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Old February 13, 2009, 09:24 PM   #1
rem870hunter
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shotgun barrel w/double bead sight alignment ??

i purchased a 12 gauge 870 mag. barrel for my express shotgun. barrel is like new. seller bought it back in 91. i just got it today, it has the twin bead sight. small steel mid, and a slightly smaller than the normal steel bead (smaller than the one my 28" vent rib barrel) on the front. the front is colored white from the factory.

what would be the proper bead alignment?

white front bead just visible above the steel mid bead like a figure 8. or the white front bead broken by the steel mid bead?

my 12 ga. wingmaster magnum vent rib 28" barrel has the 2 bead sight,but the front bead is on that larger than the one on the front of the express. did not shoot the wingmaster 28" barrel much,and have not for over 15 years. i should hopefully be taking it to the range tomorrow or sunday.
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Old February 13, 2009, 11:36 PM   #2
rshanneck2002
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you used to see alot of double bead sights on shotguns back in the 60s and 70s,some theory about it making shots easy as pie,died out big time,took to long to line up on wingshots at birds and ducks.my uncle had a few on various shotguns back then that had a double bead sight system
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Old February 14, 2009, 09:57 AM   #3
perazzimx14
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The beads should be stacked in a figure "8" as you look down the barrel. IF there is a space between the beads the higher the POI should be. If the beads overlap the lower the POI should be.

After a gun is fitted to you, beads are like tail fins on a car. They don't do anything.
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Old February 14, 2009, 02:08 PM   #4
BigJimP
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If the gun fits you - they should be stacked in a figure 8 - if not, take it to the pattern board first ( and see if its hitting high or low ) and then put a pad on the comb to adjust it so the beads are a figure 8 - and the point of impact should be where you are looking.

Having the gun hit - where you look - is the point of a good fit. ( and length of pull, etc )... but you get the point.
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Old February 15, 2009, 02:12 PM   #5
zippy13
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rshanneck2002: you used to see alot of double bead sights on shotguns back in the 60s and 70s
Target grade guns still have a mid rib bead. Some premium field guns may not have rear bead, but the mid rib is threaded and plugged.

perazzimx14: The beads should be stacked in a figure "8" as you look down the barrel. IF there is a space between the beads the higher the POI should be. If the beads overlap the lower the POI should be.
+1
After a gun is fitted to you, beads are like tail fins on a car. They don't do anything.
I beg to differ, IMHO: The twin sights' figure-8 provides a reference every time I go shooting. They reassure me that nothing has changed since my last outing. A gun that fit nicely may not after a weight gain/loss or a significant change in the layers of clothing worn.

BigJimP: the point of impact should be where you are looking.
+1
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Old February 15, 2009, 05:41 PM   #6
BigJimP
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To add a little to my friend Zippy's comments - I wouldn't own a gun without a mid rib bead.

For some reason, I have a tendancy to cant a gun or roll the gun a little to the left once in a while when I mount it - and by lining up the beads I can see right away, I need to drop the gun from my shoulder and re-mount the gun. A mid rib bead is really important to me - to keep me from doing that...
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Old February 16, 2009, 06:59 PM   #7
rem870hunter
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thank you for the replies,i've been trying to reply but the system semed like it was not working right.

i shot some on sat morn. had just enough alone range time for high brass 7 1/2 and 4. i managed to get more pellets on paper and a little more of an even spread of shot, with the 21" than the 28" of the 7 1/2 using the same choke and range, full, 40. the 4 i tried did not do as good as with the 28". will try skeet,ic and mod asap. got the barrel mainly for sitting shots ,turkey,squirrel, coyote/fox. will try clays and see how i do with moving targets. hopefully will do good.

would a monte carlo stock be useful with the double bead sights? it did not work right with the 28" single bead. i was looking way over the bead and rib.
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Old February 17, 2009, 09:39 PM   #8
perazzimx14
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A Monte Carlo may or may not work for you. Most target gun have them as they keep your head more upright. If you have a long neck it may work well for hunting situations. Reference your beads if there is a gap when sighting the comb may need to come up and/or a Monte carlo stock added.

For $200 bucks you can have your stock cut and made into an adjustable comb. This will allow you to make all sorts of adjustments like raising or lowering POI and cast or camber. This option is usually cheaper that buying a new stock.

After re-reading your post you state you are looking over the beads w/ the monte carlo stock. The comb is to high for your needs and will need to be lowered to bring things back inline.

If you are interested in fitting the gun yourself do a search on "Rollin Oswald" he has a great stock fitting guide. I am not sure on the price but a well fitting gun is worth every penny.
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Old February 19, 2009, 07:46 PM   #9
rem870hunter
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i google searched rollin oswald,found alot of info on and by him so far. i'll search for stocks with adjustable combs. would using a stock like that with a scope or open sighted barrel help too,or have a negative effect on it?

i did try the monte carlo stock with the 21" barrel, when i shouldered the gun the beads were stacked in a figure 8 immediately. did not shoot it like that yet. but unlike the 28" barrel where i was looking over the bead. it seemed like i was looking at an upward angle,meaning my shot spread would go high, or mostly high at 60/40. from what i read on other posts most trap or skeet shooters want or shoot like that.

i don't think thats what i would want, i would have to purposely hold low to compensate. my luck having to do that i will forget to when i need to remember. maybe trying it with that stock and barrel (the 21" not the 28") combination, shooting 3 each of poa center, poa just above. poa just below. to see what happens to my shot spread.
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Old February 19, 2009, 10:18 PM   #10
Nnobby45
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Yes, they were common on better shotguns, at one time. Probably useful when trap or skeet shooting to make sure your shotgun was properly mounted be for you holler "pull".

Don't think they were ever designed to be aligned with one another during hunting when a bird flushed. Learn to mount your shotgun properly, and, if it fits properly, the beads will align themselves.
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Old February 19, 2009, 10:47 PM   #11
rem870hunter
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did not find any results on adjustable comb stocks other than a few that can make your stock adjustable. but not outright buying one made adjustable. i'll have to get a copy of rollin oswald book of stock fitters bible. i think i will still try shooting with the monte carlo and the 21" barrel to see what happens. shooting it is the only way to find out for sure what will happen to my spread. will post results after i shoot.
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Old February 19, 2009, 10:47 PM   #12
hogdogs
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Ibet after 15 minutes with a "shooting coach" watching I would be humiliated to hear my form and technique were a train wreck!
Brent
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Old February 19, 2009, 11:01 PM   #13
rem870hunter
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i wouldn't feel humiliated. if i'm doing something wrong and someone who i'm sure knows better tells me so. i'll try my darndest to improve. unless i already know that i'm right. shooting coaches probably are'nt cheap,never looked into one. i might. never gave any thought until a few years ago on checking the shot spread on any of my shotguns. last i small game or waterfowl hunted was the late 80's. i should've started checking back when i was 17 or 18. barely knew of it then,just trying to make sure i'm not blasting 3 shells at something and i'm just throwing lead into the air or downrange. but trying not to break the bank either,i got bad looks from my other when i was buying another barrel,she was not happy. i still need to get a patternmaster choke tube. i don't see that happening in 2009.
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