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Old March 4, 2009, 07:29 PM   #1
Denny Hansen
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Disquieting Events

The below is posted for FYI purposes. Best course of action is to contact your Congressmen if you disagree with what is happening.

In the last few weeks there have been disturbing reports about military units being trained to operate on U.S. Soil take a look at this
http://www.carrollspaper.com/main.as...SectionID=&S=1
and this
http://www.armytimes.com/news/2008/0...eland_090708w/

The above, of course, is in addition to the Attorney General’s statement last week that he has plans to renew the AWB (with additional restrictions). In past years some people have been concerned about the militarization of our police, but that is nothing compared to using the military, (especially a combat not MP) brigade as the police. Under the Posse Comitatus Act they’re not supposed to be able to. Unfortunately there has been some precedent:

Folks cheered when Bush I sent the military into LA for the riots, because they were not rioters. No one questioned the use of military on U.S. soil for drug interdiction because they were not drug runners. Not many balked at using military equipment at Waco because they were not Branch Davidians. For gunowers, and all free Americans, the possible parallels here to the words of Martin Niemöller are frightening.

Add to this Obama's stated intent to organize a federal law enforcement agency that is as large and well-equipped as the military. What concerns me the most about all this is: What is the Obama Regime planning that we don’t know about, and why do they think they will need the military/a large federal police force for to quell “civil disorder?”

Denny
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Old March 4, 2009, 10:35 PM   #2
OuTcAsT
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Denny I too share a very wary but watchful stance. Your posting brings a new meaning to something that was posted earlier in a different thread.
Follow this link:
http://www.ignatius-piazza-front-sig...ot-or-traitor/


It is a person who claims to be a former member of the military, and he makes some very strong claims and statements, but after reading your materials I believe that it certainly gives one reason for pause, and a good look around.
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Old March 4, 2009, 10:56 PM   #3
raimius
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I can't read the articles.
One had a "page not found" error, and the other linked to the ArmyTimes website, but the article was not there.
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Old March 4, 2009, 11:38 PM   #4
Al Norris
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raimius, links fixed.
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Old March 5, 2009, 12:11 AM   #5
OuTcAsT
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Some disturbing statements that bear scrutiny: (From the Army Times article)

Emphasis mine.

Quote:
But this new mission marks the first time an active unit has been given a dedicated assignment
Quote:
the mission will be a permanent one.
Quote:
The 1st BCT’s soldiers also will learn how to use “the first ever nonlethal package that the Army has fielded,”
Quote:
nonlethal weapons designed to subdue unruly or dangerous individuals without killing them.
Quote:
They’ve been using pieces of it in Iraq, but this is the first time that these modules were consolidated and this package fielded, and because of this mission we’re undertaking we were the first to get it.”
Quote:
“We’ve been all over the world during this time of conflict, but now our mission is to take care of citizens at home
Quote:
they’ll learn new skills, use some of the ones they acquired in the war zone and more than likely will not be shot at while doing any of it.
Quote:
“I don’t know what America’s overall plan is — I just know that 24 hours a day, seven days a week, there are soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines that are standing by
While the overall article seems mundane enough these statements make me very uneasy.
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Last edited by OuTcAsT; March 5, 2009 at 12:22 AM. Reason: cleanup
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Old March 5, 2009, 12:54 AM   #6
gc70
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Posse Comitatus Act (18 U.S.C. § 1385)

Quote:
Whoever, except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress, willfully uses any part of the Army or the Air Force as a posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than two years, or both.
We generally assume that the Posse Comitatus Act means that the military simply can't be involved in any domestic law enforcement activities.

Quote:
...but that is nothing compared to using the military, (especially a combat not MP) brigade as the police. Under the Posse Comitatus Act they’re not supposed to be able to.
However, there are quite a number of Acts of Congress that provide express exceptions to the Posse Comitatus Act.

LA riots in 1992: military intervention was under the terms of the Insurrection Act of 1807 (10 USC § 331, 10 USC § 332, 10 USC § 333, and 10 USC § 334).

Drug interdiction: various authority granted to the Secretary of Defense (32 USC 112).

Military equipment: can be provided to assist law enforcement (10 USC 371-382).

Last edited by gc70; March 5, 2009 at 01:01 AM.
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Old March 5, 2009, 09:01 AM   #7
OuTcAsT
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Quote:
However, there are quite a number of Acts of Congress that provide express exceptions to the Posse Comitatus Act.
Agreed, I believe the OP pointed this out :

Quote:
Unfortunately there has been some precedent:

Folks cheered when Bush I sent the military into LA for the riots, because they were not rioters. No one questioned the use of military on U.S. soil for drug interdiction because they were not drug runners. Not many balked at using military equipment at Waco because they were not Branch Davidians. For gunowers, and all free Americans, the possible parallels here to the words of Martin Niemöller are frightening.
Problem is, it should be for the most dire of circumstances, The referenced articles seem to indicate that :

Quote:
the mission will be a permanent one.
Basically a standing force put together to operate within the US as a police force, and one that expects some resistance:

Quote:
they’ll learn new skills, use some of the ones they acquired in the war zone and more than likely will not be shot at while doing any of it.
And the discussion of "Non Lethal" paks being issued for "crowd control" would make one ask "What are they expecting"?
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Last edited by OuTcAsT; March 5, 2009 at 09:12 AM.
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Old March 5, 2009, 11:48 AM   #8
Al Norris
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The quote in the Army Times about the non-lethal weaponry was taken out of context. A correction at the bottom of the article reads,
Quote:
Correction:
A non-lethal crowd control package fielded to 1st Brigade Combat Team, 3rd Infantry Division, described in the original version of this story, is intended for use on deployments to the war zone, not in the U.S., as previously stated.
and has been there for quite some time. The article itself was first published on Sept. 30, 2008.

That article when coupled with Dennys first link to the MOUT training in Arcadia, Iowa, may seem to be something other than it is, but only at first glance.

Military Operations on Urban Terrain (MOUT) has been in the planning stages from the mid to late 1990's. Among the first MOUT training facilities (not at the time called this), were those built at places like Camp LeJeune, NC back during the Vietnam war. This in response to the Tet Offensive of 1968, and was a mock-up of Hue city. They were used to regain the house-to-house fighting skills used during WWII and subsequently lost.

In 2002, under a directive that stemmed, in part, from the PATRIOT Act, but mostly from actions in Croatia, several urban mock-ups facilities were established as training centers to further the MOUT objectives. Starting in 2004, several US cities were contacted and with their approval, were used in live action exercises. This has been an ongoing live training exercise since then.

For those of us that have had sons and daughters, wives and husbands, etc., in the military since the mid 90's to the mid 00's, this is no surprise or secret. Perhaps the general public is surprised, but again, it has been no secret.

For those that paid attention, the creation of the Department of Homeland Security has always had, as part of its operational creation and goal; the setting, training and staging of regional US Troops to respond to terrorism.

The abysmal Federal response, during and after hurricane Katrina, have only heightened the need to have a fast mobile response, to augment and help local authorities in time of extreme crisis.

Can the current speculation of mission creep, occur? Absolutely. Will it occur? Always a possibility. If not watched, definitely.

Am I truly worried about this? Not as worried as I am over the proposed (during the election campaign) increase in Federal Law Enforcement (increased by 20K to 30K).
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