The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > The Hide > The Art of the Rifle: General

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old January 16, 2009, 05:23 PM   #1
paghunter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: December 17, 2008
Posts: 4
222 REM vs 22-250 REM

What kind of power loss can be expected when going from 22-250 to 222.And what would be the effective range of the 222 when shooting small varmints
paghunter is offline  
Old January 16, 2009, 05:34 PM   #2
Scorch
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 13, 2006
Location: Washington state
Posts: 11,341
They're not even in the same category, ballistically. A 222 Rem fires a 55 gr bullet at 3,000 fps. A 22-250 fires the same bullet at 3,700 fps. A 222 is considered a 250-300 yds cartridge, the 22-250 is a 450-500 yds cartridge.

On the other hand, the 222 has a reputation as an extremely accurate cartridge, and dominated benchrest shooting for many years. While the 22-250 has been used as a benchrest caliber, it is not really well suited for the role.

Totally different purposes, totally different performance levels.
__________________
Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs.
But what do I know?
Summit Arms Services
Taylor Machine
Scorch is online now  
Old January 16, 2009, 05:47 PM   #3
sureshots
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 17, 2008
Location: Piedmont,NC
Posts: 464
Good Varmit Caliber

Now, we speak of Barrel Burners the 222 is in that catagory. A friend of mine is on his fourth, yes fourth Barrel. On the other hand the 222 cal. is A very good varmit round right in there with the 223 and the 22-250 calibers.
sureshots is offline  
Old January 16, 2009, 06:58 PM   #4
BIGR
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 13, 2000
Location: Mountains
Posts: 1,246
.22-250 hands down. So much you can do with it load wise and its devasting on varmits and other game.
BIGR is offline  
Old January 16, 2009, 07:32 PM   #5
j.chappell
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2008
Posts: 1,125
Quote:
Now, we speak of Barrel Burners the 222 is in that catagory. A friend of mine is on his fourth, yes fourth Barrel. On the other hand the 222 cal. is A very good varmit round right in there with the 223 and the 22-250 calibers.
That is the first I have ever heard of the 222 Remington being a "Barrel Burner". On his 4th barrel? How many rounds is he getting from them? Is he a competitive shooter? What make of barrel is he using? What scorcher of a load is he shooting in that 222 Rem? They are the few questions that I have.

Also this may be nitpicking but the 222 Remington, 223 Remington, and 22-250 Remington are all the same caliber .224.

As far as the OP's question I believe Scorch nailed it off the bat.

J.
j.chappell is offline  
Old January 16, 2009, 07:53 PM   #6
Scorch
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 13, 2006
Location: Washington state
Posts: 11,341
Quote:
Now, we speak of Barrel Burners the 222 is in that catagory.
You're kidding, right?
__________________
Never try to educate someone who resists knowledge at all costs.
But what do I know?
Summit Arms Services
Taylor Machine
Scorch is online now  
Old January 16, 2009, 08:58 PM   #7
crowbeaner
Senior Member
 
Join Date: June 4, 2007
Location: Upstate SC
Posts: 1,938
Barrel burners? 222? What ARE you smoking in that pipe?
I've had several rifles in both calibers and haven't burned a barrel out in either one yet. The 222 shoots a 50 grainer around 3250 to 3300; the 22-250 will shoot that same 50 grain pill up to about 3900 in a long barrel with a couple different powders. Neither of those is suitable for the 222 because they are too slow burning for the case capacity. Realistic shooting with the 222 is 350 stretched yards. The 22-250 will hold it's edge to well over 600 with a steady rest and no wind. Barrel life with the 22-250 CAN be abbreviated with scorching 40 grain or lighter bullet loadings at maximum pressure. Mike Walker's 222 was up for sale a few years back, and I think it still had the original tube on the action. The 222 runs on roughly 24 grains of powder, and the 22-250 on 36 to 39 depending on just what you stuff the case with. The 22-250 uses 1/3 more powder for 600 more FPS; is this what you're looking for? Both are dandy varmint guns, and I'd be hard pressed to pick the all time favorite I've owned over the years.
__________________
If you want your children to follow in your footsteps, be careful where you walk.
Beware the man that only owns one gun; he probably knows how to use it.
I just hope my ship comes in before my dock rots.
crowbeaner is offline  
Old January 16, 2009, 09:41 PM   #8
B.L.E.
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2008
Location: Somewhere on the Southern shore of Lake Travis, TX
Posts: 1,839
Barrel life is also affected by what your definition of "worn out" is. A lot of hunters would be happier than a pig in mud if their rifles shot as good as a "worn out" bench rest barrel shoots.

The triple duece is a sweet caliber that really deserves to make a comeback.
B.L.E. is offline  
Old January 16, 2009, 09:41 PM   #9
jdscholer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 23, 2008
Location: Jefferson State
Posts: 895
The 222 is definately a kinder, gentler, varmint rifle. You'll never get tired of shooting it, and the surrounding land owners won't get tired of hearing it. The 22-250 -- it's a little harsher.

