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Old January 14, 2009, 06:55 PM   #1
Solomon Heriger
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Need some help identifying the maker of this gun

I own a blackpowder .44 caliber percussion European match pistol made in 1983, but there are no identifying maker marks other than a "S" inside of an octagon that's inside of a circle. The gun is nearly identical to the Pedersoli "Mang in Graz" model sold by Davide Pedersoli. I've searched high and low for some information on who made this pistol, but can't seem to locate anyone who knows anything about this gun.

The gun was sold through the Beeman Precision Airgun catalog in 1984, and was sold as the "Pietro Beretta Aristocrat." In their literature, Beeman said it was made by the same small Italian gunmaker who originally made them for Beretta back in 1835, and they were a limited edition of 1000 (I have #0362). I contacted Beeman directly, but they were useless and provided no information. Apparently nobody there remembers anything about it, or would bother to dig around and locate some information on the maker.

Anyone recognize this gun, or could make a guess who the maker is from just the "S" barrel stamp?

I've had it appraised at $1,300 based upon the price of the Pedersoli gun, but the appraiser suggested it would be worth a bit more as it appears to be better quality, plus it's a limited edition that's never been fired.
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Old January 15, 2009, 10:26 PM   #2
Tom2
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It does appear to be quite high quality and superbly made. I will bet you that the folks down at Dixie Gun Works might have something as far as info if you sent them the picture and info. They have been in the replica and original ML trade for an awful long time and I bet they have seen one of those before and could maybe tell you something. Otherwise someone at National Muzzleloading Rifle Assoc. might know about it. They have experts too. Nice looking pistol! Just make sure that they know it does not say Pedersoli anywhere on it so they don't jump to conclusions! Or even contact Beretta in Italy. They might know about it if their name was used!
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Old January 17, 2009, 09:23 AM   #3
PetahW
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That pistol looks very much like the pic of a repro LePage Dueling Pistol, DGW used to sell @ $259 (finished) in my 1993 DGW catalog.

DGW's description (in part) was: 10" octagon .45 cal bbl, w/12 lands/grooves, set trigger w/adj screw, finger rest TG, European walnut stock w/French-style vertical ribbing on grip, 16" LOA, 2 1/2lbs.
DGW recommended a .445 patched RB over 20gr BP and a #11 cap (sic).

.
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Old January 17, 2009, 10:02 AM   #4
VaFisher
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Quote:
That pistol looks very much like the pic of a repro LePage Dueling Pistol, DGW used to sell @ $259 (finished) in my 1993 DGW catalog.

DGW's description (in part) was: 10" octagon .45 cal bbl, w/12 lands/grooves, set trigger w/adj screw, finger rest TG, European walnut stock w/French-style vertical ribbing on grip, 16" LOA, 2 1/2lbs.
DGW recommended a .445 patched RB over 20gr BP and a #11 cap (sic).
Yea, I agree only you seem to have a better memory on spec's.
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Old January 17, 2009, 08:46 PM   #5
PetahW
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[you seem to have a better memory on spec's.]

Naw - I cheated.

"pistol looks like the pic in my DGW catalog."
"DGW's description was: (etc)"
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Old January 17, 2009, 09:00 PM   #6
James K
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Like many other European replica guns, it is not a firearm so the laws on marking the manufacturer, etc., don't apply. IIRC, those were sold by Dixie and other importers, but I have no clue to the actual maker.

If it was made in Italy, it would have been proved, although the proof mark might be on the bottom of the barrel.

Jim
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Old January 20, 2009, 09:45 AM   #7
Solomon Heriger
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thanks for the comments...

I think I'll give the product manager at Dixie a try. I've written to both Pedersoli and ArmiSport in Italy and included photos, but neither has replied. The original literature does state that the gun maker is a very small operation, but has been in continuous operation since the early 1800s, which should help narrow it down considerably. I wish the copywriters of the Beeman catalog had just named the maker, but perhaps they were under some sort of contractual obligation not to (although I can't imagine why). The gun is similar to the La Page models, although the La Page guns I've seen vary considerably in architecture. The closest thing I could find to it is the Pedersoli "Mang" Standard model.

Thanks for the tips and commenets.
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Old January 20, 2009, 09:56 AM   #8
Solomon Heriger
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One more thing...

I forgot to mention in my other post. I have removed the barrel and checked the proof marks. The barrel is marked only by the standard Gardone proof house marks and date stamp (AL, which dates it 1983). The only other marking is the circled "S" stamp in the top of the barrel, which I am assuming is a maker stamp. I hope that somebody will recognize it eventually.
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barrel proof , black powder pistol , italian , percussion black powder

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