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Old February 9, 2009, 02:36 PM   #1
Firepower!
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300 Win. Mag. vs. 308 Win.

Which is better in upto 1000 yards of shooting?

There is a lot of talk about 300 being the caliber, but I am not sure if I should ditch my 308s and buy 300 win mag.

If just bigger is better than why 50 cal and be done with it until a new monster cal is introduced?
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Old February 9, 2009, 02:49 PM   #2
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At 1000 yards, what do you want to do? Punch holes in paper or punch holes in something else?

If you want to punch holes in paper, go to 6.5 mm. Less recoil and better ballistics.

I know of 1000 yard Long Range Championships being won, and records set, with the 300 Win Mag. Still, from what I saw, it was a hard cartridge to shoot well. It kicks.

True, all of the sniper wannabees are iron men and do not flinch, so maybe the long range crowd I was with are wimps. But I have found that recoil adds up, and even with a 308, I have flinch problems in a 22 round string.

I think the real question is, what the heck do you think you are going to hit at 1000 yards?

If you are game hunting, that is about three times too far out, and folks who toss "Hail Mary's" at game at that distance, regardless of cartridge and caliber, are not hunting. They are playing a evil version of pin ball.
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Old February 9, 2009, 02:58 PM   #3
kraigwy
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I've used both at 1000yards. I have a Model 70 (single shot) in 300 WM, I used 200 grn SMKs, AND My super match M1A for shooting the service rifle event.

Yes the 300WM would be better, makes since. shoot the same bullet, faster, its gonna have less problems with wind. (HS Phyics).

My Model 70 was heavy, 29 In barrel. It worked great but you have to be in shape to shoot it. If you arn't willing to put the time in to shoot the 300, then you should stick to the 308.

I was shooting for the NG when I was heavy into 1000 yard matches. Now I'm retired and shoot for fun. I built a Model 70 Vietnam Era Sniper Rifle in '06thats going to be my 1000 yard rifle. Is it as good as the 300 WM, but I'm shooting for fun now. I dont want to have to work at it. My scores arnt what they use to be, but then neither is the presure.

Shoot, I even shoot the Service Rifle 1000 yard matches with my AR WOA in 223. Its fun and you'd be suprises how the little 223 works at 1000 yards.
I just through the last part in for info, I know you were talking about the 300 vs 308.
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Old February 9, 2009, 03:10 PM   #4
ultramagshooter
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I would

be interested in seeing which is better to. I have shot grounhogs from 350 with my 300 win mag but want to extend my range a little bit. I would like to hunt elk and mule deer in colorado where I can get longer shots. I want to get a 7mm ultra mag with 150 remington swift scirroces for big game. I just want a bullet that will hold it's velocity and k.e out to long range.
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Old February 9, 2009, 05:10 PM   #5
taylorce1
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The .300 Win is the better cartridge, but how much is probably of greater debate.

On a side note!

Quote:
I would like to hunt elk and mule deer in colorado where I can get longer shots.
UMS, just because CO has some wide open spaces that doesn't mean that all the shots will be long ones. Most of my hunting has all been done inside of 200 yards, and most of my deer have been taken inside 100 during ML season. If you can shoot 300-350 yards and hit ground hogs you are going to more than cover 99% of the big game hunting situations here in CO. To tell you the truth you would probably be better of learning to take snap shots at close range.

If you got a .300 Win that is all you will ever need to take Elk at ranges most people shouldn't even attempt to shoot. The RUM is just a waste of money that could be better spent honing your shooting ability. Sorry I know that isn't what you want to hear so TIFWIW.
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Old February 9, 2009, 05:26 PM   #6
TheManHimself
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.300 Win Mag has superior performance but for more money expenditure and punishing recoil. On paper, any of the magnums beat the standard cartridge. In real life, you'll probably shoot the .308 better, since you'll be able to afford more practice and shoot more rounds before becoming fatigued from recoil.
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Old February 9, 2009, 05:44 PM   #7
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I also considered the 300 WM over a 308. However my range is limited to 600 yards and while I have never shot a 300WM I have seen a few shot. I'm not a weenie by any means but I just couldn't justify the extra "punch" for my range and the extra COST $$$.

It was a .308 WIN for me.

Have fun and good luck on your choice.
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Old February 9, 2009, 06:46 PM   #8
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Quote:
.300 Win Mag has superior performance but for more money expenditure and punishing recoil. On paper, any of the magnums beat the standard cartridge.
A limbsaver kills the recoil problem.

