish.com
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Old March 17, 2009, 11:49 PM   #2
bclark1
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Confirmed at GA

http://georgia-arms.com/



This probably sends a pretty good message that we're paying attention. Gun owners should pat themselves on the back tomorrow - then go back to being hyperattentive, unyielding, overanalyzing, argumentative voters and activists who will make sure that silly pitches like this keep getting hit out of the park.
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Old March 17, 2009, 11:53 PM   #3
Playboypenguin
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It is nice to win one every now and then, but...

...something smells a bit fishy here to me.

A decided upon policy in a government riddled with red tape and protocol is halted just minutes before execution by a simple letter from two senators???

My Spider sense is tingling.
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Old March 18, 2009, 04:08 AM   #4
blume357
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the way I read the thing... if you just didn't pay attention to all

the Obamah / Brady theorist... was that someone somewhere in the department of defense just changed the code number for small arms brass.... this then required the folks that are in charge of selling the spent brass to reloading companies to send out a letter telling them they could no longer buy if for that....
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Old March 18, 2009, 07:28 AM   #5
Waitone
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I'm right there witcha, PBP. The first tingle I got was over the ex post facto nature of the order.
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Old March 18, 2009, 08:55 AM   #6
Slamfire
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Quote:
A decided upon policy in a government riddled with red tape and protocol is halted just minutes before execution by a simple letter from two senators???
Yes. And it is evident that you have no idea how powerful is an inquiry from a lowly Senate Staffer. Never mind a letter from an actual Senator.

Executive Agencies live in total fear of Congressmen. Because Congressmen can gut an agencies budget with a word to a staffer.

It can work for us, and it can work against us. But you have to let your Congressman know how you feel to make it work for us.
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Old March 18, 2009, 09:33 AM   #7
SkySlash
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Read Between The Lines!

I am absolutely thrilled this happened. This event was fairly minor, completely outside the scope of congress or the courts, but it didn't go unnoticed by the gun rights crowd. The tumultuous uproar that occurred almost instantly got the attention of multiple senators, and had the DOD moving at light speed to backtrack.

If nothing else, this event sent a clear and screeching message to DC that we are watching, we are aware, and no matter how minor or under the radar any attempts to push gun control might be, you can bet your chair we won't miss them.

We, the people, beat the NRA or any of the other "gun orgs" to the punch on this one. We were organized, we were informed, and we used resources within the system to get information to force a reversal of this "minor issue." I can assure you that level of autonomous national organization won't go unnoticed in DC.

This is the first time in my life that I have witnessed gun rights minded individuals come together on an issue without the assistance or direction of the mainstream "gun orgs." You can bet your vote that I'm not the only one among our ranks that noticed that either!

-SS
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Old March 18, 2009, 09:55 AM   #8
chris in va
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Can someone please educate me on the issue? Does the military sell spent brass to reloading companies, or how does that work?
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Old March 18, 2009, 10:10 AM   #9
Glenn E. Meyer
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Two NRA links from a friend of mine who works there:

http://www.nraila.org/media/PDFs/DLA.MilitaryBrass.pdf

http://www.nraila.org/media/PDFs/DLA_mcunningham.pdf
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Old March 18, 2009, 10:18 AM   #10
zukiphile
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I don't reload. Would anyone mind explaining the importance of government once fired brass in the market?

Is it merely a matter of availability of these items at a reasonable price, or are there items that just are not available from any other source?

Thanks in advance.
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Old March 18, 2009, 11:26 AM   #11
Powderman
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You don't reload--many shooters still don't--but this would have touched you in a significant way.

So, you're headed for the range next weekend. You have already decided to take your M1A, and work out at 100 and 200 yards, with iron sights--a bit of a challenge, but, hey--it's a fun learning experience!

You still have to go out and buy some ammunition because you only have two boxes left. Hop in the car, and head to the gun store.

When you get there, you have a choice:

1. Federal American Eagle .308/7.62 147 gr. FMJ, at about $23.00 a box of 20.

2. Federal Gold Medal Match, 168 gr Sierra MatchKing, at about $35.00 per box of 20.

3. Talon Manufacturing, 7.62, 147 gr. FMJ, at about $14.00 per box of 20.

You head with glee over to the cheap stuff, thinking, "Talon, for teh win!"

If this brass destruction directive had been implemented, you would NOT have had the choice to purchase Talon Manufacturing ammo. They load with Milsurp brass. So does HSM, Georgia Arms, and a few other ammo manufacturers that offer LOTS of ammo to the market. I believe that Black Hills still offers factory reloads--and they're darned good, too!

And consider this: if the brass destruction edict had slipped by, I'm willing to bet that mil surp projectiles would have been next.

Then a restriction on powders

Then primers, because they're dangerous explosives. See what happens (or what could happen) when the camel's nose gets under the tent?

Someone posted a long time ago that Obama and company would not have to go after guns--if they could eliminate ammunition. You can bet that someone in the current administration is cursing loudly and often that this end-run was denied and stopped in its tracks.

To that end, my thanks and gratitude go out to all who read my original post--fellow gun owners and shooters. Now, you all see what happens when we unite and push together. Can we do it again? You bet we can. And, with that in mind, let's gather our strength, take a deep breath, and in November of 2012, let's push back.

