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Old November 20, 2008, 12:45 PM   #1
FrontSight
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Eh, anti hunters, when they are a "friend"...

What do you do when a friend from Europe tells you that you're a murderer for hunting? That guns are horrible, that you're a redneck (!!), that it's wrong to be pro-bush, that teaching children to hunt is sick, etc etc etc?

Here's our conversation....any thoughts? Obviously the "redneck" thing is WAY outta line...


(Read from top down)



-----Original Message-----
From: Anti Hunter friend, "L"
To: Me

I only now understand why you were PRO-BUSH... And no one I know could believe it with you. Its like Im talking to a redneck with your opinions and views. You think going out with a child shooting at animals is healthy teaching a child how to A. use a gun B. how to kill????
A child should be protected from seeing things like that. My God.




-----Original Message-----
From: Me
To: Anti hunter friend, "L"

Oh L, "redneck" is a derogatory term the way you are using it, and that's not very nice.

Teaching children to hunt is one of the most honorable and noble things a parent can do, L. It teaches them respect for Nature. Yes, respect. I know that is hard to believe, but no one respects Nature more than hunters, for we are the ones who live in it...we are the protectors of it. Nothing teaches you respect for it more than being there, seeing what occurs in nature, and being a part of it. See my other e-mail to get an understanding of what I mean.

Let me try to explain in a different way. You like cheese burgers, right? What effort does it take you to get one?

You walk into McDonalds, sit down, order one, and soon you're going "mmmmmm, how delicious.", pay your money, and go on your way.


A true hunter, on the other hand, trains for years to learn the habits of a deer. He studies it, learns what makes it take one travel route versus another, what food it prefers, where it will be when it is cold, where the does are that it will look for when mating season arrives, learns how to conceal himself from its senses, how to move quietly thru the forest to find it, practices marksmanship for years in order to make a humane, respectful shot, spends countless hours waiting for an opportunity, and during these countless hours he sees nature as it is: a hawk landing 10 feet in front of him in all it's magesty, a beaver building its dam, a snake hunting mice, an owl attacking a squirrel...after many weeks or months or years of learning and seeing such things, he may be finally given the opportunity to make that human, respectful shot, and is given the sacred gift of harvest by nature. He holds the gift in his hands, and thanks God & Nature for this moment & this sacred gift. He labors intensely to clean the gift quickly so the meat does not spoil, he transports the heavy gift by hand, sometimes for several miles and steep hills, labors further to skin and package and freeze the meat, still taking great care to not let it spoil. One day, he defrosts a package, grinds the meat by hand to form burgers, grills it on his barbeque, sits down to dinner with his friends and family, and they, together, thank the Lord for the opportunity to enjoy the gift that nature has permitted them.


Oh L, can you think of anything that teaches greater respect, appreciation and humbleness than that?


You can't sit in a chair and watch Bambi and have ANY idea what nature is about, although Disney sure tries to make you think you do...that is a fantasy land, L.
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Old November 20, 2008, 12:54 PM   #2
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Tell him to stop bitchin with his mouth full of beef. That normally shuts them up.
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Old November 20, 2008, 01:02 PM   #3
Brian Pfleuger
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I don't have that conversation. You won't change their mind. They won't change yours. It nothing but a fight and potential for loss of friendship. If they are belligerent and insistent, I would end the friendship.
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Old November 20, 2008, 01:08 PM   #4
FrontSight
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oh, and maybe I should mention that L is woman...
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Old November 20, 2008, 01:17 PM   #5
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I assume she's a vegan...or just a major hypocrite?:barf:
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Old November 20, 2008, 01:17 PM   #6
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Here's more...

-----Original Message-----
From: Anti
To: Me

We can keep our talk to just normal stuff because you're views are fairly sickening in my world. Guns, shooting, killing, murdering - being good for CHILDREN to hunt & kill... Sorry... but, they are... think of the faces of the girls that night at dinner in Diep le skaker when they heard you were hunting... thats what most people think... Im saying think of all they were arguing with you about & the look of disguist on their faces.