I'd boil it down to how big your varmints are, and how far you're shooting them. I hear and read a lot about guys shooting 350 and further yards out, but in my experiance, not many are actually doing it no matter what they are shooting. More power to the ones who are.

Around here, our most popular varmint is the Beldings Groundsquirrel. He is about as big as a beer can when grown, and I find that even with the nine power Leupold on my 222, they don't look very big at 300 yds. I think that with less than rock-steady rests, heat waves, and my own meager skills, the little 222 cartridge is the least of my problem. I think with a 22-250, I'd do just as much missing and burn a lot more powder doing it. jd
__________________
"We're all dummies, just in different ways." Old Okie Philosopher
jdscholer is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 08:52 AM   #10
sureshots
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 17, 2008
Location: Piedmont,NC
Posts: 464
jdscholer

I glad to hear that you have good results with the 222cal. I shoot 223 and 22-250 calibers but don't have A 222 cal. My friend has one he has had for years and it is the only gun he shoots and believe me he shoots A lot. The guys are bashing me because I stated he is on his fourth barrel and I know this is A fact. You seem to think the 222 is A good round and I certainly agree with you. I don't own one but I have seen what it will do, very accurate round and no recoil.
sureshots is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 09:52 AM   #11
B.L.E.
Senior Member
 
Join Date: December 20, 2008
Location: Somewhere on the Southern shore of Lake Travis, TX
Posts: 1,839
I'm pretty sure a .22-250 will burn out a barrel before a .222 and a .222 will burn out a barrel before a .22 Hornet. Just about every centerfire rifle will eventually wear out a barrel if you shoot it enough.

A lot of competitors also have a "blame the barrel first" mentality and feel they have to retire a barrel when the new smell wears off just to stay in the game.
B.L.E. is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 10:39 AM   #12
22-rimfire
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 19, 2005
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 4,556
The 220 Swift was the big barrel burner. The 22-250 sort of replaced it for the most part and my experience suggests that the 22-250 will burn a barrel out much quicker than either a 222 Rem or 223.

I have never heard the barrel issue on a 222. That kind of assumes you aren't shooting thousands of rounds a year which most don't.
22-rimfire is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 11:36 AM   #13
j.chappell
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2008
Posts: 1,125
Quote:
I glad to hear that you have good results with the 222cal. I shoot 223 and 22-250 calibers but don't have A 222 cal.
222 Remington, 223 Remington, and 22-250 Remington are not calibers, they are cartridges. They all shoot the same caliber bullet being the .224.

Quote:
The guys are bashing me because I stated he is on his fourth barrel and I know this is A fact.
We are not bashing you we are just questioning it. You would have to do a lot of shooting or hold an extreme level of accuracy requirement to go through 4 barrels on a 222 Remington in a lifetime. Now if he uses it for competitions I can understand but if he isn’t shooting 4000 rounds every couple years I don’t see how on earth he is on his 4th barrel.

I'd love to be able to shoot enough to wear 4 barrels out on the same rifle.

J.
j.chappell is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 02:14 PM   #14
sureshots
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 17, 2008
Location: Piedmont,NC
Posts: 464
I believe my Friend

Well my friend said he was on his fourth barrel and I'm not about to call him A LIAR myself. He has never given me (in all the years I have known him) any reason to think he dosn't tell the truth about anything. So I believe he is on his fourth barrel and really don't care what anyone else thinks about the subject. I'm not trying to be A smart a-- but A friend is A friend and I have no reason to disbelieve him. If you were my longtime friend I would say the same for anyone of you also.

Last edited by sureshots; January 17, 2009 at 02:19 PM.
sureshots is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 03:10 PM   #15
jdscholer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 23, 2008
Location: Jefferson State
Posts: 895
Another point I'd like to make concerns the 350 or 450 yard range that you hear some folks talking about.

I think we would all aggree that the 22-250 is better than the 222 for the longer ranges. However I would challenge anyone to walk a beer can (or target) out to 350 yards, and see just how far that really is. Then do some shooting with the same type of rest you normaly use when shooting your favorite varmint, and see what kind of luck - or skill- you have.

For me, I hove found that my 222 is plenty of rifle to shoot out to about 200 yards, and beyond that except on larger targets, is kind of wasting ammo. Unless I do something different such as better scope, better rest, etc. it wouldn't do me much good to step up to a more powerful rifle. -By the way my 222 fairly easily groups under 1MOA, 100 yds., sandbags on pick-up hood.