The kicker with the .300 win mag is it's massive consumption of powder. It's using dang near double what the .308 uses. The brass is also more expensive. It's also harder on your barrel.

But yeah, it's a lot more fun to shoot IMO. It always gets people's attention at the range.

Personally, I'd opt for the 7mm mag or 7mm STW myself, but really, that is my own bias talking.
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Old February 10, 2009, 10:22 AM   #9
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For 1,000 yard competition, I'd look at the 6.5-.284 before I'd consider the 300 WM just because of the recoil issue.
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Old February 10, 2009, 01:53 PM   #10
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It's been several years since the 300 Winmag was a force in 1000 yard comps, at least on the National level up. With a few exceptions, 6.5 and 7mms rule. But if you like getting beat up and burning lots of powder.......

Looks like I was wrong - lots of 6mms starting to do well - http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com...ocks-shooters/

Last edited by skinewmexico; February 11, 2009 at 05:14 PM.
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Old February 12, 2009, 01:11 PM   #11
Firepower!
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Well how much knock down power is left in 308 at 1000 yards compared to the 300 Win Mag?
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Old February 12, 2009, 01:27 PM   #12
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Yeah, 300 WMs get alot of attention at the range. When I bring my Ar-30 to the range here, people trip out. Most of these guys are simple folk with their grandads 270 or something. My Ar30 has a muzzlebreak on it. I tell you from exp it will blow a half empty coke bottle 10 feet if its on the table next to you.
The noise is the tradeoff for the recoil. My Ar30 kicks less than A ar-15. It is very damned unpleasant to shoot out of a deer blind let me tell you.
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Old February 12, 2009, 01:33 PM   #13
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http://www.remington.com/products/am...on/ballistics/
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Old February 12, 2009, 01:48 PM   #14
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Both shoot the same .308" diameter bullet, one shoots it out with a lot more energy, on a flatter trajectory, and can shoot out heavier bullets of the same caliber if you want.

All depends on what you want your .308" bullet to do, and how far out.

You can consider the 30'06 a happy medium. Little more velocity over the 308, plus there are common loads for 220 grain bullets to hunt with if you wanted.

Don't pay attention to the people who want to warn you off about the recoil, or to the ones who demand it as law you never kill anything past 200 yrds.

Both of those factors are up to you.
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Old February 12, 2009, 02:07 PM   #15
T.A.Sharps
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This is off the link above comparing the two with the same bullet. The 300WM is in red.

Cartridge Information
Index Number Cartridge Type Weight (grs.) Bullet Style Primer No. Ballistic Coefficient
PRC308WC Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 Core-Lokt® Ultra Bonded 9 1/2 0.402
PRC300WC Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 Core-Lokt® Ultra Bonded 9 1/2 M 0.402

Velocity (ft/sec)
Cartridge Type Bullet Muzzle 100 200 300 400 500
Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 CLUB 2620 2404 2198 2002 1818 1644
Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 CLUB 2960 2727 2505 2294 2093 1903

Energy (ft-lbs)
Cartridge Type Bullet Muzzle 100 200 300 400 500
Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 CLUB 2743 2309 1930 1601 1320 1080
Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 CLUB 3501 2971 2508 2103 1751 1448

Short-Range Trajectory
Cartridge Type Bullet 50 100 150 200 250 300
Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 CLUB 0.0 zero -1.4 -4.5 -9.4 -16.3
Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 CLUB 0.1 0.6 zero -1.9 -5.2 -10.0

Long-Range Trajectory
Cartridge Type Bullet 100 150 200 250 300 400 500
Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 CLUB 2.3 2.0 zero -3.8 -9.5 -26.4 -56.4
Premier® Core-Lokt® Ultra 180 CLUB 2.7 3.1 2.2 zero -3.8 -16.4 -37.0
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Old February 12, 2009, 07:04 PM   #16
eaglesnester
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300mag or 308

Hats off to the 300 mag for long range shooting. Use a 190or 210gr Berger VLD to get er did. Better yet go get yourself a 338 Lapua for them 1000yd shoots with Bergers. That is what the Lapua was made for. I think the Finns came up with the 338 as their long range sniper weapon. The 308 is good and will make it out to 1000 but you got to be a good rifleman to get er done. The Winchester 300 mag is better if you want to lay the grass low and shoot long. I shoot a P-17 converted to a 308 Norma which is the ballistic twin to the 300 mag. I do not find the recoil to be much of a problem for me, in fact I rather like it, I know I am shooting something with a little authority. I figure if it don't knock my hat off and put my glasses sideways on my face it ante no fun to shoot. I also have a 300 Weatherby Magnum that kicks about like the Norma. Up here in Northern B.C. Canada the shots are frequently long and the game is rather large, so I shoot the custom cannons.