HARD.
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Old March 18, 2009, 12:45 PM   #12
armedtotheteeth
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This is great for companies such as "top Brass" that sell very good ready to load military once fired brass for "realoading" as i call it. I hate having to buy commercial cartridges and shooting them once just to get the brass.The Lake city stuff is great!
We have to be vigilant guys.
I can stare a hole plumb through the entire White House admin. I think every body is watching them pretty closely these days. Keep it up!!!
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Old March 18, 2009, 01:04 PM   #13
onthejon55
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YEE HAW! Boy is it good to win one every once in awhile!

I was getting very upset when the news of the ban first hit because i just bout all of the necessary equipment to reload.
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Old March 18, 2009, 01:06 PM   #14
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Ironically, no more than an hour ago my son called and read to me an article on this topic. The owner of Geo. Arms was livid, stating he could foresee big layoffs in his co. Now a turn-around in this policy. Thanks to all involved for getting righted. PBP, my Spider senses are very edgy but with this adminisration- edgy will more than likely become the norm .
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Old March 18, 2009, 08:01 PM   #15
b money
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I'm 120% with you Powderman, 2012 we're push'n back
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Old March 19, 2009, 06:59 AM   #16
blume357
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I have to agree that the benefit to this whole little deal maybe

the folks in D.C. getting a message.

I buy my 'real' ammo... .223 and 9mm from Georgia Arms. they buy spent brass from the D.O.D. by the millions it seems. Most of there business is selling thousands of rounds of ammo to folks like me, and I don't shoot that much.

I just still wonder, and this is one of those conspiracy theory thoughts... If somebody in the D.O.D. figured out by news reports and such that a whole lot of gun owners are buying up and not shooting but storing .223 and .308 ammo... then they wonder why it's being stored away and come to the conclusion that one day that ammo might be used against 'them'. The logical move then would be to try and stop this stock piling.

what the British should have done way before Lexington and Concord... never let the Colonials store ammo and weapons in the first place... then we would all be watching BBC and singing God Bless the Queen right now.
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Old March 19, 2009, 05:42 PM   #17
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Quote:
I'm 120% with you Powderman, 2012 we're push'n back
Wouldn't it be nice if The Great One, PBO, had to campaign in 2012 on the fact that his administration did not implement a new assault weapons ban in his first term, as he tried to pacify those of us who will be push'n back? After all, he did lie and say he supported the second amendment to get elected the first time. What spin will he have to engage in to try and fool people again? It will be fun to watch. Meanwhile, 65 democrats in the House signed a letter to AG Holder telling him to pound sand on a new assault weapons ban. It's a great start, and you can bet those folks are trying to thwart a blood bath in congress for the democrats in 2010. I'll chalk it up as another small but welcome victory in the civil rights vs. gun control war.
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Old March 19, 2009, 09:30 PM   #18
Waitone
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Another take on what just happened. It started Thursday and was over Tuesday. No national organizations. Talk radio was catching on to a problem when it was over. DoD's initiative was defeated by bloggers and forums in a very short period of time. This episode along with the Zumbo story shows what an informed, motivated group can do with proper use of the internet.

Yeah, you can bet the powers that be will come after talk radio. It is clear TPTB must control the internet first.
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Old March 19, 2009, 09:50 PM   #19
jpoolsmyd2
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Hey powderman,

Thanks for this post:
Quote:
You don't reload--many shooters still don't--but this would have touched you in a significant way.
I learned something today! I wasn't aware of the Milsurp nature of this ammo.

Thanks again!
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Old March 21, 2009, 10:04 AM   #20
Hangfire44
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Shortwave, I didn't see the last letter from Georgia Arms but one of their earlier letters explained that they had ordered their usual 30,000 pounds of once fired brass and the military refused to ship to them due to the new regulations. This was going to put a real hurt on his business and he was going to have to lay people off.
30,000 pounds sounds like a lot but it's a drop in the bucket compared to what is used in training.
HF44
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Old March 21, 2009, 10:14 PM   #21
gc70
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Quote:
Another take on what just happened. It started Thursday and was over Tuesday. No national organizations. Talk radio was catching on to a problem when it was over. DoD's initiative was defeated by bloggers and forums in a very short period of time. This episode along with the Zumbo story shows what an informed, motivated group can do with proper use of the internet.
Given the fragmented and often contradictory information about this situation, there are several ways in which it can be viewed.

The cause:
  • Administration operatives with nefarious intentions whisper to DoD to cut off the supply of used brass.
  • A DoD drone makes a small change in a technical document with large unintended consequences.
  • The DoD contractor misunderstands a change in technical requirements and conveys inaccurate information to public purchasers.
The resolution:
  • Netizens spring into action and quickly focus attention to rectify an injustice.
  • City and state agencies buying reloaded ammo demand a return to the way things were.
  • A dumb mistake was fixed.
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Old March 22, 2009, 04:25 PM   #22
Al Norris
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Aw Gee, gc70!

Ya just took the wind out of the sails of the conspiracy theorists!
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