The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Art of the Rifle: Bolt, Lever, and Pump Action

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old March 8, 2009, 01:24 AM   #1
Cummins09
Junior Member
 
Join Date: November 10, 2008
Posts: 5
Mosin Nagant vs. Rem 770

So guys I have a question for some reccomendations. I have an SKS and planned on getting an AK because they share the same ammo. The AK would be a SHTF weapon for fighting off the gov'ment/other people trying to kill me for what ever reason. I know I shouldn't put a price on my survival but I refuse to pay the rediculous prices of "assault" rifles right now, so I decided to get a bolt-action.

I'd prefer not to spend a whole lot as I'd like to buy a military style rifle right away once prices come down a bit, and being a student money isn't easy to come by.

So both rifles would be close to the same caliber; the Nagant in the normal 7.62x54r and the Rem in .30-06. These would be used more for plinkin, maybe some hunting when the season comes around but also something for gathering food/protection in a SHTF situation.

With that in mind can anyone reccomend one or the other, or another decent bolt action in the same price range that has close to the same ballistics as these too. I'd also be learning big bore bolt-action shooting with this rifle, so an easy to maintain, reliable rifle is prefered.(I know bolt action and easy to maintain are redundant, but so what )
__________________
The strength of the Pack is the Wolf.
Cummins09 is offline  
Old March 8, 2009, 03:18 AM   #2
Regolith
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 30, 2008
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 400
The Mosin-Nagant will be cheaper to buy and shoot. The Remington will probably be more accurate, won't hurt as much to shoot (thanks to an actual recoil pad rather than a steel buttplate), will have a larger and more available selection of ammo (though it will be more expensive) and has a lot more after market accessories.

If price is a BIG concern, I'd go with the Mosin-Nagant. If price isn't that big of a concern, but you'd still like to keep things relatively inexpensive, a Remington 700 SPS will work fine. They go for about $500 or so these days (I bought one in early 2008 for $480, but the price has gone up since then).

Another rifle to look into is a Savage 110. Costs a little less than the Remington and comes with an adjustable trigger, and is about as accurate.

Edit: you should be aware that if you buy the 700, you'll probably need to get a scope unless you get a 700 BDL instead of the SPS, which costs more (about $300 more, which is about what you'd end up spending on a scope anyway, unless you get a used one). Most bolt action rifles these days come without sights. The Mosin-Nagant was designed before optics were widespread, and comes with iron sights installed.

Last edited by Regolith; March 8, 2009 at 03:24 AM.
Regolith is offline  
Old March 8, 2009, 03:45 AM   #3
alberich
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 7, 2009
Location: Czech Republic
Posts: 117
Buy a strong, no fancy (ie. Ruger) 6"+ revolver in .357 or .44 Magnum, couple of quality speedloaders and a good cc holster. If you honestly expect govt people will go after you, your best bet is to blend with a crowd somewhere and a fullsize rifle would stick out a lot. OTOH a long revolver and highpower ammo will give you a carbine power up to about 100 meters, maybe more. Also you will be surprised with the accuracy, namely if shooting from a prone position with both hands rested on something.

Other advantages for SHTF situation are obvious: lower weight, ability to shoot onehandled, you can carry it concealed everywhere and all the time so once the aliens land or zombies attack you will not get caught unarmed, and naturally you can use the gun in cq situations since it is a handgun, and compared to pistols, this one packs a pretty good punch. The only drawback is the low capacity and not that easy reloading, but once you practice with your speedloaders, you will overcome it. Good luck giving them zombies or rampaging chimps or aliens a hard time.

Last edited by alberich; March 8, 2009 at 03:58 AM.
alberich is offline  
Old March 8, 2009, 04:09 AM   #4
alberich
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 7, 2009
Location: Czech Republic
Posts: 117
One more note concering the ammo choice, if you really want to go rifle: for SHTF situation you want to be compatible with you local army/police ammo. Simply put, you logically need a gun chambered for ammo with would be available in largest amount and everywhere. If you are in USA, this means .223 Rem and .308 Win. I have my doubts about .223 Rem, so I'd go for something in .308 Win. If you are on a low budget, buy some Saiga, which is in fact an AK chambered in .308 Win.
In .223 Rem I'd go for Ruger Mini.
One last thing, CZ makes a bolt action carbine in 7.62x39 (and in .223, too IIRC).
__________________
I beg you, Gentlemen, act with Conduct and discretion. A Pistol is your last Resort.
The Beggar's Opera, John Gay
alberich is offline  
Old March 8, 2009, 07:22 AM   #5
sailskidrive
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 26, 2008
Posts: 726
why a rifle?

I would go w/ a Mossberg 590A1 shot gun instead of a low end rifle. In a SHTF situation 12ga shot shells are all over the place, I sort of agree w/ choosing 9mm, .223, or .308; however I'm not so sure .308 is as plentiful out there as 12ga and 9mm. 00 Buck shot or even 4 shot coming out of the pointy end of a shotgun is incredibly lethal and can be used for anything from self protection to hunting.

Personally, if SHTF and I was on the move I would go w/ my AR15 M4 equivalent and a SIG 9mm. If protecting the house I would use a short barreled 12ga.