-----Original Message-----
From: Me
To: Anti

L, I feel sorry for people who think that way.

People who are putting forkfuls of beef, pork, chicken & shrimp into their own mouths at the very same moment that they are looking at me with disgust for hunting...? Seems to me that I'm not the abnormal one in that situation, if you think about it.

Tell me, when you order your food, or buy food from a store, do you look for the label that says it was grown on farms that are free from killing any animals?


And I don’t agree with your calling hunting murder.
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Old November 20, 2008, 01:18 PM   #7
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XLT: No, not a Vegan by any stretch of the imagination....just warped in the head. What is wrong with these people???
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Old November 20, 2008, 01:22 PM   #8
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I have eight year old twins...by the time they turned six, they had "helped" me hunt two whitetail, field dress a red deer (they held the legs apart while I was working, no hoist to get that size of animal off the ground)...

When they were two years old, they wen to Opa's house and watched the chickens running around...and said "Meat, meat!!"....

They're terribly screwed up I'm afraid.... eight years old, and don't like beef that much...
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Old November 20, 2008, 01:36 PM   #9
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I'm with peetza. They're incorrigible. I honestly can't keep company with people that extreme. There are others who know it's best to stay away from contentious topics in order to preserve a relationship. The gender difference is only significant if you've got a reason to tell a few lies . Me, I would say: "You and the rest of the world are welcome for the backbone. You can talk to me when you get us back in full with interest for the Marshall Plan. See you then." That's about as productive as things will get.
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Old November 20, 2008, 01:37 PM   #10
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First off, I do have Anti-Gun and Anti-Hunting friends and respect their feelings. I am clear on their position and make it perfectly clear what mine is and how important it is that these issues do not get in the way of our valued friendship. If they continue to press the issue, I let it be known that it is getting in our way. I will terminate the friendship when it costs to much to support it.

As far as teaching kids, whenever they come to our station, right off I tell them that they do not have to like guns or shooting. I also tell them they don't have to hunt or shoot any animals. It's strictly their choice and not mine to make for them. Then I tell them what we are offering at this station, is a discipline and a skill and hopefull we can address their needs. What they do with this information, is strickly their choice. I have taught groups of adult women and quite few are negative toward guns and when we get through the session, they are comfortable enough to actually shoot that big, bad M/L.
I do my best to "Dehorn the Devils" !!!

Be Safe !!!
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Old November 20, 2008, 02:15 PM   #11
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They won't change your mind and you won't change theirs. Each of you can you make your case, and stop it there. As long as both of you can respect each others position or, in the very least, make them off limits for conversation, I'm sure a friendship can exist.

Otherwise, I'd find a new friend.
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Old November 20, 2008, 02:29 PM   #12
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Well, what I really mean is, it's on thing to hear of them in magazines or see them on TV, but when you know one personally, and know thew to be "normal" and then to have them say such crazy things it's shocking.

Actually, when I think about it, she's always been kind of unstable, so actually this explains a lot...
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Old November 20, 2008, 03:27 PM   #13
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You might remind her that Europe was saved from untold evil by a bunch of children who were taught to use guns. Be gentle and civilized in all your dealings with these people. They are just itching to have you prove their point. jd
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Old November 20, 2008, 03:42 PM   #14
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Just be kind. Necessity sometimes changes preference. People grow up.

Or sometimes not, as in HG Well's Time Machine story.
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Old November 20, 2008, 03:54 PM   #15
Brian Pfleuger
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Quote:
...when a friend from Europe...

There's your problem right there. Those two words together form what's known as an oxymoron.
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Old November 20, 2008, 04:36 PM   #16
FrontSight
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Last 3 posts were spot on!
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To kill something as great as a duck just to smell the gunpowder is a crime against nature. - Alan Liere
Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve. - George Bernard Shaw
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Old November 20, 2008, 05:56 PM   #17
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It's simple, you can't be a true friend to a anti so why try. Keep your friendship where it belongs and that's with folks that think like yourself instead of someone from mars or venus.
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Old November 20, 2008, 06:23 PM   #18
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I very rarely have arguments with my liberal friends that don't hunt. Perhaps because we spend more time agreeing about how horrible the current administration is.