I do plan on getting a more powerful scope for this rifle, and then maybe I'll do a little better a little further, we"ll see. jd
__________________
"We're all dummies, just in different ways." Old Okie Philosopher
jdscholer is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 03:35 PM   #16
j.chappell
Senior Member
 
Join Date: October 14, 2008
Posts: 1,125
Quote:
Well my friend said he was on his fourth barrel and I'm not about to call him A LIAR myself.
I wasn’t trying to imply that he was a liar; I only questioned his amount of shooting and his accuracy requirement. I have no doubt that your friend told you that, and I doubt that a long time friend would lie about something like that. I only wonder about the shooting that would cause the rebarreling of a 222 that much.

Who knows he could use it for everything from target to medium game and shoot a couple thousand rounds a years and thus rebarrel it every few years. I am sorry if I have offended you.

Another point I'd like to make concerns the 350 or 450 yard range that you hear some folks talking about.
Quote:
I think we would all agree that the 22-250 is better than the 222 for the longer ranges. However I would challenge anyone to walk a beer can (or target) out to 350 yards, and see just how far that really is. Then do some shooting with the same type of rest you normally use when shooting your favorite varmint, and see what kind of luck - or skill- you have.
I have a few very accurate varmint rifles in 22-250, 243, and 308. I routinely shoot groundhogs at 300 plus yards and I rarely miss. If you shoot these ranges on a regular basis 350 yards is not a big deal. Most all of my shots are from bi-pods or the top of my pickup.

J.
j.chappell is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 03:57 PM   #17
jdscholer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 23, 2008
Location: Jefferson State
Posts: 895
Quote:
I have a few very accurate varmint rifles in 22-250, 243, and 308. I routinely shoot groundhogs at 300 plus yards and I rarely miss. If you shoot these ranges on a regular basis 350 yards is not a big deal. Most all of my shots are from bi-pods or the top of my pickup.
And my hat is off to you. I have often done well on ground hog sized and larger varmints also. I would still submit that many folks don't shoot nearly as well at those distances as they think they do. jd
__________________
"We're all dummies, just in different ways." Old Okie Philosopher
jdscholer is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 04:52 PM   #18
phil mcwilliam
Senior Member
 
Join Date: July 18, 2007
Posts: 573
I agree with others in the general statement that the 22-250 is a 400 yard plus cartridge, where as the 222 is effective out to 300 yards. Most professional kangaroo meat cullers in Australia however use 222 or 223 because they are quieter to shoot than the 22-250. They find if they come across a mob of kangaroos they can take several animals with the 222, where they tend to only get the one shot off if shooting with anything bigger. I lent my 22-250 to one of these pro-shooters when he started out & he has since bought two 223's of his own for his roo culling needs.These roos have to be head shot to be accepted for sale & weigh around 50 to 80 pounds field dressed.
phil mcwilliam is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 07:48 PM   #19
ken22250
Senior Member
 
Join Date: November 26, 2008
Location: Pennsylvaina
Posts: 217
i love both cartridges, and consider both some of the best varmint rounds ever made,as near as i can figure, here is my ranges- my .222, i say arround 225-250yds- .222 mag/.223, 275-300yds- .22-250/.220 swift, 500+, .243win/RC/6mm, 500+
i use all fixed power scopes, my .218, and .22 hornet wear 4x scopes, my .222rem's wear 6x scopes, my .222remmag's and .223's wears a 7 1/2x scopes, my 243win, and 6mm rem wear 10x scopes, my .22-250's,.220 swifts, wear 12x scopes, and my .243 rockchucker and .25-06 improved wear 15x scopes, and as the cartridge/scope goes up, the effective range increases, to my eyes, a 225yard woodchuck looks about right at 6x, i try to match my scope with the capibility of the cartridge.
ken
ken22250 is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 07:50 PM   #20
jdscholer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 23, 2008
Location: Jefferson State
Posts: 895
Now thats a big varmint. jd
__________________
"We're all dummies, just in different ways." Old Okie Philosopher
jdscholer is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 09:46 PM   #21
Inspector3711
Senior Member
 
Join Date: February 9, 2008
Location: Puget Sound Washington
Posts: 1,545
I can hit a beer can at 350 yards with my .223 and 500 with my .22-250, just not every time

But then I've got 20/10 vision in both eyes and I'm hell bent on destroying as many cans as possible.
__________________
"If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun." The Dalai Llama (5/15/01, The Seattle Times)
"That rifle on the wall of the labourer's cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there." George Orwell
Inspector3711 is offline  
Old January 17, 2009, 11:35 PM   #22
jdscholer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: March 23, 2008
Location: Jefferson State
Posts: 895
This thread is getting me in the mood to shoot some ground squirrels, and we have about two months around here before they start poking their heads up.

Oh well, I've got an unopened box - 250, of 40 gr. V-Max that I need to work up a load for.

By the way, there isn't hardly an easier cartridge to load for than the 222.
jd
__________________
"We're all dummies, just in different ways." Old Okie Philosopher
jdscholer is offline  
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:32 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2013 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent: thefiringline.com
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.11998 seconds with 7 queries