Last edited by eaglesnester; February 12, 2009 at 07:18 PM.
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Old February 12, 2009, 09:19 PM   #17
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The US Army AMU and snipers have worked with the 300 WM, and they shoot it at extended range. The WM uses a lot more powder and shoots a 180 grain bullet at speeds that a 30-06 would be hard pressed to make with a 150 grain bullet. My favorite belted 30 is the 30/338 because it has a longer neck for better bullet tension. The 308 Norma Mag is about the 30/338's ballistic equal.
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Old February 12, 2009, 10:54 PM   #18
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300 WM, hands down. Especially on windy days.
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Old February 13, 2009, 07:02 AM   #19
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Quote:
Yeah, 300 WMs get alot of attention at the range. When I bring my Ar-30 to the range here, people trip out. Most of these guys are simple folk with their grandads 270 or something. My Ar30 has a muzzlebreak on it. I tell you from exp it will blow a half empty coke bottle 10 feet if its on the table next to you.
The noise is the tradeoff for the recoil. My Ar30 kicks less than A ar-15. It is very damned unpleasant to shoot out of a deer blind let me tell you.
That sounds like something I would enjoy throroughly.
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Old February 13, 2009, 08:58 PM   #20
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I actually picked up a Browning A-bolt 300 WM today. I only had time to put one round thru it, (function check) and although it is the only shot I have taken with this caliber, I think the recoil is much less than my Rem 270.
Feels like more of a hard push than a sharp kick.
I will get out and maybe run a box through it and then change my mind!
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Old March 9, 2010, 01:08 AM   #21
dustycowboy
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300 win mag

I have two rifles that I use for hunting and long rang varment and target shooting. I live in CO so I get the advatage of shooting at 5280 but none the less I ave learned the limits of my weapon. I use my true and trusted .243 for hunting alll big game in CO I have taken many elk with this round and knock on wood I have never had to track an animal more than a 100 yards. With that said, I throw 40 rounds + a week varment hunting at no less then 250 yards. The shot placement on an elk at 100-400 yards is easy. Plus meet loss is minimal with a smaller round. I will say this, I just made a cold bore shot on a bunny at 437 yards on Feb 28th 2010 with my .243 that I have more money into than all of my other rifles combined, but past that distance, only God knows where that 95 gr bulet will end up. I use my .300 win mag sporting a Vortex Viper 6-20x50 for my long range shooting "over 450 yards." I used to shoot a 7mm Rem Ultra Mag for that but I found the .300 win mag to be best sueted for my shooting style. I can't tell you why but the recoil fits better. I agree that a 300 kicks like a mule and that you have to dedicate yourself to getting your ass kicked for at least 400-500 rounds just to learn how to shoot it, but when you get it figured out,,,, WOW, what a round. I will still be hunting with my .243 win for elk, deer, and the pronghorn I took in 2009 at 286 yards, but if I want to reach out and touch a p-dog at a grand. I will be using my .300 win mag.
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Old March 9, 2010, 03:23 AM   #22
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Not trying to be rude but you don't need to know how much knockdown power a .308 has compared to the .300 at 1000 yards because anyone trying to hunt at those ranges is a complete knob head...

I don't mind hunting as long as each shot made is an almost guaranteed kill, trying to take long shots is pointless, honestly does it make the animal more dead then if the shot was taken close up?
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Old March 9, 2010, 04:08 AM   #23
mIcKdOg7
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the idea of long range shooting is for a bit of a challenge because it can get boring if your taking 2 seconds to line up a shot and kill.
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Old March 9, 2010, 06:20 AM   #24
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There's a difference between long range and 1000 yards...
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Old March 9, 2010, 10:35 AM   #25
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Quote:
There's a difference between long range and 1000 yards...
That's right. There are some that would consider 1000 yds. not much more than a chip shot...."http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/"
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