~Sail
sailskidrive is offline  
Old March 8, 2009, 12:27 PM   #6
carguychris
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 20, 2007
Location: Richardson, TX
Posts: 5,402
Quote:
One more note concering the ammo choice, if you really want to go rifle: for SHTF situation you want to be compatible with you local army/police ammo. Simply put, you logically need a gun chambered for ammo with would be available in largest amount and everywhere. If you are in USA, this means .223 Rem and .308 Win.
+1. I think Mosin-Nagants are great, but my primary reservation regarding using one as a SHTF rifle is ammo availability. The supply of cheap milsurp 7.62x54R ammo could dry up as the political winds shift- not just in this country, but in the countries of origin too. While it's true that you can stockpile, you could become separated from your stockpile in a SHTF scenario.

OTOH .223Rem and .308Win will always be available; 7.62x39 and .30-06 slightly less so.
__________________
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam. This is bowling. There are rules... MARK IT ZERO!!" - Walter Sobchak
carguychris is offline  
Old March 8, 2009, 04:50 PM   #7
L_Killkenny
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 2, 2007
Location: Iowa
Posts: 2,676
I don't believe in SHTF. Just don't and I won't buy a gun based on that. That being said, only you can make the decision. But I say get a gun that fills duel roles. A good SD gun comes to mind. Shotgun first, then a hand gun, then a pistol caliber carbine. Ya ever think about a Hi-Point? How about a good lever gun? (I think you still buy them new at WAlmart for $330). Both have great reps for reliablility and service. They are compact and ammo is everywhere. They are cheap and so is the ammo. It would be a great combo if you are indeed right and I'm wrong about the SHTF.

BTW, I've handled a Rem. 770. I wouldn't buy one on a dare. I've already expressed my disdain for the Mosin. If you're stuck on a rifle I'd find a good used gun. Savages and Stevens are very accurate and durable. Marlin 30/30's can be had for around $200 if you look and $250 about anywhere. Ton's of other good bolt guns that can be had used for a couple hundred. Any of them are better than either the Rem 770 or the Mosin.
L_Killkenny is offline  
Old March 8, 2009, 10:19 PM   #8
handlerer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 5, 2007
Location: Billings,MT
Posts: 277
If the gov't is out to get you, then you have had it probably. They won't come after you one at a time, they will send a hundred to get you and won't just get you they will get your family too if you don't come peacefully. I have to say I'm getting tired of these shtf threads, and don't believe it will the gov't if the shtf, that you really have to worry about.
handlerer is offline  
Old March 8, 2009, 10:46 PM   #9
New_Pollution1086
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 26, 2007
Location: WC - CA
Posts: 680
yeah these shtf threads do get old. Check out www.survivalistboards.com they allow them and its a common topic.

I would go with the MN, its the cockroach of the gun world. They'll be around forever.

T
__________________
"I have ridden the mighty moon worm, and it was good"
"Aim Big miss Big, Aim small Miss small"
"Don't rush the monkey and you'll see a better show."
- T. Boone Pickens

Last edited by New_Pollution1086; March 8, 2009 at 10:47 PM. Reason: B/c i wanted to
New_Pollution1086 is offline  
Old March 8, 2009, 11:43 PM   #10
Cummins09
Junior Member
 
Join Date: November 10, 2008
Posts: 5
L_Killkenny, handlerer: SHTF for me would be if the cartels spilled over into the US, being that I live in a city that is actually on the border with Mexico it can happen. I'm not so much worried about drug dealers coming to kill me as I live outside the city, but a martial law type of situation.
__________________
The strength of the Pack is the Wolf.
Cummins09 is offline  
Old March 9, 2009, 01:58 AM   #11
Regolith
Senior Member
 
Join Date: September 30, 2008
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 400
Bolt action probably isn't going to be your best bet for that scenario then, one way or the other. They're simply too slow; it's a long range weapon, and self defense usually occurs much much closer.

Better to go with a shotgun. Remington 870 or Mossberg 500, either will work and cost a lot less than the 700 or 770 (:barf.

Also, I had missed that you were asking about the 770 instead of the 700. IIRC, the 770 is based off the 710, which was widely regarded as very big mistake on Remington's part. Crappy rifle that wasn't that accurate. I'd take a Mosin Nagant over that any day of the week.
Regolith is offline  
Old March 9, 2009, 07:23 PM   #12
Crosshair
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 16, 2004
Location: Grand Forks, ND
Posts: 5,320
I've worked the gun counter and worked with the 770/710. The Remington 770/710 is to guns what the Ford Pinto is to cars.
__________________
I don't carry a gun to go looking for trouble, I carry a gun in case trouble finds me.
Crosshair is offline  
Old March 9, 2009, 08:53 PM   #13
stalkingbear
Member
 
Join Date: December 13, 2006
Location: Ky
Posts: 52
Do yourself a HUGE favor and STAY AWAY from Remington model 710/770 series Rifles. I've seen too many go bad, as well as the design itself is JUNK.
__________________
Sponsored by:................Space available
stalkingbear is offline  
Old March 10, 2009, 12:13 AM   #14
obxned
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 30, 2007
Location: OBX, NC
Posts: 1,128
Buy a Mosin-Nagant rifle NOW, and a couple of sardine cans of ammo. Trust me on this.
__________________
“If we lose freedom here, there is no place to escape to. This is the last stand on Earth.” Ronald Reagan

I'm a proud member of a North Carolina Committee of Safety
obxned is offline  
Old March 10, 2009, 11:13 AM   #15
T-Mac
Member
 
Join Date: January 18, 2006
Location: Townsend, MT
Posts: 99
Get a Ruger 10-22 and a couple of banana clips.Not all that effective...but realistic...'cuz:

If you think you can fight off the government... even one run by liberals...you might be a redneck.
T-Mac is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:32 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2014 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.09422 seconds with 7 queries