When people do question hunting I just point out the environmental record of hunters over that of other types of out door enthusiasts. Being a hunter means (or should mean) being knowledgeable about land and animal management. Hunters are also a very important group when it comes to maintaining animal habitats and even reclaiming land for animal habitat. We frequently are involved in returning threatened animals to a healthy population. Hunters also are often closely involved in such issues as new forestry regulations, such as the recent reduction in clear cut logging.

The money I give the state for a hunting license, does more for the environment than anyone wearing a turtle suit does by marching in the streets.
The money saved by the state, by having sportsmen cull herds and reduce predator populations, instead of often having state employees do it, is a big chunk of change.

Finally no one tells me to stop hunting after they've had some venison or duck or goose.
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Old November 20, 2008, 07:24 PM   #19
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Scrap, tell the "friend" that when you hunt, you have to kill the animals in order to eat them. Trying to eat them without killing them is cruel to the animal and likely very dangerous for you as well. The same goes for trying to cook live animals. Have you ever tried to put a live deer in your oven?
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Old November 21, 2008, 05:29 AM   #20
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what country are they in?

if they are in a country that we bailed out during either of the world wars, explain in harsh terms why we were able to do that. that we understood what life and death was about, and yet we decided it was worth sending out sons over to perhaps die in the struggle to set them free.

Remind them that the only two people who have ever offered to die for them and their freedom are Jesus Christ, and the American GI. and if they don't like, consider what it would be like spending the rest of their life speaking either german or russian....being slaves to some dictators who would have felt nothing to feed them or their parents into the ovens.
'
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Old November 21, 2008, 07:30 AM   #21
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Quote:
Have you ever tried to put a live deer in your oven?
Yep, putting that live deer in the oven was a chore, for sure, but it weren't nuthin' compared to that bear!

He was an ornery one, no doubt! Mighty tasty, though.

Just tell her that you're proud, redneck self doesn't deserve the honor of her misguided company.

Some folks act and react on pure emotion, and facts mean nothing to them. Other's can be reasoned with, but most of those don't need to be; they already understand.

Trying to reason with an anti-gun/hunting individual is sorta like trying to teach a pig to sing. It'll frustrate you, and annoy the pig.

Don't get too attached to that female friend, mi amigo. She sounds like she lacks sense, and her looks ain't gonna make up for it.



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Old November 21, 2008, 08:29 AM   #22
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Quote:
What do you do when a friend from Europe tells you that you're a murderer for hunting?
Nothing, a FRIEND wouldnt have said that.
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Old November 21, 2008, 08:44 AM   #23
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So, she hires someone to kill her meat for her? You are just cutting out the middle man (and the antibiotics, and domesticated fat, and hormones, and all the crud picked up at the slaughter house.)

No wonder the cows are so mad over there. Let them eat cake.
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Old November 21, 2008, 09:09 AM   #24
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I'm not a hunter but I think you're doing a really good job with your replies.
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Old November 21, 2008, 09:56 AM   #25
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Pahoo, I know folks who are anti-gun and anti-hunting. While I may not openly comment about their views, I certainly have no respect for such ignorant opinions. 'Cause that's what it is: Ignorance, coupled with emotion. "My mind is made up; don't confuse me with facts."

Picture the scene: Four couples, enjoying steaks at a nice restaurant. I made some comment about the next day being "Deer Season Eve", and one gal got all over my case about the horrors of hunting. IOW, able to hold two opposite thoughts at the same time: Restaurant steak good, do-it-yourself venison bad.

It's all emotion based, like the gal on a National Geographic program about elephants. She believes that it were better for the elephant to become extinct than to have a controlled hunting system where the license fees help preserve the health of the species.
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